Resetting Live Rock from Palys

[millticket]

A word of advice and eliminating palys from my live rock. It is completely overgrown and I’ve attempted to sell the rock and all to my local reef club but no one is interested. As I want to save the rock I was wondering if I could just place it in my sump (no light) and the palys would slowly die off?

I’m worried about ripping them off or doing kalk injections for fear of my own safety as well as the tank inhabitants.

Thanks in advance!!

 

[j.falk]

If they died off in your sump, wouldn't they release palytoxin into the water?

 

[cvrle1]

Bleach bath will take care of them. If you are to do this, make sure you wear all the protective gear and do it outside!! If you do go bleach route, you will kill everything on and in the rock, basically resetting it to being white and dead.

 

[jda]

Can you remove it?

I have set them outside to freeze overnight, then put them in a bucket with some tankwater for a few days with a scrub brush to work them off, then back in the tank. The microfauna seems to come back very quickly from this.

 

[millticket]

If they died off in your sump, wouldn't they release palytoxin into the water?

I'm not sure, i was wondering if that would happen or if this is more of a natural method as they die?

Bleach bath will take care of them. If you are to do this, make sure you wear all the protective gear and do it outside!! If you do go bleach route, you will kill everything on and in the rock, basically resetting it to being white and dead.

I could do this, but honestly I'd rather not go to the work of doing all that. I'd be more than happy to give it away free than nuke it.

Can you remove it?

I have set them outside to freeze overnight, then put them in a bucket with some tankwater for a few days with a scrub brush to work them off, then back in the tank. The microfauna seems to come back very quickly from this.

It would be an awfully long method to try to remove them; if i set it outside overnight, would it kill off other beneficial organisms


I appreciate all the suggestions, I'm wish there was a better alternative. In retrospect, when i started this tank 8 years ago, I always wanted zoas/palys, but now I just kind of want to reset to an LPS tank with a few easy SPS.

 

[ScottB]

There is no way to keep the bacteria & microfauna and still kill off the paly. Paly is the cockroach of the sea. They will remain long after we are gone.

90%+ of palys contain very little toxin but the 10% or so that do can deliver some pretty undesirable harm. I say this based on people I personally know that ended up in the emergency room. Not what I read somewhere on the internet.

Glove up. Wear some glasses and your favorite mask. Give the rocks a very long soak in bleach (outdoors). Rinse outdoors. If the rock needs a little opening up of the pores then give it a 6 hour bath in citric acid. Rinse again and soak in RO. Let it dry and good to go.

Here is a lovely pic of me obliterating paly on some gorgeous rock with muriatic acid which has other potential risk factors. Just in case you wonder why nobody wants it "as is".

 

[xxkenny90xx]

I wouldn't want them dying/rotting in the sump. Regardless of toxins they will foul the water (to what extent obviously depends on how many palys).

How about putting the rock in a bucket of saltwater with no light? That should eventually kill them without killing everything on the rock. Maybe even try really high salinity

 

[User1]

Being in a similar situation with the nuclear green paly's I have decided to try what Mother Earth provided and that is the Gaudy Clown Crab. Of course it has been a challenge finding one or two for sale but the word is that they eat Palythoas to use as a natural defence so figured I would try.

Other than that I've seen my population reduce on its own similar to Xenia with a certain water ALK balance. I don't recall if it was high or low ALK sadly but when my tank was in that situation they both faded away...wish I was a better note taker.

Removing the rock and letting the Sun take care of the issue would be the best solution. Just leave it away from a neighbours windows and in a high wind flow area and you should be good. Do not boil, pressure wash, etc. Just set it out in a tub and let Mother Nature take over. When done you can pressure wash off the dead and dried out paly's and other garbage and restart the mini cycle that will surely follow.

If you do try and shade them in the sump or darker area you need to run carbon I'd wager and a excellent working skimmer. Not sure I would personally do that but I guess it is an option.

 

[millticket]

There is no way to keep the bacteria & microfauna and still kill off the paly. Paly is the cockroach of the sea. They will remain long after we are gone.

90%+ of palys contain very little toxin but the 10% or so that do can deliver some pretty undesirable harm. I say this based on people I personally know that ended up in the emergency room. Not what I read somewhere on the internet.

