Something killed my fish - any advice?

[esther9290]

Hi everyone,

I've had this 25 gallon running for about a year. I introduced a pair of clowns about 3 months ago. They seemed fine, swimming against the current and were a pleasure to look at... until this morning i woke up and didn't see them swimming around. So i looked towards the back of the tank and they were both dead on the sand bed (next to each other like they always used to be when they swam around). Im beyond words, and am trying to understand what i did wrong, so as not to repeat it.

I immediately tested the water and it was no different from my weekly tests (ammonia < 0.25, nitrite and nitrate were zero, ph 8.2, phosphates 0.25). If anything the phosphates this time were slightly higher than 0.25 (between the 0.25 and 0.5 color band on the API kit.) I used a second kit to test the phosphates - sera test kit, which showed 0.25 on the first color band. Temp at 78.

Changes over the last few days to 3 months. Could any of these be the reason?:
- 3 months ago, I started regularly (every 2 days) dosing iron, neoNitro, instant-ocean's reef-accelerator maintenance. Also i dosed phyto (half capful) every other day, and reef-roids every 3 days.
- 1 month ago, i added 2 zoa frags (fruit loops & cat's eye) and increased the reef-roids to every other day
- 3 weeks ago i added a bag of seachem phosnet phosphate remover to the back filter. I followed the manufacturers instructions and even there went a little less than what was recommended
- 1 week ago, since the clowns were by themselves, i got them a BTA. But the shrimp immediately took to the BTA, and the clowns never went near it. Also instead of dosing the reef-roids, i switched to directly feeding them to the corals with a turkey baster.
- 4 days ago, i removed some zoa offshoots in the gravel, and attached them to rocks using superglue and put it back in the tank in about an hour. I also added reef-iodide to my dosing schedule.
- 3 days ago, i changed the position of the hygger nano wavemaker and put it closer to the opposite side of the return flow from the AIO filter. The current seemed to be better for the paly and the bta. The clowns were swimming around in the flow, but i was worried if it was too much flow for them and set the power to the lowest level.
- yesterday i modified (increased) the intensity of blues in my lighting schedule to about 2x what it used to be, but only for 12PM-2PM. Yesterday I also dosed iron, iodine, and neoNitro and reef-roids

I'm still getting over this episode, but i greatly appreciate any advice or insight that anyone here can provide.

 

[SnazzyUrchin792]

Do you have any pictures of them, alive or dead?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Hi everyone,

I've had this 25 gallon running for about a year. I introduced a pair of clowns about 3 months ago. They seemed fine, swimming against the current and were a pleasure to look at... until this morning i woke up and didn't see them swimming around. So i looked towards the back of the tank and they were both dead on the sand bed (next to each other like they always used to be when they swam around). Im beyond words, and am trying to understand what i did wrong, so as not to repeat it.

I immediately tested the water and it was no different from my weekly tests (ammonia < 0.25, nitrite and nitrate were zero, ph 8.2, phosphates 0.25). If anything the phosphates this time were slightly higher than 0.25 (between the 0.25 and 0.5 color band on the API kit.) I used a second kit to test the phosphates - sera test kit, which showed 0.25 on the first color band. Temp at 78.

Changes over the last few days to 3 months. Could any of these be the reason?:
- 3 months ago, I started regularly (every 2 days) dosing iron, neoNitro, instant-ocean's reef-accelerator maintenance. Also i dosed phyto (half capful) every other day, and reef-roids every 3 days.
- 1 month ago, i added 2 zoa frags (fruit loops & cat's eye) and increased the reef-roids to every other day
- 3 weeks ago i added a bag of seachem phosnet phosphate remover to the back filter. I followed the manufacturers instructions and even there went a little less than what was recommended
- 1 week ago, since the clowns were by themselves, i got them a BTA. But the shrimp immediately took to the BTA, and the clowns never went near it. Also instead of dosing the reef-roids, i switched to directly feeding them to the corals with a turkey baster.
- 4 days ago, i removed some zoa offshoots in the gravel, and attached them to rocks using superglue and put it back in the tank in about an hour. I also added reef-iodide to my dosing schedule.
- 3 days ago, i changed the position of the hygger nano wavemaker and put it closer to the opposite side of the return flow from the AIO filter. The current seemed to be better for the paly and the bta. The clowns were swimming around in the flow, but i was worried if it was too much flow for them and set the power to the lowest level.
- yesterday i modified (increased) the intensity of blues in my lighting schedule to about 2x what it used to be, but only for 12PM-2PM. Yesterday I also dosed iron, iodine, and neoNitro and reef-roids

I'm still getting over this episode, but i greatly appreciate any advice or insight that anyone here can provide.

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

Sorry to hear about the clownfish. My thought is that they had some issue, but that it sort of snuck up on you and then you found the fish dead.

Did the clowns die with their mouths open? I'm wondering if the change you made to the powerhead caused an increase in carbon dioxide, or a drop in dissolved oxygen, or both.

