Salt Mix "Raw Materials"?

[GoVols]

I certainly can't speak for any other salt manufacturer, but Tropic Marin purchases the chemical components, for it's salt mixes, from sources that we have been using for many years. We depend on these sources to keep our supply consistent. And they have proven to be very dependable over the years. That being said, we routinely check the quality of raw materials coming in for the manufacturing process to insure this quality even using pharmaceutical grade raw materials.

Thank You.

 

[MarsRover]

ahhh, but you put it out there and I am glad you did.

My thought was, I wonder if all the pharm salt used in salt mixes are manufactured in one place, then mixed by the brands and packaged. if so this is were some inconsistencies to could take place in the raw product.

I read some were that there was a large pharm salt company in Israel.

Lol,
Tagging with ya!

The company that makes Red Sea Salt uses seawater (from the red sea) that's pumped into evaporation ponds, there is a chain of them and the seawater is moved from one to the next, in each pond different elements are left behind, heavy metals in the first for example. In the final pond what is left is nearly pure NaCl, to which they add back the other stuff (supposedly)

Yes! Red Sea Fish Pharm is Israeli. They do apparently take water from the Red Sea and purify it through some means to some sort of salt base and then mix in what's needed to bring it to what they sell on the shelves. If it is true that what is left in the "final pond" is pure NaCl, then the entire process is pointless because making NaCl from scratch, from an ocean, or from something on the moon doesn't matter....it's all NaCl. NOW, "nearly"pure NaCl is what matters. That extra stuff with the NaCl from the Red Sea is their claim to greatness in their salt. I can't say anything as to the quality of the salt. I used it for mixing about 60 gallons and nothing bad happened to my tank. FWIW...

I certainly can't speak for any other salt manufacturer, but Tropic Marin purchases the chemical components, for it's salt mixes, from sources that we have been using for many years. We depend on these sources to keep our supply consistent. And they have proven to be very dependable over the years. That being said, we routinely check the quality of raw materials coming in for the manufacturing process to insure this quality even using pharmaceutical grade raw materials.

This is an excellent answer and I'd hope all of salt makers out there do the same. I'd find it hard to imagine they could produce a consistent chemical product without first checking their ingredients. It's back to the cooking in the kitchen analogy: before you use milk to drink/cook, you make darn sure it hasn't gone bad right?

@Lou Ekus, question for you. How does your company ensure that small batches have a consistent chemical/elemental composition? In other words, how do you folks ensure that if i take a scoop of tropic marin or if i take a truck load of tropic marin, the mix will have the same elemental concentrations? My assumption in how salt is "made" is it is a liquid solution with the company specified parameters. Then the water is boiled out and the resulting salt scrapped up, bagged, and tagged?

Thank you!

 

[jsker]

Yes! Red Sea Fish Pharm is Israeli. They do apparently take water from the Red Sea and purify it through some means to some sort of salt base and then mix in what's needed to bring it to what they sell on the shelves. If it is true that what is left in the "final pond" is pure NaCl, then the entire process is pointless because making NaCl from scratch, from an ocean, or from something on the moon doesn't matter....it's all NaCl. NOW, "nearly"pure NaCl is what matters. That extra stuff with the NaCl from the Red Sea is their claim to greatness in their salt. I can't say anything as to the quality of the salt. I used it for mixing about 60 gallons and nothing bad happened to my tank. FWIW...



This is an excellent answer and I'd hope all of salt makers out there do the same. I'd find it hard to imagine they could produce a consistent chemical product without first checking their ingredients. It's back to the cooking in the kitchen analogy: before you use milk to drink/cook, you make darn sure it hasn't gone bad right?

@Lou Ekus, question for you. How does your company ensure that small batches have a consistent chemical/elemental composition? In other words, how do you folks ensure that if i take a scoop of tropic marin or if i take a truck load of tropic marin, the mix will have the same elemental concentrations? My assumption in how salt is "made" is it is a liquid solution with the company specified parameters. Then the water is boiled out and the resulting salt scrapped up, bagged, and tagged?

Thank you!

Great follow up @MarsRover Thank you for your answer @Lou Ekus

My guess is that the raw NaCl is dry mixed with the manufactures prefered recipe to keep costs down of rehydration, dehydration. I have read some when they get a new box/bucket mix it before use because they feel that some of the components settling in the shipping process.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

FWIW, thee is a well established order of salts precipitating from seawater at various levels of concentration. So folks can get different salts or mixes of salts depending on how much water is removed.

 

[GoVols]

@MarsRover
I agree that Red Sea uses the "natural water" as a marketing ploy to the fact that Israeli is limited to fresh water and it could be cheaper for them to start the process in ponds.

But I've had very good success with their salts being very consistent from bucket to bucket or batch to batch.
When I have used their salts my reef had no decline.

Thanks, GoVols

 

[Rick.45cal]

FWIW, thee is a well established order of salts precipitating from seawater at various levels of concentration. So folks can get different salts or mixes of salts depending on how much water is removed.

It makes sense why a series of evaporation ponds are used by Red Sea. They can control (to a degree) what elements will precipitate out in which pond. When it's time to harvest the precipitate you just pump the water out and load it up for processing. (I also never had any issues with their salt and I have used hundreds of gallons of it in my tank).

