Saltwater ich

[MnFish1]

It means that in powder form that light degrades it. Store it out of light.

Right - I know lol - I meant what does your post mean : If aquarium light will break it down or not is a subject of debate - I thought that meant you were suggesting that aquarium light WILL degrade it. That was my point. Perhaps I misunderstood. Aquarium light does not degrade it in the water - only in powder form - again it seemed like reading yoru post you were arguing the opposite.

 

[ktisdale22]

So if I do not have a QT big enough for all my fish I may have to take a chance treating in the DT? I just don't know how else to fix this...

 

[MnFish1]

So if I do not have a QT big enough for all my fish I may have to take a chance treating in the DT? I just don't know how else to fix this...

Can you get a 40 gallon tank an a sponge filter - and an air pump/heater? then use that? Or a rubbermaid tub. (though I'm not sure if CP adsorbs onto the plastic)

 

[ktisdale22]

Can I put 11 fish in a tank that small?

 

[MnFish1]

Can I put 11 fish in a tank that small?

need good water changer, aeration, flow

 

[Wildreefs]

No fish only. Have some hermit type crabs but that's it

I advise and would do what every importer, wholesaled and lfs does around the world, get yourself a copper meter, and run it in the system. With copper power, you can get it up to 2.0 , 2.1 over the course of 4-5 days, even a week, and measure daily so it does not go below , say 1.75.

Stores use sand in Most cases, alone with some live rock, and they manage copper, no reason why you the hobbyist shouldn’t

 

[ktisdale22]

Man that makes all the sense in the world! Thank you so much I. Not following Copper power, would you mind explaining that to me? Thank you very much

 

[JaimeAdams]

Right - I know lol - I meant what does your post mean : If aquarium light will break it down or not is a subject of debate - I thought that meant you were suggesting that aquarium light WILL degrade it. That was my point. Perhaps I misunderstood. Aquarium light does not degrade it in the water - only in powder form - again it seemed like reading yoru post you were arguing the opposite.

The other guy said that it degrades with aquarium light. I was acknowledging that some sources say that it breaks down a bit while other sources say that it will not once dosed. Mostly in response to the other guy. According to all sources while in powder form, prior to adding to water, light does degrade it. I linked a 71 page thread talking about CP and in that is the discussion on light degradation.

@ktisdale22 Copper Power is a product name. I would highly suggest going to the disease sub forum https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/fish-disease-treatment-and-diagnosis.771/ and start researching for yourself. Dosing copper in a display tank is tricky. I would not even if experience try it without purchasing a hannah copper checker. Keep in mind that if at any point copper level falls below therapeutic range even for a few seconds you risk reinfection. Your rock and sand will absorb some of the copper so while you may dose to 1.75 the next day or day after you might only have 1.40 or some other level active in the water. The absorption of copper is what makes dosing it into a display tank difficult. Also keep in mind all of your clean up crew will die from the copper. After treating you will need to remove the copper and run media to absord the copper that will then be leaching back out of all of your rock before you can add and snail or hermit crab or anything like that back into your tank. Another option would be to add something like Seachem's Matrix which is a bio media that will not absorb copper, a bunch of PVC fittings and remove all of the rock prior to treatment.

 

[MnFish1]

The other guy said that it degrades with aquarium light. I was acknowledging that some sources say that it breaks down a bit while other sources say that it will not once dosed. Mostly in response to the other guy. According to all sources while in powder form, prior to adding to water, light does degrade it. I linked a 71 page thread talking about CP and in that is the discussion on light degradation.

LOL - I know - we agree - Chloroquine degrades in powder form in light - not so much when it's dissolved.

 

[cmcoker]

The alternative could be to remove your rocks and sand and CUC to bins, keep them heated circulated, treat the fish in the display tank.
A one or a couple brute trashcans could probably hold all your rocks and cleanup crew. Just make sure and account for all your fish, that one is not accidentally moved to a holding bin.
I'd still use a hannah checker for treatment and to make sure all traces of copper are removed at the end.

 

[KyleC.]

Can you set-up multiple little tanks? 2-3 20G.. Lots of people with tanks & filters on craigslist. I could get you PVC fittings, for hide outs... I currently have a 20H QT set-up, running copper power and the Hannah Checker is seriously as useful as the Hanna DKH checker! I love it. As already suggested, you just need purchase more reagents at the same time though...

I am not as experienced as some of these guys, but from what I have read, it is NOT a good thing to treat fish in a display.

 

[ktisdale22]

Oh man... My wife would lose it if I had that many tanks going... The LPS treat there fish with in the system so there has to be a way...ugh!!!

