So, I have these flatworms...

[sbash]

Hi Everybody,

My frag tank (2' x 4' low boy) has flatworms. I've had this system running with them for about two years and they were not a problem until this morning. I was selling a couple frags when the buyer noticed them and backed off. That is a big problem, I have lots of frags and if others feel the same way (which is completely understandable), then I will lose long term buyers.

I have a 55 gallon tank handy, so I am thinking I'll set it up with a light, dip every frag and move it over. Eventually the Low Boy will be empty, I can then dry the rocks, wash and dry the sand. After three weeks of the frags being in the 55 gallon, I will then dip them again and put them back into the nice clean Low Boy.

How does that plan sound? I am open to questions, concerns and other advice!

TIA!

 

[Big G]

Bayer. Dip, rinse, rinse, rinse. Coral RX. Dip, rinse, rinse, rinse.

 

[BigJim]

Are they acropora eating flatworms? If that is the case, I agree with Big G. If they are another type, you would need a different approach.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

What type of flatworm is kinda key.
Several of the common ones are actually kinda harmless and some fish will eat them.

I’d its a desperate system you can just flat worm exit the system. It’s a bit involved , but not as much as a total tear down and rebuild.

 

[sbash]

Are they acropora eating flatworms? If that is the case, I agree with Big G. If they are another type, you would need a different approach.

What type of flatworm is kinda key.
Several of the common ones are actually kinda harmless and some fish will eat them.

I’d its a desperate system you can just flat worm exit the system. It’s a bit involved , but not as much as a total tear down and rebuild.

They are just a plain white flatworm. There is no indication they are eating any of the corals. Out of the hitch-hiker lists, they look the most like Amphiscolops, but may be a bit more solid coloured, a dark white if that makes sense.

The problem they have caused is a perception issue, not a real nuisance issue... That said, it is a frag tank with no fish, so it has very little nutrients; so in a properly fed aquarium, they could get out of hand and cause a problem for my local buyers...

 

[sbash]

What about other treatments to take care of all the hitch hikers in that tank?

 

[Szigedi]

Why not just use Flat Worm Exit?

 

[sbash]

Why not just use Flat Worm Exit?

Largely because I actually need a long term solution and I don't know anything about Flat Worm Exit. It is coral safe, I presume? Does it kill most inverts?

Could I use it repeatedly? For example, if I get a new shipment of corals in, they are not usually "guaranteed" if I dip them right away. So I am thinking I will want a QT protocol for the corals to deal with hitchhikers. (I have dealt with actual pests that have come in with frags and colonies).

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Def read up on fwe. You do , IMO have to redose , Just like you’d have to re dip. Mainly due to eggs hatching.

Yep a qt would be good. Myself , lacking space , would use the frag system as a qt.

In qt you have to make the same choice. Nuke it all or dip and re dip.

 

[sbash]

Def read up on fwe. You do , IMO have to redose , Just like you’d have to re dip. Mainly due to eggs hatching.

Yep a qt would be good. Myself , lacking space , would use the frag system as a qt.

In qt you have to make the same choice. Nuke it all or dip and re dip.

Yeah, my frag system was essentially a QT, but I have lots of space so I am going to fire up another tank or two, depending on the protocol I develop. I'll probably start a new thread about it, as there are a lot more considerations than just this flatworm

From what I have read, FWE may or may not be coral safe, so it seems high risk to me (there are a lot of valuable corals in this tank, lol).

Okay, so let's circle back, as I am going to have to just dip the corals for now and nuke the tank. If I start a new QT protocol, I have to nuke the tank anyway, so that work/effort is a non-issue. @Big G Mentioned using Bayer; is there a specific type of insecticide I should look for? I'm may not have the same products up here in Canada.

As for process, I'll user 'Bayer' for the first pass, (I will need to do some reading once I find the right product for the amounts and such). Rinse thoroughly, put in another tank for three weeks (to allow the eggs to hatch). Then dip with Coral Rx, rinse and put them back in the original (sterilized) tank.

