Source water problems

demonspeedn

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I moved to a small town just over a year ago and since then I have lost most of my LPS corals. The water from the tap is rusty at times and usually smells of strong chlorine. I was getting about 50 gallons of RODI water before all the resin was exhausted, but have since separated the resin into 3 stages as BRS has suggested and now just have to change out 1 of them. I feel like something maybe getting through that would be causing the issues and I'm looking for recommendations.
Anemones, gorgonians, my only colony of SPS, fish and inverts are doing great. I've always had great success with LPS over the last 12 years, but now I'm stumped.
Tank specs.
220g
75g sump/refugium
Sbreef leds x3
Sal. 1.026
PH 7.77
Alk 9
Cal 420
Phos trace
temp 77
200lbs live rock
 
What is the TDS of your product water? If it's 0 ppm, then there's nothing of significance in your source water that would be causing this change.
 
I moved to a small town just over a year ago and since then I have lost most of my LPS corals. The water from the tap is rusty at times and usually smells of strong chlorine. I was getting about 50 gallons of RODI water before all the resin was exhausted, but have since separated the resin into 3 stages as BRS has suggested and now just have to change out 1 of them. I feel like something maybe getting through that would be causing the issues and I'm looking for recommendations.
Anemones, gorgonians, my only colony of SPS, fish and inverts are doing great. I've always had great success with LPS over the last 12 years, but now I'm stumped.
Tank specs.
220g
75g sump/refugium
Sbreef leds x3
Sal. 1.026
PH 7.77
Alk 9
Cal 420
Phos trace
temp 77
200lbs live rock
Have you considered sending out an ICP test of both your tank and RODI water?
 
It's zero for a while, but it creeps up to 5 before I get the resin changed sometimes. I've never had it over 5.
 
It's zero for a while, but it creeps up to 5 before I get the resin changed sometimes. I've never had it over 5.

If your water is visibly dirty as you mention, this could be a big problem. You really can't let it get over 0 ppm if the quality of your source water is so questionable.

Are you running a single bed cation, single bed anion, and then a mixed bed for your DI setup? Is your anion resin depleting first? How often is it depleting? Do you know the TDS of your tap water as well as the TDS right before your DI resin?
 
Have you considered sending out an ICP test of both your tank and RODI water?

I agree with doing this. I would get it when your sample is at 0 TDS and I would make sure that I have enough stuff to change out DI or any other filters if I even see it creep to 1, may be expensive in the long run but would be worth it knowing you are getting 0 TDS.
 
If your water is visibly dirty as you mention, this could be a big problem. You really can't let it get over 0 ppm if the quality of your source water is so questionable.

Are you running a single bed cation, single bed anion, and then a mixed bed for your DI setup? Is your anion resin depleting first? How often is it depleting? Do you know the TDS of your tap water as well as the TDS right before your DI resin?
Yes, running separated resin. Anion is depleting first. I'm getting around 50 gallons this way. TDS from the tap is usually 500+. Not sure if the water softener is affecting this number or not . TDS before the resin is around 15 Iif I remember right.
 
I agree with doing this. I would get it when your sample is at 0 TDS and I would make sure that I have enough stuff to change out DI or any other filters if I even see it creep to 1, may be expensive in the long run but would be worth it knowing you are getting 0 TDS.
Would I be better off sending a sample of the tap water ?
 
Would I be better off sending a sample of the tap water ?
If you are on city water you should be able to get them to send you a report on their required testing. My utility posts it online.

I would also caution that just because TDS is 0 does not mean your water is safe. It only means that anything getting through your filter isn't conductive (non ionic).
 
If you are on city water you should be able to get them to send you a report on their required testing. My utility posts it online.

I would also caution that just because TDS is 0 does not mean your water is safe. It only means that anything getting through your filter isn't conductive (non ionic).
This is what I get. Not sure how to read this one. http://www.cityofsabin.com/Library/2017ccr.pdf
 
Since you are saying that stuff id dying off using 0 TDS thats the sample that I would send in. If you are using 5 TDS that could be the issue there.
 
I had a similar issue when I moved. I did not realize that my new district was treating with chloramines which my rodi unit did not filter out. My tds was reading zero but ever since I moved everything was dying even tho params were where they should be. Eventually I figured it out after trying literally everything including tearing my tank apart looking for a magnet, getting new pumps, new lights, grounding probe, adding GFO etc. I just recently bought the 7 stage RODI unti from BRS to fix this but those are not cheap so while I was saving I treated my new water with PRIME every water change and almost instantly things began coming back to life.

