Scrape my tank or buy algae in a bottle

Chrysemys · Dec 23, 2018

I have my second tank starting to cycle. I made a few mistakes with the first tank which include introducing unfavorable algae and apistasia. I want to avoid those in this tank. Last time I added a purple algae in a bottle product to load it with coralline spores and it took over 8 months for coralline to arrive. It is still not “wow that’s awesome” more like “uh I think that’s coralline and oh there is some on the power heads.”
1. Should I risk taking scrapings from my old tank? Will those scrapings hide unwanted critters?
2.Buy an algae in the bottle product because y’all have had success with it?
3.Or find a friend with a good source of coralline.
“Excuse me, you have a beautiful reef tank. Um you mind if I take a scraping or two?” (That might be an awkward interaction.)

CC13 · Dec 23, 2018

Chrysemys said:
I have my second tank starting to cycle. I made a few mistakes with the first tank which include introducing unfavorable algae and apistasia. I want to avoid those in this tank. Last time I added a purple algae in a bottle product to load it with coralline spores and it took over 8 months for coralline to arrive. It is still not “wow that’s awesome” more like “uh I think that’s coralline and oh there is some on the power heads.”
1. Should I risk taking scrapings from my old tank? Will those scrapings hide unwanted critters?
2.Buy an algae in the bottle product because y’all have had success with it?
3.Or find a friend with a good source of coralline.
“Excuse me, you have a beautiful reef tank. Um you mind if I take a scraping or two?” (That might be an awkward interaction.)

Technically, anytime you add something wet into your tank, you run the risk of introducing parasites, disease, algae and other unwanted elements. Saying that, at some point, you need to seed with LR which carried the same risk.

I would choose a tank that has no visible unwanted critters, full of coraline, and add it to your system. Even better if the person you get the LR from quarantines all their fish for diseases so the chances of you getting diseases like ICH or Velvet are drastically reduced,

Reefbuds · Dec 23, 2018

Just add a new piece of purple live rock and supplement purple tech.

Chrysemys · Dec 23, 2018

Adding a “wet” live rock is what I’m trying to avoid. One live rock brought in all my problems in my other tank. Is it essential to seed with a live rock? What would I be losing out on by just introducing the coralline spores?

Is the purple tech product anymore effective than kalk +2 seems like a similar solution?

CC13 · Dec 23, 2018

Chrysemys said:
Adding a “wet” live rock is what I’m trying to avoid. One live rock brought in all my problems in my other tank. Is it essential to seed with a live rock? What would I be losing out on by just introducing the coralline spores?

Is the purple tech product anymore effective than kalk +2 seems like a similar solution?

Your going to need to add LR at some point or you won’t have any beneficial bacteria. You can QT your liverock if you really want but regardless adding Coraline isn’t the only type of bacteria your system will need.

Chrysemys · Dec 23, 2018

Thanks for helping me think this through. I am relying on Dr Tim’s and the “live” sand (which I understand is just sand with bacteria added) for the nitrifying bacteria. Still missing an ingredient that I would get from a “wet” live rock?

Honestly if I wasn’t paranoid from the last time, I would get some live rock. I like the quarantine idea I could work with that if adding a rock is inevitable.

CC13 · Dec 24, 2018

Chrysemys said:
Thanks for helping me think this through. I am relying on Dr Tim’s and the “live” sand (which I understand is just sand with bacteria added) for the nitrifying bacteria. Still missing an ingredient that I would get from a “wet” live rock?

Honestly if I wasn’t paranoid from the last time, I would get some live rock. I like the quarantine idea I could work with that if adding a rock is inevitable.

Ya I understand, your trying to control and limit the exposure of unwanted pests or diseases into your system. You can QT the LR is you want, which would allow you to observe for pests and if you leave it in there for 72ish days, then ICH and related diseases will die.

Personally there is a point when adding stuff to the tank just gets added. I QT all fish but what about macro algae, inverts, etc? I personally don’t QT stuff like chaeto I feel like the risk of low enough event though technically it could also carry stuff with it.