I like Tropic Marin's answer. The sources of anything is fundamentally the most important thing to any ingredient. That's true in all aspects of life. So we have the right ingredients from the right sources and we have the recipe right...

But the real question in salt manufacture comes down to batch mixing/packaging methodology. That's where the rubber meets the road. There's a fair amount of technology and engineering required to do this correctly, some of which may be a proprietary methodology/technology to the manufacuturer (which I understand). But let's face it... tossing bags of chemicals in a cement mixer and running it, isn't the best way to ensure a homogenous mixture of powders. So too me, this question is almost more relevant to the consumer. I would think it would be a source of pride for the salt manufacturer unless it's just two guys with front end loaders mixing it .

I use IO now, it's cheap and has been very consistent over the years, and I actually prefer a salt that is lower (than my parameters) in Ca and Mg levels, I'm going to test and boost the levels to match my tank's parameters anyway, it's just how I have always done it. Plus everything in my tank seems to like it as much as or more than any other salt I have tried. (I can change twice the amount of water for the same price as some salts too).

 

[GoVols]

But the real question in salt manufacture comes down to batch mixing/packaging methodology. That's where the rubber meets the road. There's a fair amount of technology and engineering required to do this correctly, some of which may be a proprietary methodology/technology to the manufacuturer (which I understand). But let's face it... tossing bags of chemicals in a cement mixer and running it, isn't the best way to ensure a homogenous mixture of powders. So too me, this question is almost more relevant to the consumer. I would think it would be a source of pride for the salt manufacturer unless it's just two guys with front end loaders mixing it .

+1

This maybe the stupidest question of all time but (lol) I'm already the king of stupid questions.

Here Goes:
Could a manufacturer mix all the elements together in "liquid" form and then, produce each dry crystal that contains every element that was in liquid form?

Other words is it possible that each dry crystal could have all the elements contained inside of that crystal (making the dry mix more consistent), instead of having each crystal being a different element?

Lol!!!!
Randy, Please chime in.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

When crystals form they are mostly one chemical, like sodium chloride, magnesium sulfate heptahydrate, etc.

 

[GoVols]

When crystals form they are mostly one chemical, like sodium chloride, magnesium sulfate heptahydrate, etc.

That makes sense but... (lol) I just had to ask.

Thank You!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

That makes sense but... (lol) I just had to ask.

Thank You!

You're welcome.

Happy Reefing

 

[MarsRover]

+1

This maybe the stupidest question of all time but (lol) I'm already the king of stupid questions.

Here Goes:
Could a manufacturer mix all the elements together in "liquid" form and then, produce each dry crystal that contains every element that was in liquid form?

Other words is it possible that each dry crystal could have all the elements contained inside of that crystal (making the dry mix more consistent), instead of having each crystal being a different element?

Lol!!!!
Randy, Please chime in.

When crystals form they are mostly one chemical, like sodium chloride, magnesium sulfate heptahydrate, etc.

so you know what this means then..........they have to make tabletized salt mix..... 1 tablet + 1 gallon = perfect saltwater.

of course you'd run into issues of not only the desirement of the public for fast mixing, but also the issue that if a corner of the tablet breaks off you lose your perfect ratio..... so then we can say well remove corners that can break off....spheres but then we worry about tight-pack packaging efficiency.......dodecahedrons.....***marsrover rolls down the rabbit hole***....or just use multipart liquid mixes.... or multipart solid tabletized mixes....or....

 

[GoVols]

@MarsRover ............. You Da Man!...

But (lol)... Drop the tablets and go Gel Capsule's!!!!!!!!!!!

2 - "Gel Capsule's" per gallon and... "Call me in the morning"

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Randy,
Please don't hurt us.
(lol) It's only our pea sized brains at work.

 

[MarsRover]

@MarsRover ............. You Da Man!...

But (lol)... Drop the tablets and go Gel Capsule's!!!!!!!!!!!

2 - gel capsule's per gallon and... "Call me in the morning"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Randy,
Please don't hurt us.
(lol) It's only our pea sized brains at work.

Who's the pea-brain!?!? I maintain walnut size BARE MINIMUM!

plus, i'm sure, randy already has it out for me after i called him, and myself included, a "schmo" in another salt related thread sounds bad out of context but it was to prove a point regarding people who accept anything they read, written with enough assertion, as true!

back to work.....

 

[GoVols]

Who's the pea-brain!?!? I maintain walnut size BARE MINIMUM!

I'll be the Pea and you'll be the wal - Nut....

"Pea-Nut"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MarsRover]

I'll be the Pea and you'll be the wal - Nut....

"Pea-Nut"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

....not very good at making friends fast around here huh @GoVols

 

[120reefkeeper]

Interesting topic for sure. [emoji41]

 

[Daniel@R2R Verified Admin]

Very interesting read.

 

[drernesto Verified Sponsor]

As far as I know most of the salt is brought from Poland than they add whatever elements missing or low

 

[GoVols]

As far as I know most of the salt is brought from Poland than they add whatever elements missing or low

Can you verify that most companies use salt that comes from Poland?

 

[drernesto Verified Sponsor]

Of course not... what I know is most of the salt in the world comes from the salt mines in Poland. Not sure in this industry if they use it. But I was told that 3 big brands use Poland salt