Ready to throw in the towel from Dinos

[brandon429]

inexpensive, many hundreds reported battles won w vibrant, your tank is not loaded with detritus so tradeoff cyano isnt likely/do consider it yes nice teamwork options

 

[Alexreefer]

Well, what are your phosphates?

As I mentioned earlier, I used Vibrant, copepods, and phytoplankton to try to outcompete the Dino's. My nutrients were much lower than your NO3.

What I forgot to mention was that I thoroughly cleaned my sand as @brandon429 is suggesting. Something is feeding the Dino's, and there isn't anything outcompeting them.

I would try to rid my tank of all detritus before using anything else.

Checked with hanna ulr it came in at .90!
Did a sand rinse 4 months ago, might do it again. But if the problem is coming from the sand wont the dinos return if I put the sand back? Think a 16oz of vibrant will last me enough for a 75?

 

[Bret Brinkmann]

A few thoughts. If it's amphidinium, it's the hardest of the dino species to eradicate IMO since it doesn't go in to the water column at night and is therefor not responsive to UV...

#3 dosing silicates to increase diatoms seems to help most species.

#4 This only my thought not the predominant theory but dosing beneficial bacteria helped me tremendously with amphidinium. Whether it's Dr Tim's Wasteaway, Vibrant, Microbacter 7, etc. It seems to help...

You mentioned that you were trying Dino X. How has the response been so far? If it doesn't work, then I recommend MicroBactor 7 and Si dosing to get diatoms blooming. One of the biological byproducts of diatoms is polyunsaturated aldehydes, PAUs, which are toxic to dinos. Thus why reefers will instigate a diatom bloom during a dino outbreak.

Given that amphidinium loves the sand, that suggests they are going after the bacteria that live there. So dosing bacteria to compete would explain why some people are able to beat it that way. You may just need to dose the right kind of bacteria. It sounds like Vibrant didn't work, so maybe another culture from another brand will.

Just a small 24w green killing machine.
UV 118%
Violet 115%
Royal 49%
Blue 38% evrything else is 0%

Your UV should be enough but as stated above UV has proven to be ineffective against amphidinium.

Maybe I'm just not familiar with your lights, but how do you get over 100% from the UV and violet?

Could you explain further on sand test?

I thought he was saying the sand was removed, the dinos appeared to go away, he put some back in to see if the dinos would return and there was no sign of them blooming on the readded sand. Some people have to remove their sand to get rid of amphidinium and can't put it back in for several months without a relapse.

 

[Alexreefer]

You mentioned that you were trying Dino X. How has the response been so far? If it doesn't work, then I recommend MicroBactor 7 and Si dosing to get diatoms blooming. One of the biological byproducts of diatoms is polyunsaturated aldehydes, PAUs, which are toxic to dinos. Thus why reefers will instigate a diatom bloom during a dino outbreak.

Given that amphidinium loves the sand, that suggests they are going after the bacteria that live there. So dosing bacteria to compete would explain why some people are able to beat it that way. You may just need to dose the right kind of bacteria. It sounds like Vibrant didn't work, so maybe another culture from another brand will.



Your UV should be enough but as stated above UV has proven to be ineffective against amphidinium.

Maybe I'm just not familiar with your lights, but how do you get over 100% from the UV and violet?



I thought he was saying the sand was removed, the dinos appeared to go away, he put some back in to see if the dinos would return and there was no sign of them blooming on the readded sand. Some people have to remove their sand to get rid of amphidinium and can't put it back in for several months without a relapse.

So about to add the second dose of dino x, Dosent seem dinos are going away but doesnt look worse also.

I have the Ai primes HD which I can use the power not used and chancel it into other light colors. So as Im not using white channel I can use that extra power and add it to another color such as violet

Not wanting to remove sand due to aesthetics and my wrasse

 

[Alexreefer]

Did you read my thread? I was dosing 50ml a day of Vibrant to knock it out!

I thought the directions said 1 ml per 10 gal every week or every 2 depending on tank. Why did you dose every day?

 

[Entz]

Could you explain further on sand test?

The small cells I had were all over the sand but way worse in a couple of spots (back corners). If I vacuumed the sand, they would also be back there covering it within a day. Most likely because this was undisturbed (Goby got a lot of others) and a natural place for detritus to collect.

Anyways, after I removed the sand, and waited a few months. I tested to see if they would come back by putting sand in the back corners where they were the worst before. Nothing appeared. Nothing has for over a month.

I really do need to take another same with the scope to know for sure or see if they are in other biomass (algae on glass for example) but they seem to be gone...

