Should I be worried? Dots all over quarantined fish

[Slocke]

Got a couple fish fully quarantined from a well respected source (don't know if I should say) yesterday. Both appear to be very healthy in terms of behavior but after doing some close up photos I noticed the exquisite fairy wrasse I got was covered in little white dots. It eats really well and shows no signs of irritation (flashing, powerhead etc). It also isn't getting any special attention from the cleaner wrasse.
I've never had a disease outbreak before nor noticed any odd dots on any other fish. I've only recently started getting quarantined fish though. I also don't keep any "ich magnets".
#fishmedic

Parameters are all good:

• 1.025
• 79F
• 11Alk
• 10 Nitrate
• 0.3 Phosphate

I do have a spare 10 gallon but its not set up.

 

[Hungrypede]

Following this. I’ve got an order coming in from the same vendor tomorrow. There’s very clearly spots on the right pectoral of your exquisite.

Clean the glass, take more pictures, and send Mike an email to document/ask if he’s heard any similar reports.

I hope you keep the updates coming. Sounds like I’ll be setting up the observation tank for my delivery tomorrow instead of throwing them in the DT…

 

[dwest]

It looks to me that the exquisite has ich. Let’s see if @Jay Hemdal is around.

 

[Ben.QLD2]

That wrasse has a cryptocaryon infection - marine whitespot. If it was quarantined, questions need to be asked about the quarantine method.

Now you're in a situation where all of your fish will need treatment, and your DT will need a 6 week or so fallow period.

 

[Slocke]

An obvious follow up question then is: How quickly can whatever this is spread and show this amount of spots? Those photos were taken about 24 hours after adding to the tank

 

[Sebastiancrab]

Any fish in the tank are fully exposed to it and need to be treated.

 

[Hungrypede]

An obvious follow up question then is: How quickly can whatever this is spread and show this amount of spots? Those photos were taken about 24 hours after adding to the tank

Let’s cover some bases;

1. Clean your glass and plop a chair in front of the tank. Stare at the other fish for a while. Are you sure no other fish are showing similar?

2. Any other additions to the tank within the past ~30 days? Coral, inverts, etc.

3. Were previous fish quarantined?

 

[Slocke]

Let’s cover some bases;

1. Clean your glass and plop a chair in front of the tank. Stare at the other fish for a while. Are you sure no other fish are showing similar?

2. Any other additions to the tank within the past ~30 days? Coral, inverts, etc.

3. Were previous fish quarantined?

1. No. Almost certain there no other dots on other fish. Pictures are from previous couple weeks. The leopard wrasse has a had a large odd looking dot on its pectoral fin right at the top near the tail but its had that forever and never shown more than one dot.
2. A lunatus fairy wrasse pictured and a colony of goniopora.
3. Not truly. My LFS claims to quarantine but it's only 2 weeks. Many fish were captive bred directly from breeder too.

Thanks for the help BTW

 

[vetteguy53081]

Got a couple fish fully quarantined from a well respected source (don't know if I should say) yesterday. Both appear to be very healthy in terms of behavior but after doing some close up photos I noticed the exquisite fairy wrasse I got was covered in little white dots. It eats really well and shows no signs of irritation (flashing, powerhead etc). It also isn't getting any special attention from the cleaner wrasse.
I've never had a disease outbreak before nor noticed any odd dots on any other fish. I've only recently started getting quarantined fish though. I also don't keep any "ich magnets".
#fishmedic

Parameters are all good:

• 1.025
• 79F
• 11Alk
• 10 Nitrate
• 0.3 Phosphate

I do have a spare 10 gallon but its not set up.

These fish do have ich which is often triggered by stress, exposure to other sources and chilling while in transit. Even though there are fish available as quarantined, always assume they have parasites and quarantine upon arrival as an assurance/imsurance.
You will need to place fish in Quarantine tank and treat with Coppersafe or Copper Power at therapeutic level 2.25-2.5 For a FULL 30 days (do not interrupt this 30 day period) monitored by a reliable Copper Test kit such as Hanna Brand- No API brand. Also monitor Ammonia levels while in quarantine with a reliable test kit and add aeration during treatment using an air stone.
The display tank will have to be kept fishless (FALLOW) for 6-8 weeks to assure the existing parasites go through their life cycle without a host fish and die off
A quarantine tank can be as simple as a starter kit from Walmart which most of the needed essentials.

i'd be interested to hear what they state their method of QT is.

 

[Petcrazyson]

I feel bad now. I‘m glad I pointed it out the wrasse had something but I know I’ve now started worrying you. I agree with the others that it’s ich.

