Question for the canister "haters"

[sde1500]

If you have good established husbandry then the thing a sump can offer is more room. Room to hide the heaters, a skimmer, other filtration like carbon or GFO reactors, dosing equipment, ATO, algae reactor and the likes. Speaking as someone who’s used a HOB overflow from eShopps for 5+ years now don’t be afraid. They’re not reliant on a pump so won’t lose siphon. I run 2 in a chain, 1 overflow from main to frag tank and from frag to sump.

 

[CMMorgan]

It seems that the canister haters usually use the "nitrate factory" for their argument against them.
So how do you explain the numerous threads about high nitrates even though a sump is being used? Seems like the "nitrate factory" argument is quite flawed since sumps do not appear to be the "cure" for high nitrates.

 

[Rmckoy]

Or.... you could do neither. Just sayin....

The way Berlin method was first Introduced years ago .
1.5 -2 lbs rock per gallon and a good skimmer was essentially all you needed to process nutrients and to biologically filter .

 

[Rmckoy]

If you have good established husbandry then the thing a sump can offer is more room. Room to hide the heaters, a skimmer, other filtration like carbon or GFO reactors, dosing equipment, ATO, algae reactor and the likes. Speaking as someone who’s used a HOB overflow from eShopps for 5+ years now don’t be afraid. They’re not reliant on a pump so won’t lose siphon. I run 2 in a chain, 1 overflow from main to frag tank and from frag to sump.

In addition .
They also provide more volume which in turn decreases parameter swings
Essentially .
100 ml evap from a 20 gal is more noticeable than 100 ml evap in a 120 gal

 

[CanuckReefer]

The way Berlin method was first Introduced years ago .
1.5 -2 lbs rock per gallon and a good skimmer was essentially all you needed to process nutrients and to biologically filter .

Yup, I elected to go this way about 12 or 13 years ago. Knock on wood so far so good. There was just too much going on and could never keep my param's stable before that. I have to ensure I have good flow everywhere, a workhorse cleanup crew, watch the feeding amounts carefully, and regular bi-weekly small water changes (2%)which I'd like to think keeps me clear of having to dose, and minimizes swings. It's not for everyone (I really don't keep SPS), but works for me....

 

[mindme]

It seems that the canister haters usually use the "nitrate factory" for their argument against them.
So how do you explain the numerous threads about high nitrates even though a sump is being used? Seems like the "nitrate factory" argument is quite flawed since sumps do not appear to be the "cure" for high nitrates.

This is a terrible way of looking at it and 100% a logical fallacy. A sump in itself doesn't have anything and the amount of nitrates has a lot to do with the bioload.

The reason I'll never use a canister filter again is because they are a pain in the butt to maintain. There is no room for any other equipment, it's just the one filter.

Can you put your heaters in the canister? I have 2 300 watt heaters that are like 2 feet long. A canister filter isn't going to provide room for that, or any heater. So now you've got your heaters in the display tank.

Can you run a UV filter in your canister? Not really. It doesn't remove nitrates, but it does kill algae blooms and parasiets.

Can you run a skimmer in your canister? Nope. This is a piece of equipment that does remove organics and helps with nitrates.

Can you run a refigium in your canister? Nope. This is a part of a sump that will use nitrates and reduces the amount of them.

Can you run your dosing lines into your canister? Nope.

So why in the world would I EVER want a canister filter? It doesn't provide a SINGLE thing that's superior to a sump with equipment. Even if you get a canister with more features like UV, it's probably not even a good UV light for the job etc.

Call me a "hater" if you want, but using a canister filter is a joke in comparison. I haven't even hit on all the reasons why a sump is better.

 

[stanleo]

Having had a reef tank with canisters for a few years and having a tank now with a sump, I will never have a reef with canister filters again but that is not because they are nitrate factories. As said before, they become that only when people don't maintain them. I have one for the large freshwater planted tank and it is great for that. The problem with canisters is that it is a beast to clean. Taking it apart and putting it together is my least favorite aquarium chore so I can see people not doing it as often as they should.

 

[mattm]

This is a terrible way of looking at it and 100% a logical fallacy. A sump in itself doesn't have anything and the amount of nitrates has a lot to do with the bioload.

The reason I'll never use a canister filter again is because they are a pain in the butt to maintain. There is no room for any other equipment, it's just the one filter.

