Question on low nutrients but persistent nuisance algae -- future directions

[t5Nitro]

I had a question regarding low nutrients (NO3 classically always reading 0 [dosing 1-2ppm daily] and phosphate reading 0.04 by hanna ULR checker [dose about 1 ppm daily]) and the next steps I should try in my turning SPS dominant reef.

Fish load seems quite high for the size of the tank. Will be at least doubling the volume within a year. Currently medium 5" yellow and purple tangs, 2 clowns, 1 chromis, 1 sixline in the tank. 75 gallon display, maybe 60-70 gallons total water volume. The purple tang will eat a frozen cube on his own before it thaws.

I have been feeding a lot heavier lately -- 2 cubes of frozen mysis daily, some NLS pellets twice daily, some nori daily, occasionally will add in some PE mysis flakes as well (trying to use up some of the food I have on hand).

Certainly there are nutrients present in the tank, and it's loaded into the GHA/cyano. My tank is leagues better than it was a year ago (will be 2 years old this winter). Before I had green hair rocks. It isn't that way now, but it isn't spectacular, and cyano seems to be more dominant, although GHA does exist again not anywhere close to what it used to be.

The past 1 week, I have the skimmer drain line open, allowing it to drain back into the sump in attempt to get more nitrates into the water. Prior that, I had it skimming very dry to begin with, I wouldn't have to empty the skimmer cup much at all, I'm talking maybe every 3 months.

My question is this, the fish load seems high for the tank size, at least to me. Should I continue to dose nitrate and phosphate and ramp up the skimmer to skim a lot more wet? Primary goal is to not starve the coral. If I make one change at a time, I'm wondering if I should continue to feed heavily but make the skimmer do some work other than provide gas exchange.

 

[Alaeriel]

If it's a 75 gallon tank, why is the system volume 60-70 gallons? Are you topping off with RODI automatically? Also, a full tank shot may help as well.

 

[t5Nitro]

I'm just taking into consideration displacement of live rock, and a small 20 gallon sump that has maybe 10 gallons in it.

Top off with RODI, TDS 0 water with a pretty extensive RODI filtration system that I keep expanding on (the water here is quite bad).

 

[Alaeriel]

I'm just taking into consideration displacement of live rock, and a small 20 gallon sump that has maybe 10 gallons in it.

Gotcha! That makes more sense.

 

[ggNoRe]

In for advice. I'm having similar issues. Low nitrates regular phosphates. Dosing nitrates just seems to feed my red turf algae. Not dosing creates an imbalance creating an environment prone for nuisance bacteria. Seems like a lose lose situation.

 

[Sidsreef]

I had a question regarding low nutrients (NO3 classically always reading 0 [dosing 1-2ppm daily] and phosphate reading 0.04 by hanna ULR checker [dose about 1 ppm daily]) and the next steps I should try in my turning SPS dominant reef.

Fish load seems quite high for the size of the tank. Will be at least doubling the volume within a year. Currently medium 5" yellow and purple tangs, 2 clowns, 1 chromis, 1 sixline in the tank. 75 gallon display, maybe 60-70 gallons total water volume. The purple tang will eat a frozen cube on his own before it thaws.

I have been feeding a lot heavier lately -- 2 cubes of frozen mysis daily, some NLS pellets twice daily, some nori daily, occasionally will add in some PE mysis flakes as well (trying to use up some of the food I have on hand).

Certainly there are nutrients present in the tank, and it's loaded into the GHA/cyano. My tank is leagues better than it was a year ago. Before I had green hair rocks. It isn't that way now, but it isn't spectacular, and cyano seems to be more dominant, although GHA does exist again not anywhere close to what it used to be.

The past 1 week, I have the skimmer drain line open, allowing it to drain back into the sump in attempt to get more nitrates into the water. Prior that, I had it skimming very dry to begin with, I wouldn't have to empty the skimmer cup much at all, I'm talking maybe every 3 months.

My question is this, the fish load seems high for the tank size, at least to me. Should I continue to dose nitrate and phosphate and ramp up the skimmer to skim a lot more wet? Primary goal is to not starve the coral. If I make one change at a time, I'm wondering if I should continue to feed heavily but make the skimmer do some work other than provide gas exchange.

Couple of questions for you sir. i previously owned a 110G system along with a 45G system both reef.
How old is the tank?
how old is your filter material?
do you change filters out allot?
did you change anything out by removing anything or changing equipment? (if you have a established tank 2 years and older and you change something it tilts your buffer system of bacteria off)
what is your lighting situation and settings?
is there sunlight hitting your tank?

 

[t5Nitro]

How old is the tank? 21 months

how old is your filter material? Chemipure or carbon changed out first week of the month, changed monthly

do you change filters out allot? Other than GAC no other filtration outside of mechanical skimmer. RODI prefilters changed about every 3 months (usually 3 fills on my 65 gallon storage norwesco) and x2 RO membranes every 6 months. Added a chloramine monster from BRS, will probably change that at about the 1 year mark.

did you change anything out by removing anything or changing equipment? (if you have a established tank 2 years and older and you change something it tilts your buffer system of bacteria off). A small 5 gallon water change (tropic marin salt, RODI water) seems to fuel cyano blooms. Not sure if it replaces some micronutrient that was previously depleted that it takes off with. For the past 6 months or so I went to a no/limited water change system which seems to have really stabilized tank parameters. In the first year of the tank or so I had an AWC setup, which just had some drift with time in salinity and always messing with the doser for big 3 to adjust for new AWC water and how it affected parameters.

