Return pump info needed...

uf_gators · Jul 14, 2012

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[TD="class: alt1, bgcolor: #EBEBEB"]I am needing a return pump for my sump build. I have a 40 breeder, with a 20L sump/refuge. I am using a standard LifeReef overflow rated at 600gph. So I am wondering what is the best size pump to go with ? I was looking at either a Eheim 1260 (635gph) for $164.99
Sicce 3.5 (660gph) for $139.99

My sump sits under the DT , and from the overflow drain to the sump is approx 2.5 ft. and then 3 ft. on the return. So if anybody has any suggestions, I am open ears...Thanks
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kmaintl · Jul 14, 2012

Even though your overflow is rated for up to 600gph, I would suggest something around 200gph for a 40g breeder. You want to give your want time to go through the sump and for the skimmer to work with that same water. Just my 2 cents.

Mrflameangel · Jul 14, 2012

I am doing a slow flow through my sump. And I know I'm not the only one here that does it being I got the idea from here. I have a standard 180g with a 40b sump. For a total of 200g. I am using the ehiem 1260 for my return. Great pump very quiet but I believe that would be to much flow for you.

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kmaintl · Jul 14, 2012

The old school rule of thumb is 3 to 5 times turnover of your tank through the sump. I use an Eheim 1262 on 120g tank with 4ft head pressure and 4 way return... and a Eheim 1260 on 100g tank with 4ft head pressure with double return.

kmaintl · Jul 14, 2012

You might consider the Eheim 1250.

uf_gators · Jul 14, 2012

kmaintl said:
Even though your overflow is rated for up to 600gph, I would suggest something around 200gph for a 40g breeder. You want to give your want time to go through the sump and for the skimmer to work with that same water. Just my 2 cents.

So go with the Eheim 1250 thats 317gph or sicce 1.5 thats 357gph ?

kmaintl · Jul 14, 2012

uf_gators said:
So go with the Eheim 1250 thats 317gph or sicce 1.5 thats 357gph ?

Find a pump that ends up around 200gph with the backpressure the pump has to push in returning the water to the tank. I would think that both those pumps would work much better than your previous 2 choices.

Mrflameangel · Jul 14, 2012

kmaintl said:
Find a pump that ends up around 200gph with the backpressure the pump has to push in returning the water to the tank. I would think that both those pumps would work much better than your previous 2 choices.

+1

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uf_gators · Jul 14, 2012

I hate to sound like a newbie, but I kinda am...lol
I have been use to using a canister filter on my tank for the past year. I just wanted to add more volume, and a refuge.. thats why I am asking.... If I didn't mention, my sump is sitting under the tank. from the overflow drain to the sump input is 2.5 ft. that T's off to the refuge with a ball valve , then it would be 3ft. back up to the return in the tank.

kmaintl · Jul 14, 2012

uf_gators said:
I hate to sound like a newbie, but I kinda am...lol
I have been use to using a canister filter on my tank for the past year. I just wanted to add more volume, and a refuge.. thats why I am asking.... If I didn't mention, my sump is sitting under the tank. from the overflow drain to the sump input is 2.5 ft. that T's off to the refuge with a ball valve , then it would be 3ft. back up to the return in the tank.

hey, no problem... we're all learning. i'm not familiar with headpressure on the sicce pump, but the eheim 1250 would be perfect. the net return is around 220gph

uf_gators · Jul 14, 2012

another ? i did this head loss calculation and on the data , am I putting all the info in from the time it leaves the overflow to the sump, and also adding the return in also ? if so this is what it gave me... lol

thats 2.5 feet from overflow to 45/w a T, and 1.5 ft. over to refuge with ball valve, and .5ft to skimmer, and 90's on them into sump/fuge. then 3 ft back to return from pump. with a check valve on the return pump. the unions will be in place for quick take apart for cleaning.

Vertical length in feet	5.5

[TD="width: 300"]Horizontal length in feet[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]2[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Pipe diameter in inches[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"] 0.75 [/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Choose your pump:[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]Eheim 1250 [/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of 90 degree elbows[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]2[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of 45 degree elbows[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of gate valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"][/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of ball valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of union couplings[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]5[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of swing check valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of pipe exits[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]2[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of pipe entrances[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]2[/TD]

Total losses are 5.68 feet of head pressure, or 2.45 PSI. with a flow rate of 105 GPH. Process took 96 iterations.

kmaintl · Jul 14, 2012

that's 2 big of a loss on headpressure. i didn't see the 2 elbows and all the connections. you need something a little bit stronger.

uf_gators · Jul 14, 2012

this is only from the overflow to the sump...no return cal added...

Vertical length in feet	2.5

[TD="width: 300"]Horizontal length in feet[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1.5[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Pipe diameter in inches[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"] 0.75 [/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Choose your pump:[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]Eheim 1250 [/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of 90 degree elbows[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]2[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of 45 degree elbows[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of gate valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"][/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of ball valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of union couplings[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]3[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of swing check valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"][/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of pipe exits[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of pipe entrances[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]2[/TD]

Total losses are 3.05 feet of head pressure, or 1.32 PSI. with a flow rate of 245 GPH. Process took 127 iterations.

uf_gators · Jul 14, 2012

I did both but I was unsure of the calculator. if I was to include both drain from overflow to sump, and return to tank... or just the drain to sump...

kmaintl · Jul 14, 2012

oh no, do not include the drain as that isn't connected to the return... only the return. 245gph is a little strong. my experience that it won't be that strong on your setup... will be more like 220gph, which is perfect, imo.

uf_gators · Jul 15, 2012

so just the return side info.. pump to check valve, to T ,with ball valve, ( for flow adjust back into sump off T) and 3ft up to tank, and 2 90's for water return.

Vertical length in feet	3

[TD="width: 300"]Horizontal length in feet[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"].25[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Pipe diameter in inches[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"] 0.75 [/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Choose your pump:[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]Eheim 1250 [/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of 90 degree elbows[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]3[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of 45 degree elbows[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"][/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of gate valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"][/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of ball valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of union couplings[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of swing check valves[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of pipe exits[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]2[/TD]

[TD="width: 300"]Number of pipe entrances[/TD]
[TD="width: 110"]1[/TD]

Total losses are 3.53 feet of head pressure, or 1.53 PSI. with a flow rate of 225 GPH. Process took 125 iterations.