RO/DI water with chloramine remover (prime)

[lemon123]

Hey guys,

I had a quick questions about using a RO/DI water system with seachem prime. I wanted to get the cheapest $150 RO/DI kit from Bulk reef supply (4 stage 75GPD) but I saw that it only removes chlorine and not chloramine. Since money is a bit tight, would it work if I used the 4 stage RO/DI system to remove all the phosphates, metals, silicates, etc.. while using the conditioner to remove the chloramines? The 6 stage RO/DI system that removes chloramines is $100-$150 more.

I am transitioning from freshwater (Discus tank) to a saltwater reef tank so I am pretty new to this. Any feedback would be appreciated.
Thanks!

 

[Bleigh]

The first thing I'd take into consideration is your water source. Do they use chloramines? My city uses them for about 2 weeks of the year. I am not sure how the tap water conditioners work, but I'd imagine you'd still have the ammonia to deal with.

If your source doesn't use chloramines, you could get the 4 stage and always upgrade it later if they do start using it. That's the nice things about the BRS water systems, they are highly configurable.

 

[lemon123]

I double checked and in Texas where I live they use Chloramine instead of chlorine. On the water conditioner bottle it says it removes chlorines and chloramines while detoxifying ammonia. That's why I was wondering if I could use the 4 stage to clean my water then use the conditioner at the end to remove the chloromine. If there's ammonia, how would I get rid of that? Wont the bacteria convert the ammonia to nitrite, then nitrate?

 

[Bleigh]

@ReefSquad

I definitely do not know the answer to that. lol. Calling in the bigger brains.

 

[ichthyogeek]

So it's not that the 4 stage RODI unit doesn't remove chloramine (it does). It's just that it's not as good at removing them. With the 6 stage, water goes through the following: sediment, carbon 1, carbon 2, RO, DI resin 1, DI resin 2. Carbon is the only stage that will remove the chloramine. So getting a 5 stage should work just as well as the 6 stage for removing chloramines.

@Randy Holmes-Farley , please correct me if I'm wrong here. So chloramines (and also chlorine) can "shred" your RO membrane. That's why the carbon is there, to adsorb the chlorine. There might also be catalysis of chloramine into chlorine and ammonia but idk about that. Treating your water with Prime after it's gone through the RODI unit would be redundant. But if you treated the water before it went into the RODI unit, you might be onto something. But that involves knowing what exactly is in prime, and the various components effects in an RODI filter.

Let's say that Prime is only sodium thiosulfate (it's not just that, and thiosulfate is a known neutralizer of chlorine gas and chloramine). The thiosulfate reacts with chloramine to form chloride ions, sodium ions, ammonia/ammonium, sulfate/sulfur dioxide, and sulfur. All of which an RODI unit can get rid of. It's all the add ons that they put in to the Prime that you have to worry about.

 

[lemon123]

On BRS website, it says the following:

4 Stage RO/DI Systems - Perfect for city water that is treated with low amounts of chlorine, or well water with very minimal contaminants. Four stage RODI systems are a great solution if you only connect your RODI system temporarily or have little space to dedicate to storing a RODI system.
5 Stage RO/DI Systems - Our most popular systems handle common impurities found in well water along with most types of city water treated with chlorine including small amounts of chloramines.
6 Stage RO/DI Systems - If you are not sure what is in your water, or it contains excessive amounts of TDS or hard to remove contaminants like chloramines, phosphates, nitrates, silicates, etc. The BRS 6 Stage systems are designed to effectively treat any water your home may have prior to using it in your aquarium. The Dual DI stage helps with the hard to remove ions like ammonia, phosphates, silicates, etc


So thats why I thought the 6 stage system would work because in Texas they use chloramines only, not chlorine. If the 5 stage system can work instead that’d be perfect

 

[ichthyogeek]

That's true. But also make sure to pay attention to the rest of the product description. It's the carbon blocks that are rated for removal of chlorine and chloramine, not any other part of the system. If your city does all chloramine, then probably best to get the 5 stage at least.

Here's the carbon block description . Notice how it's rated for chloramines. I have no idea what they mean by 3500 @ .5 GPM unfortunately, otherwise I'd be able to help out more...and speaking of helping more

@Bleigh , using the @ sign tags the user, but the hashtag is what calls everybody who follows the topic, like so: #reefsquad !

 

[alysak6075]

BRS also sells a carbon block that is specifically formulated for chloramines. I think you can get the 4 stage abd the proper block for it and it should work for you

BRS Universal Carbon Block Filter - 1 Micron

Why does BRS recommend this? We spent a ton of time researching and testing to find the best carbon block available while still being reasonable when it comes to price. There are other filters that work well however do not last as long. By simply just looking down the center of the carbon block...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

Description says it can take care of 3.5k gallons

 

[Philly Reefer]

I don't think you need to worry with the chloramine in your tap water.
I have BRS 4 Stage and I am pretty sure my city (philly) uses chloramine in the water.
"Knock on wood" My tank is ongoing 4 mths+ fishes and corals seems to be alive and well

 

[Bleigh]

That's true. But also make sure to pay attention to the rest of the product description. It's the carbon blocks that are rated for removal of chlorine and chloramine, not any other part of the system. If your city does all chloramine, then probably best to get the 5 stage at least.