Can you put your heaters in the canister? I have 2 300 watt heaters that are like 2 feet long. A canister filter isn't going to provide room for that, or any heater. So now you've got your heaters in the display tank.

Can you run a UV filter in your canister? Not really. It doesn't remove nitrates, but it does kill algae blooms and parasiets.

Can you run a skimmer in your canister? Nope. This is a piece of equipment that does remove organics and helps with nitrates.

Can you run a refigium in your canister? Nope. This is a part of a sump that will use nitrates and reduces the amount of them.

Can you run your dosing lines into your canister? Nope.

So why in the world would I EVER want a canister filter? It doesn't provide a SINGLE thing that's superior to a sump with equipment. Even if you get a canister with more features like UV, it's probably not even a good UV light for the job etc.

Call me a "hater" if you want, but using a canister filter is a joke in comparison. I haven't even hit on all the reasons why a sump is better.

Successful tanks can certainly be run without a number of those things. While there are valid concerns for using a canister, a laundry list of all of the additional items one could use, but aren’t imperative, is not one of them.

 

[Malcontent]

Canisters are DOC factories and dissolved organic carbon is far worse than nitrate.

 

[Rmckoy]

Canisters are DOC factories and dissolved organic carbon is far worse than nitrate.

Which .. if not throughly cleaned will decompose to ammonia , nitrates .....

Frequent cleaning is at most importance

 

[N.Sreefer]

This is a terrible way of looking at it and 100% a logical fallacy. A sump in itself doesn't have anything and the amount of nitrates has a lot to do with the bioload.

The reason I'll never use a canister filter again is because they are a pain in the butt to maintain. There is no room for any other equipment, it's just the one filter.

Can you put your heaters in the canister? I have 2 300 watt heaters that are like 2 feet long. A canister filter isn't going to provide room for that, or any heater. So now you've got your heaters in the display tank.

Can you run a UV filter in your canister? Not really. It doesn't remove nitrates, but it does kill algae blooms and parasiets.

Can you run a skimmer in your canister? Nope. This is a piece of equipment that does remove organics and helps with nitrates.

Can you run a refigium in your canister? Nope. This is a part of a sump that will use nitrates and reduces the amount of them.

Can you run your dosing lines into your canister? Nope.

So why in the world would I EVER want a canister filter? It doesn't provide a SINGLE thing that's superior to a sump with equipment. Even if you get a canister with more features like UV, it's probably not even a good UV light for the job etc.

Call me a "hater" if you want, but using a canister filter is a joke in comparison. I haven't even hit on all the reasons why a sump is better.

In line heater so yes you can run a heater on a canister and a in line uv. Also a canister can be used with a sump do I want to waste all that space in my sump just filling it with bio media? Id rather run both than one or the other. Its not cut and dry and to each their own. Fx6 is easy to maintain btw it has a valve on the bottom so you can back flush the filter. And auto primes itself no messing around after a power outage

 

[Hermie]

It seems that the canister haters usually use the "nitrate factory" for their argument against them.
So how do you explain the numerous threads about high nitrates even though a sump is being used? Seems like the "nitrate factory" argument is quite flawed since sumps do not appear to be the "cure" for high nitrates.

this is kind of a logical fallacy, if I can use that phrase

just because high nitrates occur in places without a canister does not prove anything about canisters, it only proves things about "not canisters"

 

[mindme]

In line heater so yes you can run a heater on a canister and a in line uv. Also a canister can be used with a sump do I want to waste all that space in my sump just filling it with bio media? Id rather run both than one or the other. Its not cut and dry and to each their own. Fx6 is easy to maintain btw it has a valve on the bottom so you can back flush the filter. And auto primes itself no messing around after a power outage

They have canisters with 600w of heaters on them? Or also in line UV's that can handle 200+ gallons?

I find this hard to believe, but technology is getting better so I don't know.

 

[mindme]

Successful tanks can certainly be run without a number of those things. While there are valid concerns for using a canister, a laundry list of all of the additional items one could use, but aren’t imperative, is not one of them.

I used a canister for a brief time. I originally had it for a 20g freshwater planted tank where I would atomize carbon dioxide off a tank in the return line before switching back to saltwater and using the tank/canister for that also.

It just doesn't compare to a sump and I just couldn't imagine wanting to do one. It's better than nothing, but if you are going to buy something, seems like there are better options out there.