 

[JaimeAdams]

Oh man... My wife would lose it if I had that many tanks going... The LPS treat there fish with in the system so there has to be a way...ugh!!!

If you are in Pittsburgh, no the LFS do not treat their tanks with copper with rock/sand in them. Some just running a bank of UV sterilizers and just tell you that every tank has Ich. Others just sell sick fish. Others run sub therapeutic levels of copper and are not concerned with eradicating the parasite completely which can be done with some rock. Where I work, we don't have rock or sand in our tanks so that if I ever see anything I can actually treat the system and kill any parasite. I imagine that rock would eventually absorb as much copper as it can over time given multiple applications of copper and at some point it's absorption of new copper would be limited. Any system at the store that you see them selling coral or clean up crew stuff out of you can be certain is never treated with copper.

 

[rkpetersen]

I personally wouldn't do anything requiring chemical treatment of my DT.
We don't fully understand the effects of these medications on all aquarium inhabitants.
Plus as mentioned, accurate dosing is impossible due to absorption to rocks, sand and other surfaces.

It's been my experience, several times now, that you can completely eliminate crypto by maintaining good water quality, lots of flow, 100 micron filter socks, an oversized UV sterilizer, ozone on your skimmer, and lots of cleaner shrimp in the tank. Many people would call this 'ich management', rather than a cure, and I won't dispute that, but when there's been no sign of the disease for well over a year, in practical terms that's a cure.

 

[MnFish1]

I personally wouldn't do anything requiring chemical treatment of my DT.
We don't fully understand the effects of these medications on all aquarium inhabitants.
Plus as mentioned, accurate dosing is impossible due to absorption to rocks, sand and other surfaces.

It's been my experience, several times now, that you can completely eliminate crypto by maintaining good water quality, lots of flow, 100 micron filter socks, an oversized UV sterilizer, ozone on your skimmer, and lots of cleaner shrimp in the tank. Many people would call this 'ich management', rather than a cure, and I won't dispute that, but when there's been no sign of the disease for well over a year, in practical terms that's a cure.

The one thing I find in common with many of the ich management tanks is a relatively low stocking density. I think this helps quite a bit as well

 

[ktisdale22]

I am in Pittsburgh and Appreciate the explanation. So you have any recommendations on how to cure my ich problem?

Is this too much live stock for a 180 gallon with a 75 gallon Sump?
Koran Angel
Half blk angel
2 pajamas
2 clowns
Yellow Tang
Raccoon butterfly
2 squirrel fish
Blenny
40-50 small crabs

I thought I had room for more fish to be honeat

 

[rkpetersen]

I am in Pittsburgh and Appreciate the explanation. So you have any recommendations on how to cure my ich problem?

Is this too much live stock for a 180 gallon with a 75 gallon Sump?
Koran Angel
Half blk angel
2 pajamas
2 clowns
Yellow Tang
Raccoon butterfly
2 squirrel fish
Blenny
40-50 small crabs

I thought I had room for more fish to be honeat

I wouldn't say that's crowded.
If it were me, I'd buy a large UV sterilizer and run it continuously.
Buy a sterilizer that will kill parasites, not just bacteria and algae, at a flow rate of 300 gph or so.
Slower flow rate, more microbial killing, but you also want it fast enough to turn over your tank's water.

I'd also add a bunch of skunk cleaner shrimp.
They may or may not pick parasites off of the bodies of fishes.
But there is some evidence that they actively search for and eat the tomont stage of the parasite off rocks.
Anyway, I always have several large enthusiastic ones in my tanks.

I personally love running ozone and it probably damages some parasites in addition to other benefits.
But it's not for everyone and I wouldn't recommend starting with it necessarily.

 

[ktisdale22]

Thank very much. I have a 57watt UV on the tank. I have had it off for the past week while I treated the tank with herbal ich medications. I have an additional UV but I didn't think it would help, should I install it? Also it is my Raccoon butterfly that seems to be the worse as it relates to ich. In the morning the raccoon has white spots all over it, after I use Herbal Lift an hour later the spots are gone. I do have a skunk wrasse think I should get another?

Anything you can suggest is very helpful!
Thanks again!

 

[ktisdale22]

I have never used an ozone and have no idea what it does or how to use it. I assume I should stay away from it, was reading that ozone is harmful to breathe in so that is certainly concerning being I haven't used one in the past

 

[Mmun]

C

I'm not to worried about the crabs actually I just do not want to flush a few hundred dollars down the toilet

copper power