Here's the carbon block description . Notice how it's rated for chloramines. I have no idea what they mean by 3500 @ .5 GPM unfortunately, otherwise I'd be able to help out more...and speaking of helping more

@Bleigh , using the @ sign tags the user, but the hashtag is what calls everybody who follows the topic, like so: #reefsquad !

It seems there are special carbon blocks for chloramine. The chloroamine exhausts a regular carbon block much faster than chlorine does. That’s why the carbon block is exhausted at a lower gallon amount for chloroamines versus chlorine. A 5 stage with 2 chloroamine carbon blocks should make the op golden.

 

[Opus]

A high quality carbon block will take out chloramines, just not as well as one made specifically for chloramines. As stated, using a 5 stage with 2 carbon blocks will also work. From what I've read, the di will also remove chlroramines, but of course it will be used up quicker which can become expensive. It shouldn't harm the ro membrane. It takes large quantities to do this.

 

[Bleigh]

It seems there are special carbon blocks for chloramine. The chloroamine exhausts a regular carbon block much faster than chlorine does. That’s why the carbon block is exhausted at a lower gallon amount for chloroamines versus chlorine. A 5 stage with 2 chloroamine carbon blocks should make the op golden.

and I see other people already said that in the time I was taking to type that. ;Hilarious

 

[Opus]

It seems there are special carbon blocks for chloramine. The chloroamine exhausts a regular carbon block much faster than chlorine does. That’s why the carbon block is exhausted at a lower gallon amount for chloroamines versus chlorine. A 5 stage with 2 chloroamine carbon blocks should make the op golden.

Actually I don't think that is usually recommended. Most recommend 1 chloramine block and 1 normal carbon block.

 

[Opus]

On BRS website, it says the following:

4 Stage RO/DI Systems - Perfect for city water that is treated with low amounts of chlorine, or well water with very minimal contaminants. Four stage RODI systems are a great solution if you only connect your RODI system temporarily or have little space to dedicate to storing a RODI system.
5 Stage RO/DI Systems - Our most popular systems handle common impurities found in well water along with most types of city water treated with chlorine including small amounts of chloramines.
6 Stage RO/DI Systems - If you are not sure what is in your water, or it contains excessive amounts of TDS or hard to remove contaminants like chloramines, phosphates, nitrates, silicates, etc. The BRS 6 Stage systems are designed to effectively treat any water your home may have prior to using it in your aquarium. The Dual DI stage helps with the hard to remove ions like ammonia, phosphates, silicates, etc


So thats why I thought the 6 stage system would work because in Texas they use chloramines only, not chlorine. If the 5 stage system can work instead that’d be perfect

It is just marketing on their part. Most people can get by with a 4 stage. I ran a 4 stage for years with tds over 400. Unless you are dealing with a weird metal or chemical you need to get out or a CO2 problem you don't really need to go up to 6 stages. A lot of people do just for convenience and piece of mind.

 

[Bleigh]

Actually I don't think that is usually recommended. Most recommend 1 chloramine block and 1 normal carbon block.

I was going off this. I guess it depends on how bad the chloroamines are and how quickly it’s getting used up.

 

[lemon123]

Thanks guys! Really useful info

I think I might give the 5 stage with 2 carbon blocks a shot. Thanks again guys! Amazing community ;Happy

 

[Opus]

I was going off this. I guess it depends on how bad the chloroamines are and how quickly it’s getting used up.

Well not sure about MD, but I'm almost positive BRS used to recommend the chloramine filter and then the normal carbon filter, but I see they now say 2 chloramine filters. I checked a couple of the trusted RO only sites and they still recommend chloramine and then normal carbon so did the others figure something out something that they don't know or do they just make a little more money by selling 2 chloramine filters? I really don't know. My understanding has always been the normal carbon filter was there to catch the chemicals broken down by the chloramine filter.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Hey guys,

I had a quick questions about using a RO/DI water system with seachem prime. I wanted to get the cheapest $150 RO/DI kit from Bulk reef supply (4 stage 75GPD) but I saw that it only removes chlorine and not chloramine.
Thanks!

That's just not true.

Normal RO/DI are usually sufficient. I showed that by having a lot of folks test their water. Did these companies actually run any tests? Never seen one. Might be somewhere...

i would not assume there is any chloramine in RO/DI water unless you detect it with a chlorine test kit.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I discuss chloramine in great detail here, including showing hobbyists tests for it after RO/DI, and what parts of the RO/DI removes it:

Chloramine and the Reef Aquarium - Reefkeeping.com

The summary:


1. Most RO/DI systems seem capable of removing chloramine adequately for aquarists.
2. The carbon cartridge may become less useful over time, and it is possible that the chloramine removal effectiveness of a system may be lost before the DI appears to need changing.
3. Cheap sediment cartridges may expose the carbon cartridge to unnecessary fouling, which may permit chloramine to pass through the system. Cartridges should be replaced as soon as the pressure drops significantly, even if RO/DI water is still being produced at a reasonable rate or purity as measured by total dissolved solids.
4. Testing for chlorine and chloramine is easy, so any concern is easily reconciled.
5. One Hach kit provides several dozen test results. Our local Boston Club bought some kits and had a "water testing day." The kits can also become part of the "library" of a local club for aquarists to use once in a while to see if their systems are functioning. That way, the cost to each aquarist is minimal.