just saw this post, yes if it was me I'd wait after setting up and running the tank for several months to determine whether u need a skimmer. Besides, rollermats are not cheap. BTW, some folks like myself don't bother w socks bc they clog too frequently and need cleaning often. Instead I use filter floss
Skimmer OR filter roll
- Thread starter ReefdudeAdam
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ReefdudeAdam
Active Member
My tank is yet to get wet.. I do plan on having a heavily stocked tank so I guess prevention is better than curing an issue? ive always run a skimmer on previous tanks from advice given by LFS.
For those interested, here's an article explaining how skimmers work. Skip down to "How do skimmers clean water" & "Surface tension and skimming"
www.thesprucepets.com
How to Set Up a Live Aquarium
Live rock is a popular natural biological filtration system used in saltwater aquariums. Learn about live rock and other filter options.
Dkmoo
Valuable Member
Also a further point - skimmer also doesn't DIRECTLY take out the stuff that filter roll does - that's why you don't usually see uneaten mysis shrimp in your skimmate collection cup. However, skimmers EVENTUALLY take them out b/c your bacteria, filter feeders, detrivores and CUC, will eventually process all that leftover stuff that the filter roller will take out, and break them down into smaller components that the skimmer will then take out.
Whether or not a roller is necessary depends on what problem you are trying to solve once you understand what each is trying to take out. For example - not having a roller may actually be helpful if you have a lot of corals b/c you are leaving food floating in the water column longer for the corals to absorb. However this can also mean an explosion of filter feeders (good or bad depends on what kind of filter feeders - ie, feathers vs hydroids). The increase in biomass will also mean more waste in terms of no3/po4, but that will also depend on your "downstream" nutrient export capacity such as skimmer rating + effectiveness of chaeto fuge.
Whether or not a roller is necessary depends on what problem you are trying to solve once you understand what each is trying to take out. For example - not having a roller may actually be helpful if you have a lot of corals b/c you are leaving food floating in the water column longer for the corals to absorb. However this can also mean an explosion of filter feeders (good or bad depends on what kind of filter feeders - ie, feathers vs hydroids). The increase in biomass will also mean more waste in terms of no3/po4, but that will also depend on your "downstream" nutrient export capacity such as skimmer rating + effectiveness of chaeto fuge.
yes and no, bc too clean/low nutrient water will result in Dino. Many folks who at the start of tank kept too clean water ended up battling Dino. Guess if u r planning on heavily stocked then I'd get a skimmer but don't run it yet while tank is young. Test and monitor regularly NO3 & PO4 levels to determine when it's time to start skimming. GL
ReefdudeAdam
Active Member
Just a wealth of knowledge. Thanks so much.
I agree a skimmer will take out most in the end & is probably the best option down the line if/when nutrient export is required.
Reeflux
Community Member
if your pulling out all the solid waste without giving it time to decompose then you aren't leaving nothing for the skimmer? And the fuge will remove po4 no?
I will read further on it.. I have a 150 g tank with an auto filter roll and a large fuge. I didn't even plan on using a skimmer until I felt I needed it.
ReefdudeAdam
Active Member
Keep me posted on this please! How long have you been set up? Which auto roll are you running?
Dkmoo
Valuable Member
at the end of the day - almost every "nutrient" in your water ends up as No3 and po4, whether thru organism absorbing and expelling waste, bacterial conversion, chemical disolution, etc... so, effectively, if you have a good enough fuge, that's all you need - and there have been successful and mature tanks where fuge is the only method of nutrient export. It all just depends if you have enough biodiversity, stability, and patients to let your tank reach equilibriums in terms of how various organisms uptake nutrient in all these different stages (large particles, dissolved organics, proteim/amino chains) before they become No3/po4.
I run a clarisea SK-5000. My system has had water in it since mid-November. I undersized my skimmer because the automatic roller reduces the amount of organics that have a chance to dissolve into the water as others have mentions. The skimmer functions quite well and removes organics that make it through the mechanical filtration.
Reeflux
Community Member
You just highlighted the hobby in one paragraph....fantastic!
Reeflux
Community Member
Thank adam.....I'm doing the biggest build I've ever done. But this is maybe my 5th tank in my life. Only had them for a few years at a time too. So I got on here to learn, share the build, generate ideas. It's been great.
I'm not up and running yet on this one.
Trigger systems Platinum Sump.. that divider can come out or move to resize the fuge.
This filter roll is nice too because of the float sensors. The one that's with the filter roll is placed for speed of rolling, and there's one in the return too, return water gets too high it can back flow the sump and artificially make the filter roll speed up. So the return float kills the filter rolling on the other side.
I'm sparing no expense here. So I'm going slow. Exposing all the plumbing. Been a fun project... and I've gathered a ton from here already in only a few days time!
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Dkmoo
Valuable Member
full disclosure - i currently do NOT have a fuge - yet i have very low NO3/PO4 despite heavy feeding. I had fuge but took it off b/c i started Vibrant treatment for some stubborn bryopsis and i can't restart my fuge b/c algaebarn's sold out.
However, nutrient export is doing fine b/c what's happening here is that any waste that the skimmer doesn't pick up breaks down to no3/po4 that algaes absorb. Then the vibrant bacteria eats the algae and converts that back into organic matters ready for corals/filterfeeders to reabsorb and skimmer to take back out - basically upcycling the no3/po4 back to the earlier stages of nutrient cycle. Because of this i am in no rush to get chaeto back to restart my fuge and i'm doing maintance vibrant doses ever 2 weeks. In case no3/po4 gets out of line, i also have Zeovit coral snow to help - this does the same thing by upcycling no3/po4 into a stage that can be picked up by skimmer, tho the exact process is unknown b/c of zeovits blackbox nature.
keep in mind some no3/p4 is good for corals too b/c the zoox need them - just not too much or it may cause browning.
I still do plan on getting a fuge back eventually - just waiting for some cheap source of chaeto at the moment. nutrient export aside, fuge has added benefit of bio diversity and stability from the micro fauna that an established fuge supports (ie, pods, filter feeders, detrivors, etcc that grow in the chaeto ball)
As you can see there are many ways to effectively control nutrient export - what works for you really just depends on what's in your tank and how you understand this full nutrient cycle process.
ReefdudeAdam
Active Member
Hey, this looks great!
My tank set up now is a set up to get ready for my in wall build.. this is my first one back in the hobby after 5 years out. Taking it really slow the same as you. I’ll give your build a look!
Reeflux
Community Member
The most important part of this chemical story is the fact that you recognize what is happening here. You essentially save yourself from yourself.
I can see a time when something like this is happening in my own tank. I'm getting good Nutrient export, but I may not understand why. In doing so, I may hastily make a decision that takes me out of that momentary equilibrium. Which is what I'm shooting for.
Have to try and think it through.... thanks for the discussion man.
((FORDTECH))
2500 Club Member
Yes the skimmer Aerates your water
krash7172
Well-Known Member
I personally run a roller, skimmer and an algae scrubber. Overkill? Yes. Absolutely. BUUT, they all do different jobs and you can adjust easily with valves and/or timers. You don't have to run any of them 100% 
