Reef filter roller or algae scrubber ?

[Crustaceon]

They have separate purposes !! , the roller Matt is mechanical filtration and the algae scrubber is nutrient exportation . I’ve never felt the need for a roller Matt , to me it’s another invention to sell you replacements . Socks and or filter fiber works well and with the socks can be cleaned . The scrubber looks like too mech work to maintain but I here are effective at removing nitrates , phosphates to some degree but a refugium to me is more manageable if you have the room .

They realistically serve the same purpose. Much of the nitrates and phosphates in our tank come from uneaten food breaking down and other detritus. A roller mat/filter floss/sock catch this material before it is able to become nitrates and phosphates IF the reefer follows up in the case of floss and socks. The rollermat kind of takes the reefer out of that loop and removes that stuff for them automatically. “Chicken and the egg” kind of thing. A scrubber doesn’t actually remove anything. It consumes nitrates and phosphates and uses those resources to grow more algae. This means it’s still the responsibility of the reefer to harvest enough algae periodically and export it from the tank to actually “remove” nitrates and phosphates but not too little, which will cause nutrients to be quickly depleted to the point of starving the tank’s inhabitants or too much, which might cause the algae to not be able to handle the nutrient load until it grows sufficiently. Technically it’s “you” removing nitrates and phosphates. It can be tricky to determine the “balancing” point between too little and too much algae.

 

[TxReefer21]

High grade Carbon !

Using Red Sea carbon just this past weekend. Before I was only using fritz max out and filter socks

 

[TxReefer21]

They realistically serve the same purpose. Much of the nitrates and phosphates in our tank come from uneaten food breaking down and other detritus. A roller mat/filter floss/sock catch this material before it is able to become nitrates and phosphates IF the reefer follows up in the case of floss and socks. The rollermat kind of takes the reefer out of that loop and removes that stuff for them automatically. “Chicken and the egg” kind of thing. A scrubber doesn’t actually remove anything. It consumes nitrates and phosphates and uses those resources to grow more algae. This means it’s still the responsibility of the reefer to harvest enough algae periodically and export it from the tank to actually “remove” nitrates and phosphates but not too little, which will cause nutrients to be quickly depleted to the point of starving the tank’s inhabitants or too much, which might cause the algae to not be able to handle the nutrient load until it grows sufficiently. Technically it’s “you” removing nitrates and phosphates. It can be tricky to determine the “balancing” point between too little and too much algae.

I probably have more then my own liking of nutrients in my tank however it’s not snowing it in my display but I know it could be taken better care of. I mean what would be the point of even having a ATS currently I run filter socks/ media bags. Recently got a skimmer. I figured using the ATS in conjunction with my skimmer and filter socks I should be good. I feed heavy 1once a day pellets / krill / seaweed strips. Daily

 

[Crustaceon]

I probably have more then my own liking of nutrients in my tank however it’s not snowing it in my display but I know it could be taken better care of. I mean what would be the point of even having a ATS currently I run filter socks/ media bags. Recently got a skimmer. I figured using the ATS in conjunction with my skimmer and filter socks I should be good. I feed heavy 1once a day pellets / krill / seaweed strips. Daily

You're in a situation where you already have an excessive nutrient issue and you're going to need something like macro algae an ATS or carbon dosing to get those levels down. Water changes also work if you do a large enough percentage. The tricky part is managing a runaway freight train of a nutrient reduction method and not allowing it to do too much. This is why I dose DIY nopox and run a skimmer. I can finely tune have much further nutrient reduction I need at lower nitrate levels. I've found it much harder to do the same with a refugium or ATS. A lot of reefers have no problem using algae as a do-it-all solution, but from my own experience I would never go back to that routine. For me, it's just easier to dose 10ml of vinegar/vodka mix and test once a week. FWIW, once you're down in the 5ppm nitrate level, you want to be careful not to change your filter socks too often, because while that's not the strongest nutrient reduction method, it still is one. In a nutshell, the nutrient control you're going to have to implement will likely change as your water parameters change. You might add stuff now, but will likely take things out of the system because they really don't have an "off" switch to them.