 

[Alexreefer]

The small cells I had were all over the sand but way worse in a couple of spots (back corners). If I vacuumed the sand, they would also be back there covering it within a day. Most likely because this was undisturbed (Goby got a lot of others) and a natural place for detritus to collect.

Anyways, after I removed the sand, and waited a few months. I tested to see if they would come back by putting sand in the back corners where they were the worst before. Nothing appeared. Nothing has for over a month.

I really do need to take another same with the scope to know for sure or see if they are in other biomass (algae on glass for example) but they seem to be gone...

gotcha if I take sand out will keep that in mind

 

[Alexreefer]

As im dosing dino x I notice long lines of clean glass. My 2 urchins are doing work! An entire side pane of glass is dino free, Also now I can see how long it takes to grow back. Would you guys also recommend me carbon dosing (vinegar) to get nutrients down?

 

[Grigs]

I am currently in the second bout of using Dr Tim's regimen found here: https://s3.amazonaws.com/brsinstructions/brsDrTims/DrTims_Dinoflagellate_Recipe_BRS.pdf

On the first go round the dinos moved to my sump, so they reappeared in the tank a couple of weeks later. I did a second blackout and am dosing WasteAway currently on day 4 and have had great results so far. I have ostreopsis, which may be much easier to rid oneself of, but Dr Tims is cheap enough on Amazon if you check the pricing for different sizes...

Good luck!

 

[Alexreefer]

Just preformed a very small wc. Changed socks, cleaned skimmer and prepared my carbon reactor for some rox.8 carbon. Just small things. Should I be doing water changes?

 

[KTTX]

Try 3 day blackout using dr Tim's refresh. Then waste away after 3 days.

Recipes - DrTim's Aquatics

DrTims_Fishless_Cycling_Recipe_6Apr18 Fishless Cycling with Ammonia Drops and Open & Only Live Nitrify Bacteria DrTims_Treat_Cyano_Recipe_6Apr18 Get rid of Cyano with ReFresh and WasteAway DrTims_ColorUp_Corals_Recipe_6Apr18 Coral-Up Your Corals with First Defense and Eco-Balance...

www.drtimsaquatics.com

On this site go down to dino recipe...

 

[aquadog]

So I really like saltwater tanks, but there are some things that I definitely hate about them. And dinos are definitely one of them! Just say'n.

 

[A-dawg]

I believe as someone stated that dosing bacteria while doing the basics is what most people are missing. Adding the good layer while removing the bad. I’ve had good luck with MicroBacter CLEAN. it’s similar to 7 but it adds enzymes and bacteria that activity will target the bad stuff like dinos and cyano. I saw a video by reefdudes and he had a guy on one of his videos and he developed a 8 day program he said works better then anything after 1-3 cycles. I’m gonna post it.

 

[A-dawg]

What this video. It’s a 8 day program that basically uses a combo of things from carbon dosing, adding bacteria, h202 etc but they give exact doses and parameters for things even like c02


He interviews the guy who came up with it and he explained everything

 

[cgeorgianni]

So I’ve been in your shoes. Watching everything get covered with brown slime. All these people are trying to help you but honestly answering their questions aren't going to help you. You need to attack this with bacteria and a 3 day (minimum) black out period. That means you go get youself a 16 ounce bottle of Dr. Tim’s waste away, a 16 oz bottle of renew (marine version), a newspaper, a roll of scotch tape and a half inch siphon tube. Use the tube to remove as much Dino you can. Stir the sand bed as much as possible. Replace the tainted water with fresh mixed salt water. Next cover the entire tank with the newspaper (use the scotch tape). Now turn off your lights for 3 days (if you have corals don’t worry they will be fine). Read the directions on the waste away bottle then read them again. Next find someone else to read the directions and in tour own words describe your interpretation of the directions you read. Make sure the other person agrees with your interpretation. Dose the waste away for 2 days and the renew days 3 and 4. If you follow these directions you will have a very high success rate of beating this. If you pm me your email I can forward you an email that Dr. Tim wrote to me with the directions. I am so impressed with his products I now intermittently dose waste away when I was feel like my bacteria colonies need a boost. I wish you the best of luck.

 

[Heabel7]

So much good advice here from all. Every method mentioned above generally has a certain degree of noticeable impact on Dino’s. BUT doing a 3 day complete blackout can kill corals. I’m sure it depends on overall health. I lost 2 mini colonies (encrusted past frag stag) while doing a complete 3 day black out. In addition, many of my sps lost A LOT of color. All softies didn’t skip a beat.

