Red Sea Peninsula Drain Issue !

[Jackooze]

I have a 2-year old (ish) Red Sea 750xxl with the original gate valve and thus far it's been stellar. I do have to occasionally adjust it if I find the water level in the overflow drops too much, but this is only something I need to review periodically (ie: every other month or so).

Yeah it hard to believe it’s the gate valve. Im not to sure myself that’s what’s causing the issue but I don’t know what else. It’s coming Monday and I’m crossing my fingers.

 

[blaxsun]

Yeah it hard to believe it’s the gate valve. Im not to sure myself that’s what’s causing the issue but I don’t know what else. It’s coming Monday and I’m crossing my fingers.

The only way to verify it would be to run it without the gate valve. Other than being a lengthy overflow run, I can't see anything unusual (you don't have any 90° bends and the one 45° you do have is very gradual).

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

The only way to verify it would be to run it without the gate valve. Other than being a lengthy overflow run, I can't see anything unusual (you don't have any 90° bends and the one 45° you do have is very gradual).

They're sending me a new gate valve and I'm in the G2 series. I heard the G1 was even worse.

I honestly have no idea what's causing it other than the gate valve. There is nothing else that could be causing it. When you open the valve the water comes back fine.

Like today, I turned it all off to feed the fish and corals. Turned everything back on and the pump started sucking dry air. Resit if the system had water, just not the return section. Craziest thing I've ever seen. Open return valve and problem solved.

 

[blaxsun]

They're sending me a new gate valve and I'm in the G2 series. I heard the G1 was even worse.

I honestly have no idea what's causing it other than the gate valve. There is nothing else that could be causing it. When you open the valve the water comes back fine.

Like today, I turned it all off to feed the fish and corals. Turned everything back on and the pump started sucking dry air. Resit if the system had water, just not the return section. Craziest thing I've ever seen. Open return valve and problem solved.

Q: When you say "turned it all off", do you mean the pumps? If so, I might have an idea.

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

Q: When you say "turned it all off", do you mean the pumps? If so, I might have an idea.

Yeah so when I feed, the following is what is turned off in this order.

Carbon Reactor - In sump
UV
Inkbird - heaters
Skimmer - In sump
Return Pump
Then the 4 Nero 7 - in tank

Then when I start it back up, this is the order

Return pump - I wait until the water is going in the overflow and is pushing water from the display to the sump.
UV
Nero 7s

I wait until the water has stabilized and turn on:

Inkbird
Skimmer
Carbon Reactor

 

[Jackooze]

The only way to verify it would be to run it without the gate valve. Other than being a lengthy overflow run, I can't see anything unusual (you don't have any 90° bends and the one 45° you do have is very gradual).

I have 2 90 degree and one 45 degree bend in the main drain line.

 

[Jackooze]

Yeah so when I feed, the following is what is turned off in this order.

Carbon Reactor - In sump
UV
Inkbird - heaters
Skimmer - In sump
Return Pump
Then the 4 Nero 7 - in tank

Then when I start it back up, this is the order

Return pump - I wait until the water is going in the overflow and is pushing water from the display to the sump.
UV
Nero 7s

I wait until the water has stabilized and turn on:

Inkbird
Skimmer
Carbon Reactor

I had same issue so I stopped using feed mode. After feed mode is complete you need to give it time to re adjust before the noise stops.

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

I had same issue so I stopped using feed mode. After feed mode is complete you need to give it time to re adjust before the noise stops.

Well I actually don't use feed mode, it's just programmed in case I needed it.

I shut everything off manually and then turn it back on manually. I could see feed mode causing an issue if it was all turned back on at once. It shouldn't cause the particular issue we are having though. Regardless the water should stabilize.

 

[blaxsun]

I'm thinking the longer pipe run may have something to do with the sump going dry after you turn any pumps off. I would probably setup a 5-10 minute delay on the skimmer. I'm not sure if the UV is integrated with your return pump or runs on a separate pump/loop?

 

[Jackooze]

I'm thinking the longer pipe run may have something to do with the sump going dry after you turn any pumps off. I would probably setup a 5-10 minute delay on the skimmer. I'm not sure if the UV is integrated with your return pump or runs on a separate pump/loop?

So you’re suggesting to turn everything off and when Turing the return pump back on leave the skimmer off ? The UV light is runs on a separate ecotech m1 pump.

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

I'm thinking the longer pipe run may have something to do with the sump going dry after you turn any pumps off. I would probably setup a 5-10 minute delay on the skimmer. I'm not sure if the UV is integrated with your return pump or runs on a separate pump/loop?