Tank has been rock steady at 1.026 (Milwaukee), 430, 7.1, Mg off the charts (all for reef, really high Mg levels) with hardly any drift in numbers at all. Nutrients as above in post 1.

what is your lighting situation and settings? 8 bulb ATI T5 fixture, 11 inches off the water. Currently 4 blue plus, 1 purple plus, 1 aquablue special, 2 coral plus. Bulbs changed two at a time about every 6 months.

Photoperiod:

Total photoperiod 12 hours with the OR3 starting and ending the day with an hour on each side. Within that range. There are 10 hours of 6 bulbs and 8 of those hours are full 8 bulb.

is there sunlight hitting your tank? None with strategically placed curtain.


I'll get a tank shot in here when the lights are more on today. Now that the tank is more stable, and older, was looking to see what I should change if anything.

 

[t5Nitro]

Here we go.

 

[JohnMzreef]

Doesn't look that bad to me.. I guess you are trying to go "next level"?
Personally, I live with a little bit of cyano and have seen some youtube videos of esteemed reefers who say they do the same.
I'm not sure my reef looks any better but I think you might shorten your photoperiod a bit. Maybe use a bacterial product such as mb7.
You might put your skimmer on a timer and get your phosphate up a bit.
Maybe cut back on chemical filtration.
...my 2 cents

 

[Sidsreef]

Here we go.

Well, your doing everything right. make sure the whites come down a little bit but they seem fine. i would defiantly come down from feeding. IF you're ok with dosing. i would defiantly dose Vibrant. i had a horrible hair algae problem and used vibrant and it cured my algae problem in 6 weeks haven't seen it again. there's a video on BRS on youtube and they used vibrant with every type of algae and it destroyed it all without hurting the corals or fish or inverts. i found myself doing better with algae the less i did with food and light down the road. anyways good luck man cant wait to see what works.

 

[t5Nitro]

Alright! Sound good guys, thought I'd ask as it seemed like I had a cyano storm going on. Hard to capture it on camera, changed bumped the shadows in the phone setting here. Doesnt affect coral growth at all. Wasnt sure though if I was in some vicious cycle having to dose to make sure the corals have nutrition but also feeding this crazy stuff, if it was able to be avoided.

 

[JohnMzreef]

Ah, I guess I see the cyano now. Hard to tell in the pics but yea its all over right? Turkey baste and try to encourage coralline algae growth. I don't think vibrant will help with cyano - probably the opposite. (It is definitely awesome for green algaes though). Get your lighting and flow dialed in.

 

[lemonade]

You're doing too much, imo. If it were me I'd take out all filtration/chemicals and just leave the skimmer. Do small consistent WC and keep up with normal feedings and you will see an improvement. You could probably get away with a few days lights off to kill off a bunch of that red slime, but I would only do that after you've taken out all your filtration material.

 

[ninjamyst]

I am confused. Are you having a low nutrient issue or too much nutrients??

You say you have GHA and cyano problem but you also feeding super heavy and dumping skimmate back into the tank.

Are you trying to remove GHA and cyano or trying to increase nitrate / phosphate level?

 

[t5Nitro]

I thought maybe I wasn't doing enough. I quite performing WC several months back, skimmer is set to very dry and really just GAC for filtration.

Ninjamyst, I had presumed nutrients were high because of cyano/some GHA remaining but falsely low on testing. Then I dose 1-2ppm daily nitrate and 1ppm daily phosphate just to feel like I'm helping the coral out if they're being starved. Not sure it helps, maybe cyano is a lot better at taking up those additives than the corals are and maybe it isn't feeding them at all.

 

[Pistondog]

I had a question regarding low nutrients (NO3 classically always reading 0 [dosing 1-2ppm daily] and phosphate reading 0.04 by hanna ULR checker [dose about 1 ppm daily]) and the next steps I should try in my turning SPS dominant reef.

Fish load seems quite high for the size of the tank. Will be at least doubling the volume within a year. Currently medium 5" yellow and purple tangs, 2 clowns, 1 chromis, 1 sixline in the tank. 75 gallon display, maybe 60-70 gallons total water volume. The purple tang will eat a frozen cube on his own before it thaws.

I have been feeding a lot heavier lately -- 2 cubes of frozen mysis daily, some NLS pellets twice daily, some nori daily, occasionally will add in some PE mysis flakes as well (trying to use up some of the food I have on hand).

Certainly there are nutrients present in the tank, and it's loaded into the GHA/cyano. My tank is leagues better than it was a year ago (will be 2 years old this winter). Before I had green hair rocks. It isn't that way now, but it isn't spectacular, and cyano seems to be more dominant, although GHA does exist again not anywhere close to what it used to be.

The past 1 week, I have the skimmer drain line open, allowing it to drain back into the sump in attempt to get more nitrates into the water. Prior that, I had it skimming very dry to begin with, I wouldn't have to empty the skimmer cup much at all, I'm talking maybe every 3 months.

My question is this, the fish load seems high for the tank size, at least to me. Should I continue to dose nitrate and phosphate and ramp up the skimmer to skim a lot more wet? Primary goal is to not starve the coral. If I make one change at a time, I'm wondering if I should continue to feed heavily but make the skimmer do some work other than provide gas exchange.

No need to dose nutrients. Add some mb7 weekly to try to outcompete the cyano. Get an urchin or blenny for the gha.
Do you run a refugium in the sump?

 

[t5Nitro]

No, the sump is a terrible design, ruby cube 20. Went with it for convenience in saving space, but there's zero room for a fuge. Was going to try to drill my old trigger 5 gallon ATO container to add a few bulkheads and use that as a fuge. It's something around 6" wide, 15" tall and depth.

 

[ninjamyst]

If you have algae issue, why are you dosing nutrients to make the algae issue worse? Take care of your algae issue first. Dosing nutrient is counterproductive.