Reef2Reef Pest algae challenge thread hydrogen peroxide

[brandon429]

There is a very careful order to taking apart and cleaning a eutrophic tank without killing it all, but that thread shows how. We do not lose systems on that thread in the prior post, we save them but it is real reef surgery, very dangerous but very beneficial.

This is how I sling 55 gallons around very quickly: garden hose taped to dowel inserted down low, 15 mins to siphon out the door to the left. tap water and conditioner was mixing in brute, 7 mins to pump back up to the tank, good enough for this quarter.

 

[JMM744]

Let me bounce this off you...In 16 days I will have my 120 ready for corals. It’s a qt right now due to the velvet problem I encountered in the 70. Once the 120 is free of copper my plan is to add rock to what is in the 70 and put it all in the 120. The fish will all go in the 70 till the 120 is stable. I can pull about 1/2 the rock now and syphon the floor and remaining rock and clean the sump and Chaeto easy enough. Then replace water and add fresh. Will this help enough , in your opinion, to get me to the stage where it all,goes in the 120 where I can easily clean all rock before adding it? Otherwise I will get some containers found and get it all out.
I have a rock to target for the test rock by the way. It has hair algae on it as well as a nice coat of other stuff.
Another question if I may, when the new system is set up what might you suggest to avoid this problem happening in it? It’s a 120 reef and 100 gal. Sump with a lot of live rock in it. It, the sump, is already cycled and ready to go. Just need to connect the plumbing together. It’s interesting about coralline and algae. My 70 had great coralline growth till a year ago and I lost most of my sps and coralline together. The coralline has never really come back except on the glass. My 55 holding tank for corals has an exceptional growth of coralline and no problem with algae except red turf which turbos took care of. I would love to see the coralline make a come back for sure. Much easier to scrape the glass then fight the mess I have now, much easier. Thanks much for the help and suggestions. Glad I found the thread. Test rock will happen tonight.
Will get the thread you posted up read as soon as time permits.

 

[brandon429]

Thanks tons for the added support for the thread for sure, it's so fun to collect challenges and these large reefs are the top ones for sure. Someone else will find a clue we missed on their go, apply it, and post back with an amped outcome / evolution of hobby

One clue that stood out was grazers you saw in action, rare to have a group that goes for target/ gold/ I already know you'll get more for the final setup, preventative grazing so ideal. My reef never was well matched to any grazer so business was the early mode and I think when you add back cleaned rocks to the new system they'll finally outnumber the target mass, altered ratios amplifier.

If you had a simple way to bump magnesium up to about 1350 or whatever slightly safe but high-ish magnesium would be, I can truly relay that as a safe parameter to alter that in the worst case cannot -cause- algae growth and as the reason I recommend it, mg boosting is a strong ten years reviewed and I've seen it implicated directly in algae control and by extension de eutrophication. Brush algae will take about nine days to die off from peroxide, we like to knife score it first where possible and I'm glad you have a tank transfer coming up, your plans are ideal and we can watch you learn about those invader dynamics and document custom plans vs a guesswork new setup.

If you had any regrowth problems of the non brush invaders, the matted types, give the tests a few cleanings we don't expect one offs to be the core outcome. A UV sterilizer, oversized, is a powerful weapon for your type of invader going from a large to a larger system if testing growbacks prove energized, the threads on UV yes/no are the most drawn out threads forums have so I don't recommend them from a bandwagon it's from what we did and documented with them in the reefcentral peroxide thread. I've always always had great return on success using oversized sterilizers where avail in custom cure threads

 

[JMM744]

Did the peroxide dip this morning. Stuff is real hard on brittle stars! Top picture is before and other is after. The brown stuff melted right off. The hair algae is bleached some. Will watch how it does over the next couple days. At this point I am going to remove some nicer sps to a layover tank. Will then get after the rock as best I can. My goal is to at least knock the stuff back hard. No fish in the system right now which helps but I have several shrimp and a nice porcelin crab and a couple bubbletips. Oh, and a nice harlequin shrimp too.

 

[JMM744]

Here is a 24 hr. Picture. The faded blue areas are hair algae that’s gone pale to almost white. You can see I missed a couple areas too.