 

[dwest]

What worked for me was essentially post #7 from @saltyhog. In addition, I removed my sand bed. Yes, aesthetically it was strange for a while but I eventually got used to it. Plus that is when my major turning point began for the better. I would also keep running UV as most of us have more than one type of dino.

 

[brandon429]

A blackout requires ramp up lighting, we don't go from dark to full production lighting instantly and if we do bleaching is likely

Blackout means ramp up lights over the next week for safety. Proud to see teamwork here and Alex continuing his dedication to get ideas for action

I think we're going on five mos of work, hasn't given up. Earns commitment acknowledgement

 

[Bret Brinkmann]

So about to add the second dose of dino x, Dosent seem dinos are going away but doesnt look worse also.

I have the Ai primes HD which I can use the power not used and chancel it into other light colors. So as Im not using white channel I can use that extra power and add it to another color such as violet

Not wanting to remove sand due to aesthetics and my wrasse

You getting a ton of info and recomendations here which I imagine is overwhelming. It's never a good idea to listen to everyone. It is a good idea to listen to someone, especially if they have first hand experience with your situation and their tank is what you want yours to be like some day. While I don't recommend Dino X, I do encourage you to give it a fair shot and see your current treatment through. A bunch of half worked through solutions never worked for me. With that said, here some more info to chew on should Dino X not work and you want to try something else.

Thanks for the light explanation. It's my understanding that AI lights can have some pretty high PAR when the intensity is turned up. While it is all on the blue side, it's still going to affect the dinos. If you are reluctant to do a blackout, then I recommend decreasing the intensity by half and see if that makes a difference over the course of a week or two.

I thought the directions said 1 ml per 10 gal every week or every 2 depending on tank. Why did you dose every day?

He over dosed because F dinos! ;Punch I guess he wanted to try an extreme situation and it worked for him.

As im dosing dino x I notice long lines of clean glass. My 2 urchins are doing work! An entire side pane of glass is dino free, Also now I can see how long it takes to grow back. Would you guys also recommend me carbon dosing (vinegar) to get nutrients down?

I do not recommend dosing carbon to lower nutrients because bottoming out nutrients is how you get dinos in the first place.

I am currently in the second bout of using Dr Tim's regimen found here: https://s3.amazonaws.com/brsinstructions/brsDrTims/DrTims_Dinoflagellate_Recipe_BRS.pdf

On the first go round the dinos moved to my sump, so they reappeared in the tank a couple of weeks later. I did a second blackout and am dosing WasteAway currently on day 4 and have had great results so far. I have ostreopsis, which may be much easier to rid oneself of, but Dr Tims is cheap enough on Amazon if you check the pricing for different sizes...

Good luck!

Amphidinium do seem to respond to bacteria dosing. I do recommend a sand cleaning and dosing per the bottle instructions.

Just preformed a very small wc. Changed socks, cleaned skimmer and prepared my carbon reactor for some rox.8 carbon. Just small things. Should I be doing water changes?

Water changes tend to make dino blooms slightly, but noticeably worse. I don't recommend it. But you will need to replenish water that was removed from a sand cleaning.

 

[Alexreefer]

You getting a ton of info and recomendations here which I imagine is overwhelming. It's never a good idea to listen to everyone. It is a good idea to listen to someone, especially if they have first hand experience with your situation and their tank is what you want yours to be like some day. While I don't recommend Dino X, I do encourage you to give it a fair shot and see your current treatment through. A bunch of half worked through solutions never worked for me. With that said, here some more info to chew on should Dino X not work and you want to try something else.

Thanks for the light explanation. It's my understanding that AI lights can have some pretty high PAR when the intensity is turned up. While it is all on the blue side, it's still going to affect the dinos. If you are reluctant to do a blackout, then I recommend decreasing the intensity by half and see if that makes a difference over the course of a week or two.



He over dosed because F dinos! ;Punch I guess he wanted to try an extreme situation and it worked for him.



I do not recommend dosing carbon to lower nutrients because bottoming out nutrients is how you get dinos in the first place.



Amphidinium do seem to respond to bacteria dosing. I do recommend a sand cleaning and dosing per the bottle instructions.



Water changes tend to make dino blooms slightly, but noticeably worse. I don't recommend it. But you will need to replenish water that was removed from a sand cleaning.

Thanks for the help, Will continue my Dino X till the 30 day mark even if it doesn't seem to work. postponed wc for now and will continue to update the thread.