Sorry @Jackooze Ill step out of this thread unless I have something that might help you. Didn't mean to derail it.

 

[blaxsun]

So you’re suggesting to turn everything off and when Turing the return pump back on leave the skimmer off ? The UV light is runs on a separate ecotech m1 pump.

Yes, I'd leave the skimmer off for at least 10-minutes (especially with the length of your piping). Is the UV integrated into the return pipes or does it run on a separate loop, ie: pulling from one sump chamber and depositing in another? Any reactors or just the return pump, skimmer and UV pump?

 

[Jackooze]

Yes, I'd leave the skimmer off for at least 10-minutes (especially with the length of your piping). Is the UV integrated into the return pipes or does it run on a separate loop, ie: pulling from one sump chamber and depositing in another? Any reactors or just the return pump, skimmer and UV pump?

The UV is running in a separate loop. Pulling from the same chamber as the return pump and flowing to the refugium section of the sump. Just return, skimmer, UV. At first I thought there was something wrong with the fleece filter but I pretty sure it’s not it.

 

[blaxsun]

The UV is running in a separate loop. Pulling from the same chamber as the return pump and flowing to the refugium section of the sump. Just return, skimmer, UV. At first I thought there was something wrong with the fleece filter but I pretty sure it’s not it.

You probably want to pull from right after the fleece roller and deposit into the return chamber. That's one reason you're having issues in the return chamber.

 

[Clarkjw2002]

Just a thought on the overflow plumbing: it might be the braided tubing causing the problem.

I ran an overflow with this tubing once and I could never achieve a full siphon with it. The slightest uphill in the run (like your initial run up over the stand wall maybe) would trap air and prevent a full siphon. Was only ever able to achieve about half the flow the overflow was designed for.

No matter how I tried to eliminate it I could not fix. If you are not going straight vertical with the tubing you should hard plumb. Then use the tubing for the straight run down to the sump.

Can't tell from your pics if this is the issue but if you shine a light on the tube and examine closely you should be able to see the air trapped in the upper part of the tube==probably in the portion laying on the stand floor if it is there.

 

[Jackooze]

You probably want to pull from right after the fleece roller and deposit into the return chamber. That's one reason you're having issues in the return chamber.

I am going to try that if replacing the gate valve doesn’t do the trick. It’s just weird I’ve had this setup for three years now and never had an issue.

 

[Jackooze]

Just a thought on the overflow plumbing: it might be the braided tubing causing the problem.

I ran an overflow with this tubing once and I could never achieve a full siphon with it. The slightest uphill in the run (like your initial run up over the stand wall maybe) would trap air and prevent a full siphon. Was only ever able to achieve about half the flow the overflow was designed for.

No matter how I tried to eliminate it I could not fix. If you are not going straight vertical with the tubing you should hard plumb. Then use the tubing for the straight run down to the sump.

Can't tell from your pics if this is the issue but if you shine a light on the tube and examine closely you should be able to see the air trapped in the upper part of the tube==probably in the portion laying on the stand floor if it is there.

I would agree with you if this was a new problem but I’ve had this setup for three years now without any issue. So something happened recently.

 

[dmsc2fs]

I had the same problem, same symptoms. Interestingly enough, the same fleece roller. I struggled with it for some time trying to figure the issue out. I took the valve apart a dozen times just like you did. I ran a snake down the drains, I was able to blow water and air through the lines. Nothing helped. Finally I decided I had to tear the entire run out. What I found was a snail had made it into the line. In some strange vudu-snail-magic whenever the drain had enough pressure from flow it would push the shell against a barb fitting and block the flow. When the flow stopped it would fall out of the way.

 

[Jackooze]

I had the same problem, same symptoms. Interestingly enough, the same fleece roller. I struggled with it for some time trying to figure the issue out. I took the valve apart a dozen times just like you did. I ran a snake down the drains, I was able to blow water and air through the lines. Nothing helped. Finally I decided I had to tear the entire run out. What I found was a snail had made it into the line. In some strange vudu-snail-magic whenever the drain had enough pressure from flow it would push the shell against a barb fitting and block the flow. When the flow stopped it would fall out of the way.

Oh man that’s frustrating !!! I really hope it doesn’t come to that. I think once the valve comes it on Monday if that doesn’t fix the issue I think I won’t have a choice but take everything apart. My wife is going to kill me if the gurgling noise doesn’t stop soon.

 

[Jackooze]

So I replaced the spears gate valve and the same issue. I guess I have to tear down the entire main drain line and figure out the next step.