Quick copper question

[jlancas81]

I am currently using cuprion in a 40 breeder and have done 8 drops last 3 nights (trying to go slow), but still measuring below .10 on Salifert test kit. I feel like it should be at .10 by now? Any help appreciated

 

[Humblefish]

Anything in the QT which might be absorbing the copper? Rock, sand?

Due to it's low therapeutic range, it would be better to use a "professional grade" test kit for measuring Cuprion: https://www.chemetrics.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=392

 

[jlancas81]

Yeah, nothing but pvc, filters (1 is a bio wheel and one aquaclear) and heaters. I knew I should have just got an easier copper, but it was part of a bigger BRS order. Thanks Humble

 

[jlancas81]

Humble, another question. If I where to switch out to cupramine at this point, should I do enough water changes to get cuprion out of the system? They are same type of copper, just different concentrate?

 

[Humblefish]

Humble, another question. If I where to switch out to cupramine at this point, should I do enough water changes to get cuprion out of the system? They are same type of copper, just different concentrate?

They are both copper sulfate based, but probably utilize different stabilizing agents. Honestly, if you're gonna make a switch I would go with a chelated product like Coppersafe or Copper Power.

 

[4FordFamily]

They are both copper sulfate based, but probably utilize different stabilizing agents. Honestly, if you're gonna make a switch I would go with a chelated product like Coppersafe or Copper Power.

X2

 

[jlancas81]

Thank you both...so, is that kordon copper stuff the same as what you are talking about? Sorry for asking dumb questions, but did a search and could not really find a good answer

 

[melypr1985]

I think kordon does Copper Aid which I've read some people have had lots of issues with. I also recommend Coppersafe or Copper Power

 

[Humblefish]

Thank you both...so, is that kordon copper stuff the same as what you are talking about? Sorry for asking dumb questions, but did a search and could not really find a good answer

Kordon makes Copper-Aid, which is another chelated copper product. But based upon anecdotal accounts of people who have used it, Copper-Aid appears to be a very "watered down" product.

 

[jlancas81]

Good to know...thanks again!

 

[mcarroll]

[...]it would be better to use a "professional grade" test kit for measuring Cuprion: https://www.chemetrics.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=392

That's a nice-looking kit!

Have you used Hach's colorimeter? If so (and leaving the price differential aside) do you like this "analog" kit better?

They are both copper sulfate based, but probably utilize different stabilizing agents. Honestly, if you're gonna make a switch I would go with a chelated product like Coppersafe or Copper Power.

I think kordon does Copper Aid which I've read some people have had lots of issues with. I also recommend Coppersafe or Copper Power

Kordon makes Copper-Aid, which is another chelated copper product. But based upon anecdotal accounts of people who have used it, Copper-Aid appears to be a very "watered down" product.

Can one or more of you elaborate on why the chelated products get your nod? I think I've seen advice to the contrary before (not sure where), but "why" is still the question. Seems like it might depend on use-case?

Thanks for any feedback.

 

[melypr1985]

Can one or more of you elaborate on why the chelated products get your nod? I think I've seen advice to the contrary before (not sure where), but "why" is still the question. Seems like it might depend on use-case?

Thanks for any feedback.

The chelated products have a wider therapeutic range and (i think) is easier to test for. It also seems to be a bit easier on the fish. I've done better with keeping all kinds of fish in chelated copper than the ionic counterpart. I've used both in our commercial system for long periods and have had less loss after switching to chelated.

 

[Humblefish]

^^ What she said; although admittedly I'm more of a "CP guy" nowadays. But for 30 years before that, I used Coppersafe with great success. Including in two different commercial settings, QT-ing fish in mass. I tried Cupramine for around 5 years, but found it harder to read and would suffer unexplained losses while using it. So, I said heck with the hype and went back to using what worked (Coppersafe).

I've used the Hach (way back when) but never the Chemetrics. However, enough public aquariums & LFS I advise do use it and it comes highly recommended. I've always been an API copper test kit guy all the way and don't understand everyone's complaints about it. Besides all I need to do is taste the water, and I can tell you what the Cu level is within .001 ppm.

 

[jlancas81]

Ok, one more for you guys. I finally tracked down coppersafe and ready to role. Question is, how many 30%-50% water changes should I do before I can assume there is no more of the other stuff. I put enough in to get to therapeutic levels, but obviously had issues getting it to show on test, so that's out. Unless I do a 100% water change, it only dilutes it. Seems like carbon dating and will never reach 0 lol. But what is safe?

 

[melypr1985]

Ok, one more for you guys. I finally tracked down coppersafe and ready to role. Question is, how many 30%-50% water changes should I do before I can assume there is no more of the other stuff. I put enough in to get to therapeutic levels, but obviously had issues getting it to show on test, so that's out. Unless I do a 100% water change, it only dilutes it. Seems like carbon dating and will never reach 0 lol. But what is safe?

I would do a couple large water changes (50% +) and run carbon for 24 hours minimum, then start the new copper.

 

[jlancas81]

Thanks mel, that was my line of thought. Just like some input from the pros