Should coral fragging be banned?

[MiniGbr]

Additionally, since I think a lot of reefers want to do good, or help in ways they can, I would say the biggest thing to look at is how we buy our critters. There may come a time that the world needs to pull from the hobby the gene's we store in our small tanks, but ultimately what we can do is put less pressure on the reef in whatever small way we can. It may not seem like much, but 1% of change done by a lot of people can start making change.

So how do we remove pressure from the reefs...? Fragging (not on the reefs, but within the hobby). The main solution I advocate for would be to buy aquaculture coral and fish. My hobby tank is made entirely out of of aquaculture coral and fish (minus a Lobo and a Chromis). Maricultured coral would be next. Wild colonies should ideally be avoided. Unfortunately that's not 100% possible, because every aquaculture facility/farm is looking for that next designer coral, but we can stick to the beauties that already exist in the hobby!. And even better, the change from wild to aquaculture is not just a 1% change, this can be 99.9% change! Is it more expensive, yes, but is it better, absolutely!

Someone also mentioned that scientists don't look to hobbyists for help or solutions. I'm not sure that's entirely true. Do hobbyists have something to offer the real world efforts of rebuilding or cleaning up the ocean. Absolutely. A recent case I saw in action was a study and project here in Florida trying to use massive protein skimmers to aide in removing excess fertilizer from wasteful agricultural practices caused by the tomato and sugar cane fields that run into lake Okeechobee and then eventually into the ocean. The theory is that this will help to remove organics that would otherwise run out to the oceans, that lead to bacterial blooms and red tides, which in turn leads to the massive die offs we see of all animals and plants in the area. This protein skimmer idea may have some place in helping cleanup some of the problem. And that's basically a hobbyist idea turned into a theory, converted into a study, that mayyyyy lead to actionable practices. So there's at least ne example, and there are many more. Problem is that science takes time, and not just a come up with a bunch of ideas and "see what sticks" mentality.

 

[Freakmachine01]

Absolutely not no way no how. Just look at the facts over the past 20 years what did we lose 80 90% of all of our coral reefs. I believe fragging is the only way that we could keep growing Coral and attempt to bring these areas back life.

 

[MnFish1]

Absolutely not no way no how. Just look at the facts over the past 20 years what did we lose 80 90% of all of our coral reefs. I believe fragging is the only way that we could keep growing Coral and attempt to bring these areas back life.

Not trying to minimize the issue at all - but - we did not lose 80-90% of our coral reefs in the last 20 years. I posted this article before - which paints both a distressing and hopeful picture for the future.

 

[MnFish1]

Additionally, since I think a lot of reefers want to do good, or help in ways they can, I would say the biggest thing to look at is how we buy our critters. There may come a time that the world needs to pull from the hobby the gene's we store in our small tanks, but ultimately what we can do is put less pressure on the reef in whatever small way we can. It may not seem like much, but 1% of change done by a lot of people can start making change.

So how do we remove pressure from the reefs...? Fragging (not on the reefs, but within the hobby). The main solution I advocate for would be to buy aquaculture coral and fish. My hobby tank is made entirely out of of aquaculture coral and fish (minus a Lobo and a Chromis). Maricultured coral would be next. Wild colonies should ideally be avoided. Unfortunately that's not 100% possible, because every aquaculture facility/farm is looking for that next designer coral, but we can stick to the beauties that already exist in the hobby!. And even better, the change from wild to aquaculture is not just a 1% change, this can be 99.9% change! Is it more expensive, yes, but is it better, absolutely!

Someone also mentioned that scientists don't look to hobbyists for help or solutions. I'm not sure that's entirely true. Do hobbyists have something to offer the real world efforts of rebuilding or cleaning up the ocean. Absolutely. A recent case I saw in action was a study and project here in Florida trying to use massive protein skimmers to aide in removing excess fertilizer from wasteful agricultural practices caused by the tomato and sugar cane fields that run into lake Okeechobee and then eventually into the ocean. The theory is that this will help to remove organics that would otherwise run out to the oceans, that lead to bacterial blooms and red tides, which in turn leads to the massive die offs we see of all animals and plants in the area. This protein skimmer idea may have some place in helping cleanup some of the problem. And that's basically a hobbyist idea turned into a theory, converted into a study, that mayyyyy lead to actionable practices. So there's at least ne example, and there are many more. Problem is that science takes time, and not just a come up with a bunch of ideas and "see what sticks" mentality.

The problem with what you're saying (at the top) - is that this hobby puts very little 'pressure on the reefs'. The coral deaths in the GBR are not related to 'the hobby', for example. Fragging will help 'the hobby' - because corals will continue to be available. IMHO -it will not help 'the ocean'. The ocean will recover when/if the man-made problems are improved.

 

[jp_75]

Fragging should only be banned if the frag is under 1 inch tall!!

 

[MiniGbr]

The problem with what you're saying (at the top) - is that this hobby puts very little 'pressure on the reefs'. The coral deaths in the GBR are not related to 'the hobby', for example. Fragging will help 'the hobby' - because corals will continue to be available. IMHO -it will not help 'the ocean'. The ocean will recover when/if the man-made problems are improved.

The pressure on the reef I was referencing was mostly related to pollution and other human related causes, like shipping, fisheries, cruises, etc.

But I would argue we do put some added pressure from our hobby. There’s a reason yellow tangs we’re cut off for the hobby from Hawaii, and Fiji and Florida don’t allow live rock to be exported anymore, or Florida limited the ricordea gathering for a long while, and also won’t allow any staghorn to be harvested for the hobby anymore. I mean, fish are still gathered using cyanide in many places!, so that’s not great. So we do put pressure on reefs in our hobby. The debate I guess is how much, but all the prior examples are saying something.