 

[brandon429]

that's pretty neat detailed tracking

if there's any way possible, the adjunct to that testing is another sample rock/picture that isn't dunked but hand detailed outside the tank with a scraping knife/tool outside the tank such that it has no invader at all, and then peroxide applied outside the tank directly nondiluted to the cleaned areas, then rinsed, then put back. we get to chart dual modes there: the physical mass kill of the invader(s) and the regrowth potential post-treatment, which usually works orders better. if possible that's a neat dual test mode and its only working with two small sections, no big commit yet

the second test would be a purely cleaned rock+ coral setting to chart regrowth/where if any regrowth takes back ground. this is ideally ran in the clean condition tank, there w be less mass to re deposit, but even an entry level test using that means starts to add to our knowledge of tank specifics here.

we like to lead into treatment vs start all out, this is a good way we're watching here with your tank

Clownfishy did a neat combo test here of dips vs in tank applications, good pics n after shots to chart as it progresses
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/my-experience-battling-green-hair-algae-gha.417917/#post-4890171

 

[JMM744]

Let me take a look at a likely candidate. As I go through this I am removing any sps ( sticks) that are placed on the sample rocks. There is a nice chalice and some montipora on the first rock I hit . My idea is to just place nicer corals in a holding tank for the time being as they are getting moved in a month anyways. Will try to get a sample done tonight if I can get away from work in time.
Jim

 

[JMM744]

Well it’s been a while and I have not had the time to set aside to do the rock clean up as planned. In the mean time I did go lights out for 3 days and that knocked the algae back quite a bit. Tonight I took some time to syphon as much crud as possible out of the tank. Lights are back on so I expect to see a resurgence in the stuff but will deal with it as I can. Will get pictures later. My original rock that I used peroxide on is pretty much clean and even the Dino’s are all but gone. It’s a better looking tank right now but far from rejuvenated.
Jim

 

[JMM744]

Quick follow up. Sorry it’s been so long. Seems this summer has been one of my busier ones in a long time.
So... the rock I originally pulled and cleaned and treated with peroxide has stayed clean. I added several large snails to the tank of which about half are still alive. I think my bluelegged crabs killed some for the shells. At least they are wearing them now.
The rock is very clean now and starting to show signs of coralline algae growth ( at least I think it is) which is very encouraging. I continue to clean rocks off as I can and am using a baster to blow sediment off every day. The growth of diatoms seems to be slowing and my glass, which used to have long flowing coverage, now seems to have much less. Down side is that green hair algae is coming in where the diatoms are decreasing. This tank is going fallow so no fish for algae help. At some point this week I am going to suction the bottom and rocks to remove the sediment gathered there and then do a bit of water change. I will get pictures of the clean rock soon.

 

[brandon429]

Excellent thanks tons
Two details am curious to relate to the current status

can the sandbed produce a cloud in any way, and is any of the algae growback areas a rasped area

The reason that’s helpful to know is for large tank modeling

some of our readers are up to 300+ gallons and can’t just decloud a sandbed in the flick of a switch like a nano keeper can. If your sandbed is still in normal state and you are working above it solely on the rocks, and the growback is still minimal for a first run, then this bodes really well for lt keepers who might still can do direct rock work as long as they didn’t have to pull and clean the sand

 

[JMM744]

Excellent thanks tons
Two details am curious to relate to the current status

can the sandbed produce a cloud in any way, and is any of the algae growback areas a rasped area

The reason that’s helpful to know is for large tank modeling

some of our readers are up to 300+ gallons and can’t just decloud a sandbed in the flick of a switch like a nano keeper can. If your sandbed is still in normal state and you are working above it solely on the rocks, and the growback is still minimal for a first run, then this bodes really well for lt keepers who might still can do direct rock work as long as they didn’t have to pull and clean the sand

No sand bed, bare bottom. Nothing rasped, only stiff brushed.

 

[brandon429]

That’s still pretty good rasping anyway beats that toothbrush technique ha / kid gloves

 

[JMM744]

That’s still pretty good rasping anyway beats that toothbrush technique ha / kid gloves

Here are some updated tank shots.....
Top picture is current status and the other is when it was terrible.

 

[JMM744]

Couple more shots... this last one is an area that was heavy with snot! Been clean about a week. One thing I should mention is I bumped the magnesium up about 50 pts. It was a bit low. Still a lot of work but it’s coming along.

 

[brandon429]

the floor of that tank is clean coralline, looks great

look how the thick coralline parts are biorejecting to invaders, maybe not when in full force but look at the pics above, there is real estate ruling going on and I can see it plain as day, that's always neato


its also neat that 3% does all this work, I only use 35% which is dangerous enough it might not should be avail otc but is...3% balances safety and effect most of the time just right

really well done progress

also, how much work/how many total cleaning runs is that succession above, just one? if so that's neat, if you had to clean ten times to attain that, we need an efficiency boost somewhere

You are demonstrating a solid ROI on your efforts

that big ole aged rock system (ideal) is simply missing a couple ideal grazers whatever those would be in Fiji, and we're finding inside ways to get back without having to harshly undo all your calcification, your corals aren't bleached they're fine and this tank is very close to eutrophication undo

you have no cloudy spots, do you know how rare that is to see in reefing heh

 

[brandon429]

I hope that readers see a hidden pattern here, this thread isn’t about peroxide as the sole factor into why we keep not killing tanks and why we don’t take multi pages to post an afterpic. It’s about willingness, something we cannot titrate

The posters here are not hesitating, they’re effecting. Behaviors, choices are making the pics, the tool varies by the decade.

