So who else has 0 nutrients with TM AFR

[NanoSteam]

This is something I've struggled with on my last setup as well as my current one. I've used TM AFR on both tanks successfully and loved the results/ease of use vs dosing everything separate. My only gripe is on both tanks I struggled to keep nitrates and phosphates above 0. After some research I came across a few threads pointing out AFR has a carbon element to it. Although it was pointed out to be minute it's the only thing on both of my systems that I can attribute to my difficulty keeping detectable nitrates and phosphates.

In my current setup I have to dose 3ml of Neophos and 5ml of Neonitro daily to maintain a nitrate level of 2.5ppm and phosphate level of 0.01 (trying to raise this to 0.05 slowly).
If i even miss one day of dosing, they bottom out very rapidly. This is with heavy feeding. My tank is fed pellets twice a day, some Nori daily and frozen marine cuisine 3 to 4 times a week.
My only form of filtration is filter floss and a Curve 5 protein skimmer set to skim very dry. I've thought about putting the skimmer on a timer for 12 hours on 12 hours off but have not played with that yet. My bioload consists of a small but very hungry sailfin tang, a clownfish, royal gramma, six line wrasse and a azure damsel.

So does anyone else who uses TM AFR have this carbon dosing effect on their nutrients?

 

[G Santana]

I've been dosing AFR for several months and have elevated Nitrate levels, I attribute it to overfeeding Reef Roids so I have cut back significantly and started Vodka dosing to try to bring them down.
I'd trade my problem for yours in a heartbeat lol

 

[CK00020]

I have a similar problem, but never thought it was the afr, you could be on to something. I have to dose phos daily to keep any detectable level, but my nitrate has always been 15-25.

 

[takitaj]

I didn't notice anything like that with AFR until I started using bio-pellets and now they're kept low and sometimes I have to dose N & P. Before the pellets they just kept rising and rising. I do feed a lot daily. (heavy in - heavy out)

I haven't seen anything about there being carbon in AFR. @NanoSteam Can you link to where you found that?

 

[Waynerock]

Been on AFR for 2.5 years. Currently dose 29ml daily to meet the needs of my tank. Po4 .03 and no3 13.2 as per Hanna. Feed roughly same amount of LRS daily. I can usually call my weekly no3 and po4 tests exactly. I think your issue lies elsewhere. Tank has NEVER looked better. In fact this is the nicest tank I have had coral wise in 20 years

 

[Acrofiend]

Same for me. I occasionally have to dose nitrates. I assumed it was the corals up taking them.

 

[GoVols]

I didn't notice anything like that with AFR until I started using bio-pellets and now they're kept low and sometimes I have to dose N & P. Before the pellets they just kept rising and rising. I do feed a lot daily. (heavy in - heavy out)

I haven't seen anything about there being carbon in AFR. @NanoSteam Can you link to where you found that?

It dose contain an organic carbon source, but tried it anyways.

Within a mater of a few days it started to fuel up Cyanobacteria

 

[LuizW13]

I’ve been dosing AFR daily for a little longer than 2 months and haven’t noticed my nitrates and phosphates being depleted. My nitrates have been hovering around 5-10 on the Salifert kit, and phosphate ranges between .02-.09ish. Occasionally i fose a bit of nitrates, but that’s because i’m also using Vibrant.

 

[GoVols]

Lou states it in this video

Start at about the (EDIT) 5:50 in the video, but he understates the effects that that carbon source can have as a carbon source

 

[NanoSteam]

Seems there's a split of those experiencing and not. Maybe has to do with the dosage amount? I even get white slime buildup from time to time in the sump area.

It's definitely confirmed by TM to have a carbon source in it but it's understood or at least stated it's not enough to make an impact. I'm just trying to get to the bottom of this since I really don't want to have to setup automatic dosing for both nitrates and phosphates as well. In my 20g it caused dino's so i'm a bit scared of that reoccurring in my RSR 250 so I'm on top of keeping those nutrients in check.

I'm thinking of discontinuing the AFR temporarily to see if it will cause N & P to rise naturally from feeding.

 

[Jw258]

I add approx half a ml of AFR per litre of tank water per day, being 45ml per day on an 84l net volume tank.