Glove up. Wear some glasses and your favorite mask. Give the rocks a very long soak in bleach (outdoors). Rinse outdoors. If the rock needs a little opening up of the pores then give it a 6 hour bath in citric acid. Rinse again and soak in RO. Let it dry and good to go.

Here is a lovely pic of me obliterating paly on some gorgeous rock with muriatic acid which has other potential risk factors. Just in case you wonder why nobody wants it "as is".

any concerns with pets in rinsing it outdoors or perhaps in the driveway that leads to storm water runoff?

I wouldn't want them dying/rotting in the sump. Regardless of toxins they will foul the water (to what extent obviously depends on how many palys).

How about putting the rock in a bucket of saltwater with no light? That should eventually kill them without killing everything on the rock. Maybe even try really high salinity

Possible solution and thought about this.

Being in a similar situation with the nuclear green paly's I have decided to try what Mother Earth provided and that is the Gaudy Clown Crab. Of course it has been a challenge finding one or two for sale but the word is that they eat Palythoas to use as a natural defence so figured I would try.

Other than that I've seen my population reduce on its own similar to Xenia with a certain water ALK balance. I don't recall if it was high or low ALK sadly but when my tank was in that situation they both faded away...wish I was a better note taker.

Removing the rock and letting the Sun take care of the issue would be the best solution. Just leave it away from a neighbours windows and in a high wind flow area and you should be good. Do not boil, pressure wash, etc. Just set it out in a tub and let Mother Nature take over. When done you can pressure wash off the dead and dried out paly's and other garbage and restart the mini cycle that will surely follow.

If you do try and shade them in the sump or darker area you need to run carbon I'd wager and a excellent working skimmer. Not sure I would personally do that but I guess it is an option.

I’m afraid I have the nuclear green and the brown button polyps on the other side of my tank

I like the idea of perhaps leaving it outside. I have a spot under my deck that would ensure it stays away from kids/pets and could just leave it be for a couple of winter months with perhaps removing organic material here and there.

 

[User1]

Here are some of mine. Sadly never even introduced them. Hitch hiker spore or such. This is with 180 lbs or so of dry Pukani base rock I have more or less manage them now as I manage my Xenia and that is:

1. Open windows to get cross breeze
2. Play some music - usually some jazz or SRV or Hendrix
3. Bowl of water
4. Towels
5. 8" forceps
6. Shoulder length gloves
7. Ladder
8. Eye goggles / ones I use for turning pens
9. Count to 10
10. Turn off return pumps and Gyre on side I'm working on
11. Get on Ladder, assess working area
12. Reach in, use forceps to rough up and annoy paly
13. Clamp paly at base, single stalk
14. Gently (gently) lift pully slightly left and right working back and forth
15. It should peel off
16. Lift out of tank, drop in bowl or 1 gallon bucket, rinse off, dab on towel, rag
17. Repeat for about 10 minutes or so
18. Assess area, place the reef safe oceanic epoxy or other of choice, add a bit of sand, rubble
19. Repeat until done
20. Add carbon
21. Heavy skimming
22. Clean up and empty in green waste. At night open green waste lid, close in the morning

I do this with Xenia and also when I had green hair algae. Works well but the key is air flow, venting house, gloves, and of course eye protection. That pretty much lowers the risk and I still feel at times like I'm working on an IED...

 

[ScottB]

any concerns with pets in rinsing it outdoors or perhaps in the driveway that leads to storm water runoff?

Not so much really. I happened to be doing that in the rain so dilution was on my side. My greater concern was the muriatic acid potentially aerosolizing any potential toxin. Thus the serious mask.

Again, the odds are the stuff is safe, but I treat them all the same. I should probably be equally cautious around zoanthids but I am not.

 

[User1]

Not so much really. I happened to be doing that in the rain so dilution was on my side. My greater concern was the muriatic acid potentially aerosolizing any potential toxin. Thus the serious mask.

Again, the odds are the stuff is safe, but I treat them all the same. I should probably be equally cautious around zoanthids but I am not.