 

[Screwgunner]

That is what happened to me I did a diy scrubber with two 10x16 screens that was way to big and my nutrients stayed at 0. That caused all kinds of havoc. So I cut them down to 10x 5 now all is good in the land of reef.

 

[BanjoBandito]

Message me about scrubbers - I’ve been through the ringer with mine and can offer some insight

 

[blaxsun]

I like my new ReefMat. I haven't tried an algae scrubbr, but I think I'd toy with an ozone system first before the acrubber.

 

[BanjoBandito]

I like my new ReefMat. I haven't tried an algae scrubbr, but I think I'd toy with an ozone system first before the acrubber.

They are deeply misunderstood hardware, honestly.

 

[DavidinGA]

This is a rather weak comparison. A roller is a glorified sock or polyfill.

An ATS accomplishes mechanical filtration, biological filtration, boosts pH, improves overall biome, etc.

Easy ATS win.

 

[DavidinGA]

With a algae scrubber, it's possible to maintain zero nutrients. My algae just sucks it up as soon as it's produced and aside from trace elements, I don't really have to do any water changes. The algae scrubber also outcompetes algae in the display, since I have periotic "black outs", I do this every 2 or 3 months, when I notice some pest algae take hold in some tiny crack or crevices. The roller mat (or any other mechanical filtration) has no method of nutrient export, once it's in its elemental form, dissolved in water, and is therefore dependent on water changes. Yes mechanical filtration will physically "remove and discard" debris and waste, but while it's in there, the waste is constantly in a state of decomposition, and in theory, be impossible to prevent leaching into the water column. The roller does try to solve this by "rolling" the waste out continuously, though there is still "leach" time.
The algae scrubber's "leach" time would be.. I guess if I didn't harvest it and it starts to die out, but again, that's simply resolved by the next harvest.
The scrubber also has "down time" if all the algae was harvested at once, however I get around that by harvesting only half of the mass, and alternating between halves, twice as often, which for me is rather than once a week, but every 4 days.
Another bonus, I can feed as much food, as often as I want. I simply get a more luscious, thick algae growth of ulva, which I feed a portion back into the tank. I use an upflow algae scrubber, incorporated into my overflow.

Could you post some info on your diy scrubber?

Are you running the mat fully submerged?

 

[blaxsun]

This is a rather weak comparison. A roller is a glorified sock or polyfill.
An ATS accomplishes mechanical filtration, biological filtration, boosts pH, improves overall biome, etc.
Easy ATS win.

As mentioned earlier in the thread, they both function differently. I'm rather enjoying my "glorified sock" as it means not having to change out filter socks every 2 days and laundering dozens at a time.

 

[Screwgunner]

This is my modified sump .

 

[Screwgunner]

This is the light I use.

 

[homegrowncichlid]

Could you post some info on your diy scrubber?

Are you running the mat fully submerged?

hmm, my previous photo not informative enough? let me zoom in a bit more. The water runs directly from the overflow box into the side chamber of my refugium/frag sump. There is a one square foot (35 to 70W controllable, LED panel about 2 inches away from the side glass, with a fan cooling it off. The return PVC pipe runs horizontally along the bottom of the chamber, which diffusers the water flow evenly upwards and over the plexiglass baffle. As for where the algae grows, it grows on the glass which immediately facing the lights, and also on the black vinyl sheet, which I have magnetically anchored to the plexiglass divider. I remove the vinyl sheet every other weekend and scrape. I scrape the glass on alternating cycle. The exact frequency varies. My original plan was to keep the glass completely clean and harvest just the vinyl, however after a while, I noticed the glass actually doubled the surface growing area, and that it was bad to remove 100% of all algae from the chamber at a time, because during that time, algae would begin to grow inside the display and frag area. I've also tried to grow chaeto, however since I could not anchor it down, it would get flushed upwards and after a while of trying to save a half of it to reseed the chamber, I eventually dumped it all out.
As for cleaning, the algae off the pipe, I have a union on it, so the entire assembly can be removed.
I'm currently growing ulva in there.
And, yes, I do no have any measurable N or P, so I carpet./broadcast feed my system daily, by grinding pellets and dried shrimp into a powder. I also have a continuous phytoplankton "haze" living in there, which I can see under the 420 lights.