Are there any other fish in the tank? How do they look?

Jay

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

pics of the tank will help.
Nothing really strikes me as something that will kill fish over night.

Just as a side note, nothing to do with your dead fish, but it seems like a lot of reef roids you are dumping in the tank. They increase phosphate, and seems you have high phosphate. You are using phosphate remover, but adding lots of phosphate at the same time. Also, the API kit is very inaccurate for phosphate, you need a test kit that measure ultra low numbers.

 

[esther9290]

Do you have any pictures of them, alive or dead?

Unfortunately not after they died. I was filled with grief just seeing them laying side by side. The smaller male was half eaten (tail part) and the larger female was intact. I just removed them right away from the tank so that it would stop affecting the water.

i just found that the yellow goby (who usually hides in the rockwork) had died too. So its something with the water i think. or the nano hygger as one person here suggested, or the phosphates. But my other tank that has just a damsel, and the same water is fine. I didnt dose it like i did with the larger tank. Here is a pic of them alive

 

[vetteguy53081]

Unfortunately not after they died. I was filled with grief just seeing them laying side by side. The smaller male was half eaten (tail part) and the larger female was intact. I just removed them right away from the tank so that it would stop affecting the water.

i just found that the yellow goby (who usually hides in the rockwork) had died too. So its something with the water i think. or the nano hygger as one person here suggested, or the phosphates. But my other tank that has just a damsel, and the same water is fine. I didnt dose it like i did with the larger tank. Here is a pic of them alive

Any unusual signs of elevated breathing .... loss of color ..... loss of appetite .... unusual behavior prior to death?

 

[SnazzyUrchin792]

Unfortunately not after they died. I was filled with grief just seeing them laying side by side. The smaller male was half eaten (tail part) and the larger female was intact. I just removed them right away from the tank so that it would stop affecting the water.

i just found that the yellow goby (who usually hides in the rockwork) had died too. So its something with the water i think. or the nano hygger as one person here suggested, or the phosphates. But my other tank that has just a damsel, and the same water is fine. I didnt dose it like i did with the larger tank. Here is a pic of them alive

I doubt it was phosphate that killed them. I had 2 damsels and a yellow goby that were just fine with phosphates at .70.

 

[esther9290]

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

Sorry to hear about the clownfish. My thought is that they had some issue, but that it sort of snuck up on you and then you found the fish dead.

Did the clowns die with their mouths open? I'm wondering if the change you made to the powerhead caused an increase in carbon dioxide, or a drop in dissolved oxygen, or both.

Are there any other fish in the tank? How do they look?

Jay

Thank you for the response.
They didn't die with their mouths open. Thats quite possible what you say with the powerhead. I am going to try and get some thing to test the co2 (if such a thing exists).
Right after posting this, i went looking for the goby, who is the only other fish in the tank and usually hides between the rocks. Sadly he had passed away too. I just did a 50% water change on Friday. Should i dump out all the water and restart the tank with fresh rocks and sand?

 

[esther9290]

pics of the tank will help.
Nothing really strikes me as something that will kill fish over night.

Just as a side note, nothing to do with your dead fish, but it seems like a lot of reef roids you are dumping in the tank. They increase phosphate, and seems you have high phosphate. You are using phosphate remover, but adding lots of phosphate at the same time. Also, the API kit is very inaccurate for phosphate, you need a test kit that measure ultra low numbers.

Yikes - that seems plausible. So apart from the api and sera, what is usually recommended in the hobby? I see some articles suggesting the hanna tester. Would that provide a more reliable reading>

 

[littlefoxx]

Hi everyone,

I've had this 25 gallon running for about a year. I introduced a pair of clowns about 3 months ago. They seemed fine, swimming against the current and were a pleasure to look at... until this morning i woke up and didn't see them swimming around. So i looked towards the back of the tank and they were both dead on the sand bed (next to each other like they always used to be when they swam around). Im beyond words, and am trying to understand what i did wrong, so as not to repeat it.

I immediately tested the water and it was no different from my weekly tests (ammonia < 0.25, nitrite and nitrate were zero, ph 8.2, phosphates 0.25). If anything the phosphates this time were slightly higher than 0.25 (between the 0.25 and 0.5 color band on the API kit.) I used a second kit to test the phosphates - sera test kit, which showed 0.25 on the first color band. Temp at 78.