ID, buy a microscope, post your nitrate and phosphate, all unneeded and all are growback suppressors those actions aren’t the remover of an infestation.



This is a no excuse zone, it’s not really chemistry and biology it’s pattern mimicking

Back in 2008 before peroxide I had friends fire burning their rocks, blue jet flame lighters I’ve got utube vids of me doing it. This was caveman resolution days where we knew direct war was the answer, we just didn’t have efficient means to attain plant and protist kill, but they still died. We started using knives to wrestle algae out of reef rocks as pre rasping, the physical technique more important than actual peroxide here, about four years ago so manual algae control is still evolving.

Above all, the people adding data here are willing to kill vs entertain the materials in these pages, that’s why we aren’t waiting months for success. There are times in reefing you don’t have to wait, don’t have to hesitate, the key words I’m using are traits of people, not chemistry or biology.

Reef tank invasions are caused and modulated moreso by factors of psychology vs factors of marine science, I’ll write an article on that one day. In the meantime we’ll conpile more after pics using that approach.


We have the known methods to kill the majority of tank invaders. Combined with the sand rinse thread to hammer dinos and cyano back, the next choice is either applying the kill model or purposefully farming the invader further which I continually find to be a matter of choice and not a matter of the actual invader nor the various parameters that the pre invaded always show up with (meaning people with perfect water commonly have algae outbreaks, only to be told their algae is uptaking it.)

 

[JMM744]

I did one water change where I really cleaned up the tank floor. I use a baster every day to blow the crud off the rocks and every couple days to clean it off the glass. I have cleaned a few rocks out of the tank but just a few. The flat rock with the chalice on it was scrubbed and had peroxide used on it. The little bit of algae that returned has been eliminated by the snails and crab. I need to do another water change/ vacuuming but the residue is much reduced at this point.

 

[hotashes]

Couple more shots... this last one is an area that was heavy with snot! Been clean about a week. One thing I should mention is I bumped the magnesium up about 50 pts. It was a bit low. Still a lot of work but it’s coming along.

+1 from me, you've done a great job offering feedback on this hands on approach. My tank is under MY control and nature still takes the lead role, I just guide it heh.

Keep up the good effort.

A.

 

[slapman83]

@brandon429 , it took me about 48h to read almost everything you ever wrote about HP.
I salut you.
learned alot and treated 30% of my frags and top of my Rock work (drained it, saturated it and did 20% WC).

before:

sorry for the bad quality and blue lights

i will post the after pic tmr to see how we doing

thank you sir.

 

[Subsea]

I hope that readers see a hidden pattern here, this thread isn’t about peroxide as the sole factor into why we keep not killing tanks and why we don’t take multi pages to post an afterpic. It’s about willingness, something we cannot titrate

The posters here are not hesitating, they’re effecting. Behaviors, choices are making the pics, the tool varies by the decade.

ID, buy a microscope, post your nitrate and phosphate, all unneeded and all are growback suppressors those actions aren’t the remover of an infestation.



This is a no excuse zone, it’s not really chemistry and biology it’s pattern mimicking

Back in 2008 before peroxide I had friends fire burning their rocks, blue jet flame lighters I’ve got utube vids of me doing it. This was caveman resolution days where we knew direct war was the answer, we just didn’t have efficient means to attain plant and protist kill, but they still died. We started using knives to wrestle algae out of reef rocks as pre rasping, the physical technique more important than actual peroxide here, about four years ago so manual algae control is still evolving.

Above all, the people adding data here are willing to kill vs entertain the materials in these pages, that’s why we aren’t waiting months for success. There are times in reefing you don’t have to wait, don’t have to hesitate, the key words I’m using are traits of people, not chemistry or biology.

Reef tank invasions are caused and modulated moreso by factors of psychology vs factors of marine science, I’ll write an article on that one day. In the meantime we’ll conpile more after pics using that approach.


We have the known methods to kill the majority of tank invaders. Combined with the sand rinse thread to hammer dinos and cyano back, the next choice is either applying the kill model or purposefully farming the invader further which I continually find to be a matter of choice and not a matter of the actual invader nor the various parameters that the pre invaded always show up with (meaning people with perfect water commonly have algae outbreaks, only to be told their algae is uptaking it.)

Interesting deduction, “phycology not chemistry”.

While I like your approach, particularly with hydrogen peroxide, I can not descimate my sandbed to get a “clean tank”. For me, the sandbed feeds my tank. I enjoy my sea apples and flame scallops.