To answer your main question, yes at some point, your going to neee to add LR and it would be great if it were 1-2 lbs from 4-5 different properly cared for tanks. Your diversity would be pretty good to seed your tank.

lapin · Dec 24, 2018

Keeping unwanted things out of your tank is an admiral task. I wish you luck. I feel you can achieve this to some extent. More so under strict lab conditions. You can QT things and keep some stuff out. But are you going to qt, feed and treat snails, macro algae, corals and fish and any live food enough to prevent all things from coming in? Prob not. If you want coralline and dont want to risk wet scrapings then add the bottle. If you dont get much add it again and again. The bacteria you need will come in on corals and inverts, if you add them. It lives deep in pores of shells, frag plugs and rocks your corals will come on. Some will come in on the coral themselves. Live rock is a much faster process but I dont believe you really have to have it to create a successful tank.
Oh and Murphys law applies to coralline. If you really want it, it will prob take forever to grow. If you dont want it on your glass, thats the first place it will grow...ect.....

Arcticfirefighter · Dec 24, 2018

I just started my tank in August, and used mostly new dry rock and live sand. I did however add about 10 lbs of live rock and a bottle of ARC Purple Helix. I had good growth of coralline algea in about 6 weeks. Now the live rock I put in is pretty much covered, while the new dry rock I added at the same time is just starting to show spots. This is a pic of one of the live rocks after about 4-5 months, versus the dry rock just below it to the right. Not really sure what dark red spots are, they show up every now and then and then they go away.

CC13 · Dec 24, 2018

lapin said:
Keeping unwanted things out of your tank is an admiral task. I wish you luck. I feel you can achieve this to some extent. More so under strict lab conditions. You can QT things and keep some stuff out. But are you going to qt, feed and treat snails, macro algae, corals and fish and any live food enough to prevent all things from coming in? Prob not. If you want coralline and dont want to risk wet scrapings then add the bottle. If you don't get much add it again and again. The bacteria you need will come in on corals and inverts, if you add them. It lives deep in pores of shells, frag plugs and rocks your corals will come on. Some will come in on the coral themselves. Live rock is a much faster process but I dont believe you really have to have it to create a successful tank.
Oh and Murphys law applies to coralline. If you really want it, it will prob take forever to grow. If you dont want it on your glass, thats the first place it will grow...ect.....

I agree with this.

Flexin · Dec 24, 2018

Chrysemys said:
Adding a “wet” live rock is what I’m trying to avoid. One live rock brought in all my problems in my other tank. Is it essential to seed with a live rock? What would I be losing out on by just introducing the coralline spores?

Is the purple tech product anymore effective than kalk +2 seems like a similar solution?

You can add live rock from Carib Sea or Reel Reef since it tends not to have those unwanted pests. I've used both in different tanks and it cut down on problems (any I have I created or introduced with a coral or fish).

Chrysemys · Dec 24, 2018

Thanks for all the input.
I know if I want more than a tub of salt water to stare at, I run the risk of adding something unwanted? I just have it in my mind that live rock is the riskiest. There are so many nooks and crannies and tiny little pores.
So my conclusions to the original questions. Scraping my tank is the dumbest idea ever.
Live rock is the way to go if you can bring yourself to take the risk, but don’t be hung up on the what that risk is. You risk adding an unwanted element everytime you open the lid. Be smart about it and add a piece you trust. Do some time in QT if you want to reduce the risk a bit.
The algae in a bottle products work, but patience is key. I suspect all the “learning moments” I had with the first tank affected the performance of the product the first time I used it.
As always, I feel a little more informed about my choices moving forward.
A pic so you can see what I’m working on....

A lot of darn surface area for anything unwanted to cause me a lot of problems. Plan to focus on fish with a few hardy corals. Which is why I want a lot of purple coralline encrusted rock.

markfmvl · Dec 24, 2018

Arcticfirefighter said:
I just started my tank in August, and used mostly new dry rock and live sand. I did however add about 10 lbs of live rock and a bottle of ARC Purple Helix. I had good growth of coralline algea in about 6 weeks. Now the live rock I put in is pretty much covered, while the new dry rock I added at the same time is just starting to show spots. This is a pic of one of the live rocks after about 4-5 months, versus the dry rock just below it to the right. Not really sure what dark red spots are, they show up every now and then and then they go away.

There are many colors of coraline algae.