Redesign/Critique my Sump

[Biglurr54]

So I am currently embarking on redesigning my sump. My current issue are:
1. I get micro bubbles in my return line unless I fill my sump up to a height that will effect the skimmer chamber.

2. When I turn off my return pump, the sump fills with water from the siphon. If I keep the skimmer on it will overflow quickly. If I turn both off, when I turn them back on, the skimmer overflows until the return fills the tank.

3. My filter sock area is less then desirable.

4. My ATS is fed from the overflow. This is great but the failsafe overflow off of it which carries half the water is extremely loud.



Goals:

1. A quiet sump. Not silent but quiet enough that you can sit next to the tank and watch tv.

2. No micro bubbles

3. Skimmer chamber that will remain consistent with or without return pump on.

4. Feed ATS from main return pump.

5. Have a better system for filter socks.

6. Make the sump so it can be transitioned to my new tank (120 gallons) when I get it in the fall.



Heres my plan so far. Tear it apart. Give me advice and criticism. I have thick skin I can take it.



The sump is a 20 gallon normal dimension tank. Baffles will be glass siliconed in place.

Chamber 1: all overflow will go directly into this chamber. The chamber will be 10 inches wide and 11 inches tall. I will have a 8x8x4 marinepure block at the bottom, my SWC 160 Skimmer on top of the block. This puts me at 7inches of water for the Skimmer. This chamber will also house my heater.

Chamber 2: The water will go over an 11 inch baffle, separating the Skimmer chamber and filter sock chamber, and onto an acrylic try that will hold 1 4 inch filter sock in it. I will keep a carbon bag in the filter sock. The filter sock will be changed 2x a week and the carbon once a month. The water will travel down through the filter sock and under a baffle. There will be a 4 inch difference from the skimmer level to the water level in the filter sock chamber. I may install the first baffle at an angle to keep the water from falling.

Bubble trap: The bubble trap will be an under over under trap. The first under will be the under from the sock filter. It will then go over a baffle set at 7 inches. This will create the 4 inch drop from the skimmer baffle through the filter sock. The water will then go under a baffle and enter the return chamber.

Chamber 3: This will the return chamber and it will be a 2 inch drop from the 7 inch filter sock chamber. This chamber will be 5 inches wide and house ATO floats. The ATS will sit above the return chamber and tee off the return pump. The overflow from the ATS will go into the return chamber. (This may get redesigned to go into the bubble tap if I get bubbles from the ATS overflow. I want the pods from the ATS to get sent up into the tank and not into the filter sock.

I will run about 600GPH through the sump to match my skimmer flow. My ATS will have about 250 gph through it.

It will start life on my current heavily stocked 60 cube and then transition to a 120 gallon build I’m doing.

 

[CodyRVA]

My thoughts:

1. A quiet sump. Not silent but quiet enough that you can sit next to the tank and watch tv.
- I recommend a full siphon, if installed properly, you should be able to fine tune the flow from your overflow to the sump making it very quiet.

2. No micro bubbles
- Build a bubble trap into your sump. Also, i've noticed with my gate valve (full siphon) if I don't have it tuned properly not only do I get noise, but I get micro bubbles in my first chamber. Not an issue because I have two bubble traps, but still... this may be apart of your first problem and can be resolved with well placed bubble traps and a full siphon.

3. Skimmer chamber that will remain consistent with or without return pump on.
- Get some of these on your return line(s): Georg Fisher Wye Check Valve. I will say I have one on each of my return lines, they work, but I had my return loc lines pointing straight down into the display and it still did back siphon when the return pump shut off. I now run my loc line returns parallel to the water and have no issues. Oh and setting your skimmer on marine pure is a bad idea, the stuff is very brittle, even a DC skimmer will wear the marine pure IMO. I would use egg crate and PVC to provide adequate water depth as indicated by the skimmer specs.

4. Feed ATS from main return pump.
- Simple plumbing upgrade, branch off your return pump and route the water accordingly

5. Have a better system for filter socks.
- Not sure what you mean by this... I run my socks in the first chamber of my sump to remove particles before entering my skimmer and fuge.

6. Make the sump so it can be transitioned to my new tank (120 gallons) when I get it in the fall.
- This is only a 20G sump, far too small to be transitioned to a 120G display IMO. I would go no less than a 40G, but likely more. The skimmer you'll need for a 120G system is going to eat up the majority of the space in a 20G sump.

I modeled my sump design from David over at Vivid Aquariums, it's a good setup IMO, been working well for me. Hope this helps!

 

[Biglurr54]

CodyRVA

1: I have a durso overflow right now. It is quiet enough for my purposes. My halibe fans are louder than the overflow. The issue that I have is my ATS takes ½ the flow and the other ½ of the flow goes over a second durso which is oversized incase the scrubber plugs up. This makes for a loud waterfall overflow. No good. For now I am sticking with the durso on the 60 gallon. The 120 will have a ghost overflow with bean animal drains which will be silent!

2: My current sump has an over under over bubble trap. It works well as long as the water level is ½ an inch above the last over baffle. If it is lower or at the baffle height I get micro bubbles. I cant have the water height above that level as it will raise the sump level in the skimmer section. My two over baffles are incorrectly sized.

3: I do not like check valves anywhere. I point my loc line at the surface so that it agitates the surface and limits back siphoning. My plan is to have enough room in the return chamber and the sock filter chamber to handle the back siphon. Keeping the skimmer section at the same level. I have toyed with the idea of building a stand out of acrylic for the skimmer and keeping the marinepure under the stand. Space is limited and I think marinepure is a solid addition as I have minimal aquascaping.

4: That is the plan.

5: I figured I would let the skimmer clean the water first then send it through a sock. Let the skimmer get first shot at debris and this design gives more area for the water to fill in when back siphoning. I typically go with no mechanical filtration 75% of the time. But I like the ability to polish the water when I want.

6: I disagree that this sump is too small. Volume is not my objective with the sump. My skimmer is a SWC-160 which is more than enough skimmer for the upgrade. The ATS will be increased to accommodate the additional fish but that will all be above the sump. I don’t have a fuge section as the ATS replaces that. It is smaller than what is typically seen but it should be just as effective. I don’t see the need to have a large sump with big open areas. I like small and efficient. 600 GPH through the sump is 5 times the display volume through the sump every hour. This also matches the skimmer’s ability. The rest is just a container to hold everything.

I can do a bigger sump for the 120 but whats the point? It will just be empty sump with minimal additional volume.



That’s my thought process anyways.