Does that sound like an effective plan?

 

[Big G]

10 ml of Bayer to 4 ounces of saltwater. Soak & swirl & scrub corals gently with toothbrush. Let soak for 15 minutes. Rinse in clean saltwater for 15 minutes. Rinse again in clean saltwater for 15 minutes. Then you have an option to soak in Coral RX (its an antiseptic), rinse, rinse and then you're done. I place my corals into a QT just for corals and inverts for 76 days.

 

[sbash]

10 ml of Bayer to 4 ounces of saltwater. Soak & swirl & scrub corals gently with toothbrush. Let soak for 15 minutes. Rinse in clean saltwater for 15 minutes. Rinse again in clean saltwater for 15 minutes. Then you have an option to soak in Coral RX (its an antiseptic), rinse, rinse and then you're done. I place my corals into a QT just for corals and inverts for 76 days.

Thanks for the detailed description!

That product is not available where I live, however, it looks like the active ingredients are Imidacloprid and beta-Cyfluthrin, so I'll poke around the garden shops to see if I can find something similar.

 

[sbash]

Okay, so these insecticides are either not allowed here in Canada, or heavily regulated. Either way, not available...

Also, after further reading, it looks like most of the problems caused by FWE are possibly due to it destroying the bio-balance so the tank starts to crash; OR it kills something that release toxins. If done properly it looks reef safe. However, I have to order it, so it will take a week to come in...

So, what other options do I have as an aggressive hitchhiker dip/treatment?

Here's what I have on hand that looks reef safe:
Prazipro
Furan II
Melafix Marine
CoralRx
Ruby Reef Rally (I'm not even sure what this is, lol, must have come with a system I bought)
Tea Tree Oil
Betadine

There is a mix of soft, lps and sps corals. Any experience out there with fresh water dips for the softies?

 

[schooncw]

Flatworm eXit is a really fantastic product and I highly recommend it. I had a very heavy outbreak and researched heavily and I was very impressed. There are fish that are highly effective-I purchased a yellow coris wrasse-but if you have a serious outbreak, treat with FE first.

 

[schooncw]

http://www.melevsreef.com/articles/how-to-eliminate-flatworms-red-planaria

 

[sbash]

Flatworm eXit is a really fantastic product and I highly recommend it. I had a very heavy outbreak and researched heavily and I was very impressed. There are fish that are highly effective-I purchased a yellow coris wrasse-but if you have a serious outbreak, treat with FE first.

Thanks for the response! The flatworms I have are benign, but flatworms have a bad reputation. So when I was trying to sell a $150 chalice, the buyer saw a couple on the glass and freaked out. Despite re-assuring him

The problem I have with FWE is largely that I have to order it. However, what it kills is in high debate; for example, the Melev's Reef link you provided claims it ONLY kills flatworms, yet most of the internet has different opinions...

Also, there are other hitch-hikers in this tank that I would actually like to target. Not only to minimize my buyers risks, but to keep my own tanks healthy. So, by the time my FWE arrives, I would like to have control of the situation to the point that I probably will not need it.

Basically, I'm thinking I will:

• Use the Melafix as a dip, rinse and rinse, then use the betadine (I'm still reading up on this one) which looks like can terminate the eggs.
• Rinse rinse rinse
  
• Transfer from the 'dipping station' into a tank that I should have filled up and ready to go by end of day tomorrow.
• Once the initial tank is empty, put the rocks and sand in a tub or random other tank (and run the FWE course on that).
• Three weeks later dip everything with CoralRx (maybe a second betadine as well) and put them back into the QT frag tank for 8 weeks.
• Rinse rinse rinse
  
• If there are any signs of the flatworms during the next few weeks, I will run an FWE course on that entire tank.
• After the final 8 weeks (i.e. 11 weeks standard coral QT cycle) move them to my other frag tank

That should pretty much solve my flatworm problem and take care of the other junky sea bugs as well.