My nutrients never bottom out. I have 4 fish in the tank and feed PE mysis daily and occasionally will add chopped krill, lobster eggs etc to that. I occasionally add roids but once or twice a month.

The only time my nutrients bottomed out was when I o/d'd on phyto dosing. I'll never go back to adding phyto.

FTS to show why I dose so much AFR.

 

[Dennis Cartier]

Hmm, as others have stated, it is a good problem to have. It sounds like you have the makings for a high input, high output tank. I would suggest going in that direction rather than just dosing phosphate and nitrate directly. You could feed more, and use foods that have a reputation for elevating nutrients. Take Reef Roids, many people find this food spikes their phosphate and many are forced to abandon it for that reason. In your case, including it in your feeding regimen would help to keep phosphate from bottoming out and provide a food that corals really respond to.

Keep testing though. You may find that your phosphate stops being low and starts to rise as the phosphate sinks in your tank become full.

Dennis

 

[A Young Reefer]

I have the same issue but never thought that AFR is the cause.

 

[trevorhiller]

I’m having the same issue with my tank. It’s only around 75 days old, but I started dosing AFR early on to try to stabilize the Alk. I’ve got the dose nearly dialed in it seems at around 4.5-5 mL/day plus Kalkwasser in ATO on my 15 gallon tank.

My nitrate went from steady 2-3 range to 0 and phosphate went from around 0.03-0.06 to 0 within a week of beginning the dosing. They’ve both have tested 0 since I started dosing.

I’ve increased my pellet feedings, added occasional frozen food cubes, added occasional reef roids and reef chili and dose Red Sea AB+ a couple times a week, but still can’t get any detectable levels. Other parameters look good and haven’t had to do any water changes. I think I did one water change in the last month, just because I wanted to try to scrape some algae off and see what happened. It came back the following day.

I do have some algae growing on the rocks, but it isn’t terrible. I’m just trying to ride it out and keep things stable as possible at this point. It would be nice if I could detect some levels, I guess?

Ive heard conflicting opinions on the 0/0 causing dinoflagellates, so I don’t know what to believe on that theory. Here’s a video of what’s growing on my rocks.

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I would try dosing some nitrates and phosphates, but I’m not convinced it’s the right move at this time and feel it might lead to other problems, but I’m open to hearing your input

 

[Dennis Cartier]

I personally would not do anything. The algae on your rocks just looks like the ugly phase starting. Every tank goes through it at startup. When you start to see coraline algae, they will be ending.

Dennis

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I would try dosing some nitrates and phosphates, but I’m not convinced it’s the right move at this time and feel it might lead to other problems, but I’m open to hearing your input

Proper dosing of N and P does not lead to problems, but if you are more comfortable with it, just feed more.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I have the same issue but never thought that AFR is the cause.

It's probably not.

 

[A Young Reefer]

So I have done my research about it.
and this is what I have found so far; all for reef should be a mixture of tropic marines products (diy recipe). And one of the components is tropic marines carbo-calcium. When the product was first released (TM carbo-calcium) there was a lot of talk about what the ingredients were. As the ingredients haven't been officially released (at least non that I know of). The general agreement is that it’s calcium formate , but many other say that it might be calcium acetate both act as a carbon source. I personally think that it might have calcium acetate since it is already in another product we have in the hobby called salifert all in one.

 

[A Young Reefer]

@Hans-Werner, is one of the developers of AFR. Would like to see if he can share some info about this.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

So I have done my research about it.
and this is what I have found so far; all for reef should be a mixture of tropic marines products (diy recipe). And one of the components is tropic marines carbo-calcium. When the product was first released (TM carbo-calcium) there was a lot of talk about what the ingredients were. As the ingredients haven't been officially released (at least non that I know of). The general agreement is that it’s calcium formate which is not a carbon source, but many other say that it might be calcium formate or calcium acetate that both act as a carbon source. I personally think that it might have calcium acetate since it is already in another product we have in the hobby called salifert all in one.

AFR is definitely calcium formate. Salifert All In One is calcium acetate.
Unlike acetate, formate has very little organic carbon dosing potential since it is nearly fully oxidized already, but it has a little.

Between the small amount dosed, and the low potential for effects from it, one should not anticipate any substantial carbon dosing effects from AFR such as denitrification, but there may be some.