 

[TxReefer21]

I like my new ReefMat. I haven't tried an algae scrubbr, but I think I'd toy with an ozone system first before the acrubber.

In my past tank I did use a Oxydator However not quiet the same but I thiiiiink does somewhat similar ????? Didn’t last very long for me. But I was also newer or didn’t know much about them. It was like a buy and try. Definitely kept my water crystal clear though !

 

[TxReefer21]

hmm, my previous photo not informative enough? let me zoom in a bit more. The water runs directly from the overflow box into the side chamber of my refugium/frag sump. There is a one square foot (35 to 70W controllable, LED panel about 2 inches away from the side glass, with a fan cooling it off. The return PVC pipe runs horizontally along the bottom of the chamber, which diffusers the water flow evenly upwards and over the plexiglass baffle. As for where the algae grows, it grows on the glass which immediately facing the lights, and also on the black vinyl sheet, which I have magnetically anchored to the plexiglass divider. I remove the vinyl sheet every other weekend and scrape. I scrape the glass on alternating cycle. The exact frequency varies. My original plan was to keep the glass completely clean and harvest just the vinyl, however after a while, I noticed the glass actually doubled the surface growing area, and that it was bad to remove 100% of all algae from the chamber at a time, because during that time, algae would begin to grow inside the display and frag area. I've also tried to grow chaeto, however since I could not anchor it down, it would get flushed upwards and after a while of trying to save a half of it to reseed the chamber, I eventually dumped it all out.
As for cleaning, the algae off the pipe, I have a union on it, so the entire assembly can be removed.
I'm currently growing ulva in there.
And, yes, I do no have any measurable N or P, so I carpet./broadcast feed my system daily, by grinding pellets and dried shrimp into a powder. I also have a continuous phytoplankton "haze" living in there, which I can see under the 420 lights.

Nice that look wicked

 

[BanjoBandito]

This is a rather weak comparison. A roller is a glorified sock or polyfill.

An ATS accomplishes mechanical filtration, biological filtration, boosts pH, improves overall biome, etc.

Easy ATS win.

The "boost PH" is overstated and not really going to happen. Depending on the setup it's not acting as mechanical filtration much either. The benefit of a scrubber is that it's basically a system to grow large amounts of algae for export from the system. The "improve biome" is just marketing speak.

 

[gregcoyote]

I’ve used ATS in my reef for over 30 years. Roller filters for only a few. Why choose? They compliment each other.

 

[Mark Gray]

Following along, I have never used a roller matt or an algae scrubber. I am a fuge guy with no filter socks. I do very little to my fuge about 1 time a month I will put some gloves on and cut some cheato back. I usually dip what I cut in the tank to dislodge pods it's a treat for the fish, tons of living stuff in it.

 

[atoll]

Caveat - I have never owned an algae scrubber.

Filter roller reduces maintenance, and you could argue that an algae scrubber will increase it.

Both will reduce nutrients. Filter roller will help stability of nutrients if you have poor habits surrounding filter sock cleaning.

Roller will add minimal cost to your monthly expenses to replace rolls.

Algae scrubber takes up a sizable footprint, whereas the roller does not.

Just a few thoughts off top.

Disagree for the following reasons.

1/IME a roller filter needs more time servicing it. My ATS takes less than four minutes to service it.

2/ An ATS will do more than just reduce nuitrents, it will also aid PH , remove heavy metals and increase pods. You can also fine tune it to your system amongs other things.

3/ There are no monthly maintenance costs with an ATS.

4/ My algae scrubber has no footprint as far as being in the sump as most sit on not in the sump unlike a roller filter which sits in the sump. BTW I removed the filter sock holders in my sump giving me more room.

5/ Roller filters remove marine snow that feed corals my ATS dosent.

Finally, yes I have used both so I talk from experience of both and I don9use any particulate filtration at all apart from a skimmer which removes some.