 

[sbash]

Okay so after step three above everything started to die... so... I suspect I unleashed a toxin (although I rinsed very thoroughly), or the iodine solution did bad things... I lost about 10% of my stock (all treated sps and half the lps, all softies were fine)... Not a great outcome... I have another theory, there could have been a contaminate in the tank... I'll circle back to that if my research comes up with anything...

Anyway... So, I also ordered flatworm exit and it came in. So I'd like to try it, but given I have literally thousands of dollars in frags in this tank, I want to be very... very... careful...

Aside from following the directions, are there any other tips or tricks? E.g. get ready with the siphon hose to suck out the flatworks that start to die off right away, or keep 100% worth of water change on hand, I don't know, lol, that's why I'm asking

Lastly, will FWE kill off other pests?

 

[Triggreef]

They are just a plain white flatworm. There is no indication they are eating any of the corals. Out of the hitch-hiker lists, they look the most like Amphiscolops, but may be a bit more solid coloured, a dark white if that makes sense.

The problem they have caused is a perception issue, not a real nuisance issue... That said, it is a frag tank with no fish, so it has very little nutrients; so in a properly fed aquarium, they could get out of hand and cause a problem for my local buyers...

Those are harmless and not worth the trouble of getting rid of. The white ones are actually somewhat beneficial and never get to plague proportions.

That said most wrasse will eat them. Dusky wrasse I would recommend and feel comfortable enough saying 100 percent will eat them. 100 percent as long as it is definitely a dusky wrasse.

 

[sbash]

Those are harmless and not worth the trouble of getting rid of. The white ones are actually somewhat beneficial and never get to plague proportions.

That said most wrasse will eat them. Dusky wrasse I would recommend and feel comfortable enough saying 100 percent will eat them. 100 percent as long as it is definitely a dusky wrasse.

Generally speaking, I would agree... hence keeping them around... However they already cost me several hundred dollars in sales, so... they need to go... It's also a 10" deep tank, so putting fish in it is risky...

 

[Triggreef]

Okay so after step three above everything started to die... so... I suspect I unleashed a toxin (although I rinsed very thoroughly), or the iodine solution did bad things... I lost about 10% of my stock (all treated sps and half the lps, all softies were fine)... Not a great outcome... I have another theory, there could have been a contaminate in the tank... I'll circle back to that if my research comes up with anything...

Anyway... So, I also ordered flatworm exit and it came in. So I'd like to try it, but given I have literally thousands of dollars in frags in this tank, I want to be very... very... careful...

Aside from following the directions, are there any other tips or tricks? E.g. get ready with the siphon hose to suck out the flatworks that start to die off right away, or keep 100% worth of water change on hand, I don't know, lol, that's why I'm asking

Lastly, will FWE kill off other pests?

Ok, so with that all said, I'd certainly hold off on further treatment until things recoup. I've used Flatworm exit on my system (back then was probably 260g or so). I had no issue with the treatment and good results. In my case it was red planaria, which I feel are tougher to eradicate than what you have. I dosed about 50 percent more than the directions. Reason being I captured some of the planaria and tested several different methods to kill them. The recommended dosage just seemed to knock them down for a few minutes and 10 minutes later they were slithering around in the container. But slightly higher dosage and it seemed to do the trick. In my case it was all out plague proportions. I used a 1/4 inch tube to vacuum out as many as possible prior to the treatment, and shortly after.

I had no issues with any tank inhabitants (mixed reef heavily stocked with frags and fish). I also repeated the process 5 or 6 days later to get any I missed. Don't forget nothing will kill their eggs.

I think @twilliard also devised a plan using peroxide for flatworms. Should be lots of threads regarding that. I believe it stuns them and sends them floating, where they can be filtered out via filter sock. and repeated several times.