 

[Isaac Alves]

Why are we not mentioning the vendor? I think this community needs to hold vendors accountable -- it will keep QT vendors honest as well as push them to increase their bio security standards.

 

[Slocke]

An obvious follow up question then is: How quickly can whatever this is spread and show this amount of spots? Those photos were taken about 24 hours after adding to the tank

I want this questioned answered before I mention a vendor. I don't know much about ich but I have worked in epidemiology and I know that quarantine can be detrimental to the immune system. As I understand it you can have ich and never have an outbreak if your fish are otherwise healthy. So I want to know if it is possible that this fish caught it from my tank and got this level of infection within 24 hours?

 

[Hungrypede]

Slocke - do you run UV?

I ran into velvet from a LFS purchase a couple years ago and went through 3 rounds of fallow. Once for 6 weeks (we think failed due to low copper levels), once for 76 days (we think failed to cross contamination), and one for 100 days, which sorted the velvet completely.

I learned a couple things during the process with the main being I don’t like quarantining. Since then I’ve had 5 orders from this vendor without issue. 100% of the fish in my tank are from this vendor.

Add to that, this vendor doesn’t like to ship from Dec 15-Jan5th or so. He’s likely had a bunch of orders sitting in observation tanks for an extra amount of time in which I’m sure ich would have been noticed.

I’ve got 7 fish coming in tomorrow from him including 3 wrasses. I’ll let you know if I see anything similar to what you’re experiencing.

 

[Slocke]

Slocke - do you run UV?

I ran into velvet from a LFS purchase a couple years ago and went through 3 rounds of fallow. Once for 6 weeks (we think failed due to low copper levels), once for 76 days (we think failed to cross contamination), and one for 100 days, which sorted the velvet completely.

I learned a couple things during the process with the main being I don’t like quarantining. Since then I’ve had 5 orders from this vendor without issue. 100% of the fish in my tank are from this vendor.

Add to that, this vendor doesn’t like to ship from Dec 15-Jan5th or so. He’s likely had a bunch of orders sitting in observation tanks for an extra amount of time in which I’m sure ich would have been noticed.

I’ve got 7 fish coming in tomorrow from him including 3 wrasses. I’ll let you know if I see anything similar to what you’re experiencing.

No but I’m currently searching for a UV.
And yeah I ordered before the holidays and they got a few extra weeks like you said.
The other fish which is in another tank is showing nothing I think.

 

[doubleshot00]

Please don’t shoot if im wrong but I remember reading you cant QT wrasses like you do other fish? So maybe the wrasse didn’t get full copper treatment and the shipping made the ich come out. Idk

 

[Slocke]

I feel bad now. I‘m glad I pointed it out the wrasse had something but I know I’ve now started worrying you. I agree with the others that it’s ich.

No I'm very glad you pointed it out. I saw it but just assumed it couldn't be ich based on where I got it, it being a wrasse, and how healthy it was acting.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I want this questioned answered before I mention a vendor. I don't know much about ich but I have worked in epidemiology and I know that quarantine can be detrimental to the immune system. As I understand it you can have ich and never have an outbreak if your fish are otherwise healthy. So I want to know if it is possible that this fish caught it from my tank and got this level of infection within 24 hours?

ich can spread if not addressed right away and often persons recommend UV but understand UV will address what is free floating and passes through the bulb sleeve- It does NOT remove parasites from fish - Treatment does.

 

[vetteguy53081]

No but I’m currently searching for a UV.
And yeah I ordered before the holidays and they got a few extra weeks like you said.
The other fish which is in another tank is showing nothing I think.

I dont think they are infected yet but ich has a life cycle in which the parasite will fall off . it begins with the trophant stage and goes to theront stage in which free-swimming tomites, which have been released from their cysts living on the sand bed attach themselves to the skin or in the gills of the fish which is the host. The tomites then burrow into the skin or gills and attach themselves in a protective cyst feeding on the body fluids and cells of the fish.

 

[Tamberav]

I found this on google:

1. Theronts – The parasite is free swimming and can survive for up to 8 hours in open water. It will actively look for a fish to feed on in an attempt to restart the life cycle. Ich has evolved to begin its infectious stage at night when most fish are resting, as this increases the odds of finding a host. The cycle will continue until the host fish is able to fend off the infection or dies from Saltwater Ich complications.

So seems 8 hours from substrate to on the fish assuming Dr Google is correct.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

+1 on this looking like marine ich on that wrasse.

It may take days before the other fish start to show it. You *might* be able to manage it in your display with a powerful UV, nightly siphoning of the sand and perhaps using polyp lab medic , a peroxide salt. Otherwise, if it spreads you’ll need to separate the fish from the inverts and run hypo or copper on the fish.
Jay