Changes over the last few days to 3 months. Could any of these be the reason?:
- 3 months ago, I started regularly (every 2 days) dosing iron, neoNitro, instant-ocean's reef-accelerator maintenance. Also i dosed phyto (half capful) every other day, and reef-roids every 3 days.
- 1 month ago, i added 2 zoa frags (fruit loops & cat's eye) and increased the reef-roids to every other day
- 3 weeks ago i added a bag of seachem phosnet phosphate remover to the back filter. I followed the manufacturers instructions and even there went a little less than what was recommended
- 1 week ago, since the clowns were by themselves, i got them a BTA. But the shrimp immediately took to the BTA, and the clowns never went near it. Also instead of dosing the reef-roids, i switched to directly feeding them to the corals with a turkey baster.
- 4 days ago, i removed some zoa offshoots in the gravel, and attached them to rocks using superglue and put it back in the tank in about an hour. I also added reef-iodide to my dosing schedule.
- 3 days ago, i changed the position of the hygger nano wavemaker and put it closer to the opposite side of the return flow from the AIO filter. The current seemed to be better for the paly and the bta. The clowns were swimming around in the flow, but i was worried if it was too much flow for them and set the power to the lowest level.
- yesterday i modified (increased) the intensity of blues in my lighting schedule to about 2x what it used to be, but only for 12PM-2PM. Yesterday I also dosed iron, iodine, and neoNitro and reef-roids

I'm still getting over this episode, but i greatly appreciate any advice or insight that anyone here can provide.

Im so sorry thats horrible. Just went through this with all my fish dying over night in a power issue. I know how devastating that is to just see them dead. I hope the medics and more experiance reefers can help you figure out whats going on

 

[esther9290]

Any unusual signs of elevated breathing .... loss of color ..... loss of appetite .... unusual behavior prior to death?

Nothing really. They were swimming up against the current and seemed to be playing with each other yesterday night when i went to sleep. I have a big sponge wrapped around the powerhead to decrease the strength of the flow, still i thought it might be a bit too much for a 25G, so i reduced the intensity to 40% which is the lowest that these hygger powerheads go

 

[esther9290]

Im so sorry thats horrible. Just went through this with all my fish dying over night in a power issue. I know how devastating that is to just see them dead. I hope the medics and more experiance reefers can help you figure out whats going on

Thank you for your kind words. Since i've only had these fish, i used to watch them pair and swim together all the time. It grieves me to think i wont see that happen anymore. And also that they said goodbye next to each other.

 

[esther9290]

Could it be the gfo i added a few weeks ago?

 

[esther9290]

Yikes - that seems plausible. So apart from the api and sera, what is usually recommended in the hobby? I see some articles suggesting the hanna tester. Would that provide a more reliable reading>

And here is a pic from this morning.

 

[Dbichler]

since you have living corals still in there only one thing could be the cause and that’s a disease.

 

[littlefoxx]

Thank you for your kind words. Since i've only had these fish, i used to watch them pair and swim together all the time. It grieves me to think i wont see that happen anymore. And also that they said goodbye next to each other.

Yeah thats how I found my two clowns together when mine died too. They are all very loyal to each other. It helps to just get the tank back up and get some fish back in there. I like to rescue abused and different fish so I got these two misfit adult clowns and paired them. Helps to see them happy

 

[esther9290]

since you have living corals still in there only one thing could be the cause and that’s a disease.

I did introduce a coral frag about a week ago, which could have sourced the disease.
I understand diseases propagate differently in fishes, than they do in humans. But have you experienced or seen cases where disease kills all the 3 fish in the tank at the same time?

 

[Pickle_soup]

I did introduce a coral frag about a week ago, which could have sourced the disease.
I understand diseases propagate differently in fishes, than they do in humans. But have you experienced or seen cases where disease kills all the 3 fish in the tank at the same time?

Yeah, that happens. When I had awful ich outbreaks, pretty much everything got wiped, and smaller fish had no visible signs, they just were dead. Remember, some parasites love to just settle down in the gills. I haven't added any fish to my tank in 8 years, so I am kinda rusty, but I am starting over, so everything is going into quarantine. Corals and inverts have a dedicated tank that they will stay in for 76 days. It's just the surest way.

 

[esther9290]

Yeah, that happens. When I had awful ich outbreaks, pretty much everything got wiped, and smaller fish had no visible signs, they just were dead. Remember, some parasites love to just settle down in the gills. I haven't added any fish to my tank in 8 years, so I am kinda rusty, but I am starting over, so everything is going into quarantine. Corals and inverts have a dedicated tank that they will stay in for 76 days. It's just the surest way.

I do have another tank. Im gonna start using that to quarantine stuff moving forward. Also got a triton from my LFS to send in the water to see if anything stands out. But if it was a parasite, what do i do from here? Will it die out if i just wait a few weeks?

 

[Pickle_soup]

Leave the fallow for 76 days. If it was ich, and maybe it wasn't, I do think that they have the longest life cycle, and the number of days is pretty much still argued over, but that's how I saved myself money and health. It really sucks to see your fish die, or even worse when you have to do it because you they have no chance and are just suffering. I know it's very tempting to just throw your new animals into the tank. I have 6 right now sitting in quarantine, and I have to smack myself not to let them in too early, but if you are building a reef, it's for a long time, so a month here or there is not making a difference. I had one fish survive my last wipeout, a 6-line. I took him out, treated him with copper, and left the DT alone for 82 days. After that, I quarantined my fish, and not had a single case of ich in my tank since then. I am saying it was ich for sure, but it should work with most parasites and bacteria. No hosts, they die too. Patience is the key to this hobby.