reef keeping 26 years fish dying need experienced help please

[Petergreatbritain]

I have an 800 litre full blown sps reef over many years i have been collecting lots of fish mainy wrasse from the anampses famiy.
About 4 months ago i started to lose my fish my wrasse would become lethargic often lying on the sand at lights out rather than going in it. i sent away for an icp test and all my params came back fine. I then lost 2 tangs these would go to the bottom of the tank and just sit there showing signs of slight rapid breathing. then i lost my scooter blenny pair and one of my mandarins. during these events i noticed white stringy poo coming from one of my chalk gobies i immediately knew that there was a good chance i had lost my fish to these so i ordered seachem focus and general cure from USA.While i was waiting for this to come i lost my copperband again to the same symptoms
i had the copperband for over 8 years so was devastated. While i was waiting for my treatment to arrive my 4 sandsifting gobies stopped sifting sand but still ate like pigs.
My focus arrived and i started to use this mixed with frozen food all my remaining fish ate it and after a couple of weeks my gobies where back sift
ing sand .The general cure arrived and i used this mixed with focus and frozen. Even though my remaining fish showed no sign of ill health i fed them for the suggested 10 day course my system showed no sign of distress to pod life and i experienced no increase in skimmate.
During these next 2 weeks my remaining fish (mandarin 4 sand sifting gobies and black cardinal ) where all fine but my nutrients dropped rapidly due to little food going in my system and i noticed paling of some of my sps. I am not a fan of low nutrient systems so i knew i needed to get some fish in so i could increase my feeding and get more fish poo in for my corals.
My remaining fish where still fine so i headed of to my lfs and spoke to the marine biologist there who i have dealt with for over 25 years. I decided on 6 springeri damses 1 true banana wrasse 1 small twistii and 1 small copperband. All of these looked healthy and all where seen by me feeding in the shop.
I took the fish home the damsels all hosted in one of my large staghorns the 2 wrasse had a quick feed and went in the sand and the copperband got straight to work eating out of the rockwork so all in all things where looking .
The following day the 6 damsels seperated and went in there own corals the wrasse came out and fed well and the copperband wasnt eating or hunting as much.
That night i lost 2 damsels they went to the bottom and showed signs of fast breathing the following day the remaining damsels and my banana wrasse died all at the bottom of the tank.The following day i lost my copperband this was sat on the sand between 2 rocks . The twistii is still in there and still feeding although i am not convinced on its natural behaviour.
I am left in confusion as my original fish are all well. My sps are fine so i have to doubt that its water chemistry. A friend suggested high carbon dioxide and i know that some of my fish symptoms do show signs of this however i have a huge protein smimmer loads of water movement and a daytime ph of 8.15 .
I have tested for stray electric and have an earth probe.Water salinity is 10264 temp 26c .
A friend has recently lost 10 green chromis from the same supplier in quite quick succession athough i am not suggesting anything by that.
I am truly baffled does anyone have any similar experiences or suggestions to help.
Thanks in advance
kind regards pete

 

[ndrwater]

Uronema disease is pretty common these days. Especially in damsels.
I have seen things like this happen before. Not common, but...
Have you disturbed the sandbed recently" I have done this in very established tanks with detrimental effect. The anerobic activity that can and does happen in a very established tank can cause exactly what you are describing. Especially if the areas being disturbed are quite deep, like 5-10cm

 

[Paul B]

Did you do a necropsy on any of the dead fish or look into their gills with a magnifier?

You can't just find a dead fish and try to guess what it died from.
Of course if it jumped out and your cat ate it, then you may not have to look any further.

 

[Petergreatbritain]

Thanks for your help guys
firstly yes my sand bed has been distururbed by the 4 gobies that i added to keep the sand moving and clean . I do have 5cm all over due to my love of wrasse and i will look up uronema disease.
I only managed to get my copperband and 2 damsels out but could see nothing on the body or gills.
I struggle to see how i still have my remaining healthy fish but lose the new ones so quick??

 

[ndrwater]

Fish, and coral for that matter, can and do become acclimated to whatever situation they are in until it becomes to much to bear. Bringing in new fish or corals from one system is stressful enough on the animals, but made much more so if something is off in the new system. Making matters WORSE is if there is an underlying infection.
I have seen literally countless times when a not so seasoned reefer posts with "My new coral are dying" and bemoaning the seller. Only to find out their alkalinity is 12DKH or more. Most sellers dont run that high and the shock is enough to brown out, or even kill the coral.
Same applies to fish. Not necessarily a DKH issue, but temp, ammonia, or even Nitrates can be a stresssor. Couple that with disturbed anaerobic activity... what seems like odd things can happen to even the saltiest of reefer..

 

[Petergreatbritain]

Paul B many thanks for your help but i am pretty certain this is not what i have had although you have just put me off buying any more damses\chromis
kind regards Pete

 

[ndrwater]

By the way...Welcome to R2R!!

 

[Petergreatbritain]

Thanks guys
i agree on the above but wouldnt say anaerobic activity has been disturbed just improved i have multiple cucumbers nassarius snails starfish bristleworms etc etc that have been keeping my sand bed in check for years and have always been quite anal with my params as we have to be to keep sps in good condition or more realistically to keep sps at all.I have been so fortunate in 26 years to stay away from fish loss but this one is really baffling me.
If i had lost sps or lps i could consider params contributing to my fish loss . if i had lost all my fish and then lost the new ones i would have better understanding but because my existing fish are so healthy it does not make sense

 

[raketemensch]

Fish, and coral for that matter, can and do become acclimated to whatever situation they are in until it becomes to much to bear. Bringing in new fish or corals from one system is stressful enough on the animals, but made much more so if something is off in the new system. Making matters WORSE is if there is an underlying infection.
I have seen literally countless times when a not so seasoned reefer posts with "My new coral are dying" and bemoaning the seller. Only to find out their alkalinity is 12DKH or more. Most sellers dont run that high and the shock is enough to brown out, or even kill the coral.
Same applies to fish. Not necessarily a DKH issue, but temp, ammonia, or even Nitrates can be a stresssor. Couple that with disturbed anaerobic activity... what seems like odd things can happen to even the saltiest of reefer..

It would be awesome if, as we move toward WYSIWYG sales, sellers would also post the parameters of the tank that their items are being pulled from.

 

[Petergreatbritain]

not sure what you mean from above statement do you want my system parameters??

 

[cancun]

Hi there! I am so sorry for the loss of your fish. You probably thought if this, but what salinity did the dealer you bought the fish from have them in?

 

[Petergreatbritain]

The company I buy my fish from are a large importer and do keep there water at a lower salinity. I do take take time and equal salinity over a long time and have been using this company for over 20 years. However I have bought a new ammonia test kit and on first test I got a reading of 0.25. I dosed bacteria and the following day I got a reading of zero ammonia.
It is possible that the ammonia reading was just a spike from the fish death.