And still, I agree, that fragging within the hobby is absolutely what we should be doing. In fact, that’s all we should be doing. If we limited ourselves within the hobby to only aquacultured coral and fish, then we aren’t adding any pressure whatsoever. That’s a pipe dream I realize, but just saying.

 

[MiniGbr]

Not trying to minimize the issue at all - but - we did not lose 80-90% of our coral reefs in the last 20 years. I posted this article before - which paints both a distressing and hopeful picture for the future.

That’s a good listen btw

 

[MnFish1]

But I would argue we do put some added pressure from our hobby. There’s a reason yellow tangs we’re cut off for the hobby from Hawaii, and Fiji and Florida don’t allow live rock to be exported anymore, or Florida limited the ricordea gathering for a long while, and also won’t allow any staghorn to be harvested for the hobby anymore.

And yet - there are plenty of people that state that the Hawaii ban was ridiculous. The stag horn/elkhorn population was wiped out in 1970-80 (90%) - by white band disease. And - I think Florida way back when - was being overused for rock retrieval. Again I'm not trying to minimize the issue.

 

[Rick's Reviews]

I think fragging is a perfect way of keeping corals alive and ongoing, we all own a aquarium and call it a mini sea in our homes however big or small. if one coral is dying in our natural Ocean and 10000 own one then surely this is better then it dying in our polluted oceans ?

 

[Rick's Reviews]

I think fragging is a perfect way of keeping corals alive and ongoing, we all own a aquarium and call it a mini sea in our homes however big or small. if one coral is dying in our natural Ocean and 10000 own one then surely this is better then it dying in our polluted oceans ?

Like a zoo/ conservation (sorry)

 

[MnFish1]

I think fragging is a perfect way of keeping corals alive and ongoing, we all own a aquarium and call it a mini sea in our homes however big or small. if one coral is dying in our natural Ocean and 10000 own one then surely this is better then it dying in our polluted oceans ?

Yes - totally agree. Fragging is fine. Fragging corals from Indonesia - and putting them in Florida IMHO - is not fine.

 

[Freakmachine01]

Not trying to minimize the issue at all - but - we did not lose 80-90% of our coral reefs in the last 20 years. I posted this article before - which paints both a distressing and hopeful picture for the future.

Yes, I did exaggerate. Because to ME that is what it feels like. 80-90% The research does show a 50% loss since the 1950's.

The Planet Has Lost Half of Its Coral Reefs Since 1950

A new study finds dramatic declines in coral reef cover, biodiversity and fish abundance

www.smithsonianmag.com

 

[MnFish1]

Yes, I did exaggerate. Because to ME that is what it feels like. 80-90% The research does show a 50% loss since the 1950's.

The Planet Has Lost Half of Its Coral Reefs Since 1950

A new study finds dramatic declines in coral reef cover, biodiversity and fish abundance

www.smithsonianmag.com

The ocean surface temperature since 1950 has increased at an average of 1.5 degrees Fahrenheit. I'm going to buck the trend - because - people want to yell 'climate change' - I am going to go with acidification and pollution - either way - it's a problem. And of course acidification - is related to CO2 - except the most recent news - Nitrogen also plays a factor. Perhaps we should all go back into the 1500's. https://theconversation.com/nitrogen-pollution-the-forgotten-element-of-climate-change-69348

 

[Tranquility Bay]

No way; can't happen; and for me, not so much for selling, but for weed control. A couple corals I have grow like weeds....Candy Cane and Hollywood Stunner, to mention 2. This one here is a good foot across:

And here's my field of Candy Cane:

Fragging really isn't my issue, it's what to do with them. It's gotten to the point that I can't even give these frags away, and I hate just throwing them away....that's why I have this gigantic mess!


In regard to question #2, this guy is dreaming (and I had to calm down to give this family friendly response). I've found that dead reefs have an even more difficult time with genetic diversity. If fragging and seeding dead reefs is bad for coral diversity, what does this scholar recommend to restore the reefs? I've attended two talks by Ken Nedimyer who founded Coral Restoration Foundation in Florida. When I saw totally dead reefs in Florida, I was shocked. They actually include genetic info and consideration on their reseeding programs. It certainly is better then doing nothing.

And to finish up, our local club's motto is "Saving the World's reefs one living room at a time." With the continued global warming, and death of reefs around the world, there might come a time were the only place you will find coral reefs would be in aquariums.

As far as you having more corals than you know what to DO with, I can HELP you with that! I represent a Veteran's Organization - https://coralfraggingvets.org. We help set Veteran's up with Reef Tanks as a therapy for PTSD , Anxiety, etc. & it WORKS! I am the Outreach Liaison for the organization & we'd be delighted to have you hook us up!
Contact us - https://www.facebook.com/CoralFraggingVets

And PERSONALLY, as soon as I get a tank ready & wet, I'd LOVE to take all the corals you'd be willing to part with ! Thanks!

 

[Jewslim]

I'll start by saying NO, Of course not, negative, NO WAY and that's just my opinion but I thought it could make for an interesting topic. How did I even come up with this question? Well I ran into this articled called Coral Fragging Should Be Banned. My hot take is the author believes the process should be banned based on genetic implications and adaptation. Let's talk about it!

1. Should coral fragging be banned?

2. What are your thoughts on genetic implications and adaptation issues (as the author states) caused by coral fragging?

image via @therman

Hello everyone's Reefing business: I was always afraid to buy coral frags online, but hence since now I'm averaging a 90% success rate than my LFM. Please KEEP fragging. Thank you

 

[polyppal]

Thank you for responding! Hahaha! See it gets opinions going. Wait until I drop that Kirk was the worst captain! You are local correct? (Colorado?)

Oh yeah Kirk sucks, no argument there…
Yup Denver, check out the link in my signature!