You know it is sort of a bummer problem to have. They are not that bad but they just spread like a wildfire in California

 

[millticket]

I think I'm going to reboot the tank so to speak. Just ordered some marco rocks and mortar kit from BRS to start a fresh scape ( I didn't win anything btw). I'm just going to be taking the rocks our and letting them overwinter under my deck. I hate to kill off a lot of beneficial stuff but I'd rather not deal with potential paly toxins or muratic acid. Wish me luck!

 

[millticket]

Here are some of mine. Sadly never even introduced them. Hitch hiker spore or such. This is with 180 lbs or so of dry Pukani base rock I have more or less manage them now as I manage my Xenia and that is:

1. Open windows to get cross breeze
2. Play some music - usually some jazz or SRV or Hendrix
3. Bowl of water
4. Towels
5. 8" forceps
6. Shoulder length gloves
7. Ladder
8. Eye goggles / ones I use for turning pens
9. Count to 10
10. Turn off return pumps and Gyre on side I'm working on
11. Get on Ladder, assess working area
12. Reach in, use forceps to rough up and annoy paly
13. Clamp paly at base, single stalk
14. Gently (gently) lift pully slightly left and right working back and forth
15. It should peel off
16. Lift out of tank, drop in bowl or 1 gallon bucket, rinse off, dab on towel, rag
17. Repeat for about 10 minutes or so
18. Assess area, place the reef safe oceanic epoxy or other of choice, add a bit of sand, rubble
19. Repeat until done
20. Add carbon
21. Heavy skimming
22. Clean up and empty in green waste. At night open green waste lid, close in the morning

I do this with Xenia and also when I had green hair algae. Works well but the key is air flow, venting house, gloves, and of course eye protection. That pretty much lowers the risk and I still feel at times like I'm working on an IED...

Good looking tank btw!

 

[User1]

Good looking tank btw!

Thanks. Very kind of you.

All the best with the new rock. I wish I took more time in building an aquascape or design. I think it would helped a bit especially with flow.

 

[millticket]

Well i managed to take out a lot of my rocks that had palys on them and placed them in a plastic container and sat them outside to freeze/die. Would anyone know a good tie frame to empty the container to cleanse the rocks for when it's safer for the toxins to breakdown? I must of changed gloves about 50 times and wore a mask. I still think i somehow managed to get a mild case of poisoning. Short after working in the tank, i had a runny nose and sneezing a lot. I didn't think much of it, but then i woke up at 3am with terrible cold chills and then woke up at 5am sweating to death. I'm fine now, but it's scary i either got a mild case of the poisoning or Covid..... symptoms are very similar.

I did manage to convince my large bubble tip to come off its paly rock with a turkey baster and a little gentle nudging as to not damage it's foot. It later attached to a piece of live rock. I feel that was a victory in itself!

Anyways, just wanted to update the thread with my experience and to just serve as a caution for those out there when handling these corals and really any coral in general... protect yourselves!

 

[ZoWhat]

Just curious why this particular rock is worth this much trouble?

 

[millticket]

Just curious why this particular rock is worth this much trouble?

I had several large rocks that were infested with either teal, green or brown palys. I guess the plan was to reset and reuse the rock, but i'm wondering now if it's worth saving or just toss it. If i do end up tossing the rock, i want to make sure to do it as safe as possible not to put anyone at risk.

 

[Timfish]

I've done the "no light" method and it took months and months of total darkness. This may not work for every species as there are probably some that can live completly as heterotrophs without any simbionts. But if you're patient even if it doesn't kill all of them they will get a lot smaller and it probably will be easier to remove them manually.

 

[ZoWhat]

I had several large rocks that were infested with either teal, green or brown palys. I guess the plan was to reset and reuse the rock, but i'm wondering now if it's worth saving or just toss it. If i do end up tossing the rock, i want to make sure to do it as safe as possible not to put anyone at risk.

How porous is the rock? Whatever you do... use bleach, let it sit out in the rain, contaminates could seep deep inside the rock.

I too have had some prize-shaped rock that I didn't want to lose and had the pale green paly infestation. I soaked them in a 5gal bucket with a ton of kalkwasser solution that looked like milk..... the dKH on the solution must have been 40, 50 or more. It Alkalinity burned the palys but took like a good month of soaking

Amazing how stubborn these green palys are.

Burning them off with a propane torch also works....but man o man you need to be outside with a breeze and a serious mask on and know what you are doing and which way the wind is blowing