Good luck!
 
I had a similar issue when I moved. I did not realize that my new district was treating with chloramines which my rodi unit did not filter out. My tds was reading zero but ever since I moved everything was dying even tho params were where they should be. Eventually I figured it out after trying literally everything including tearing my tank apart looking for a magnet, getting new pumps, new lights, grounding probe, adding GFO etc. I just recently bought the 7 stage RODI unti from BRS to fix this but those are not cheap so while I was saving I treated my new water with PRIME every water change and almost instantly things began coming back to life.

Good luck!
I asked the water treatment plant operator if it was Chloramines and he said only Chlorine. That was my first thought.
 
Yes, running separated resin. Anion is depleting first. I'm getting around 50 gallons this way. TDS from the tap is usually 500+. Not sure if the water softener is affecting this number or not . TDS before the resin is around 15 Iif I remember right.

The anion resin depleting first is to be expected. The ions that the cation resin exchanges makes this happen first. I run separate beds and my anion depletes quickly, so much so that I added a second anion stage. I now run cation > anion > anion > mixed bed with color changing cation.

If you were getting 5 ppm after your DI resin, you'll want to replace the last resin in the series, the pro mixed bed. The reason for this is because the color change is on the cation resin, which get depleted first if your system is functioning properly. However, if you let your anion resin deplete, the uncolored beads in the final stage (the anion beads) are probably depleted. You just don't have a way to see it.

The water softener is not an issue. If anything, it likely makes it easier for your RO unit to function, as softened water is easier to filter than unsoftened high-TDS tap water.

You're going to have a tough time filtering your water because of how dirty your source is. You can make significant progress if you maintain your RO system well though. First, change the prefilters regularly. Either change them on a 6 month schedule or test them to see when they need to be changed. The sediment filter needs to be changed when the pressure in the system drops significantly. Put a pressure gauge before and after the prefilters to measure this. Once the pressure drops, it's time to change the sediment filter. The carbon block(s) need to be replaced when you detect chlorine/chloramines in the waste water from your RO membrane. To do this, buy some simple test strips and test the waste water every so often. If you see chlorine or chloramines, you need to replace your carbon blocks.

For prefilters, always use a very small sediment filter (less than 1 micron if you can find it, 0.6 micron or smaller would be ideal). For carbon blocks, any size will work so long as it's larger than the sediment filter size.

For your RO membrane, you don't need to do much except give it good pressure. If you don't have pressure above 50 PSI, a booster pump is probably a good idea because of your source water. Also, make sure you have a 4 to 1 waste to product ratio. Some people can get away with running less (3:1, 2:1, etc), but you absolutely can't. Because of your dirty source water, you WILL ruin your membrane early if you starve it of the waste water it needs. It sounds like your 50GPD membrane is performing fine, but consider getting a 75GPD membrane when it needs to be replaced. The 75 GPD membranes typically have better rejection rates.

A DI resin setup like the one you have is likely to be the most cost effective, but you really have to keep up on the resin changes. Consider adding a second anion stage if it depletes that quickly. Also something you should really consider is a degassing chamber for your RO water. CO2 could be the reason your DI resin is depleting so quickly, and aerating the water before you run it through your DI could dramatically improve your DI lifespan.
 
The only report I could find for your area that had any readings was 2016 and cities always change the way they are doing things. The report only showed, Chlorine, Copper, and Arsenic.
 
The anion resin depleting first is to be expected. The ions that the cation resin exchanges makes this happen first. I run separate beds and my anion depletes quickly, so much so that I added a second anion stage. I now run cation > anion > anion > mixed bed with color changing cation.

If you were getting 5 ppm after your DI resin, you'll want to replace the last resin in the series, the pro mixed bed. The reason for this is because the color change is on the cation resin, which get depleted first if your system is functioning properly. However, if you let your anion resin deplete, the uncolored beads in the final stage (the anion beads) are probably depleted. You just don't have a way to see it.

The water softener is not an issue. If anything, it likely makes it easier for your RO unit to function, as softened water is easier to filter than unsoftened high-TDS tap water.

You're going to have a tough time filtering your water because of how dirty your source is. You can make significant progress if you maintain your RO system well though. First, change the prefilters regularly. Either change them on a 6 month schedule or test them to see when they need to be changed. The sediment filter needs to be changed when the pressure in the system drops significantly. Put a pressure gauge before and after the prefilters to measure this. Once the pressure drops, it's time to change the sediment filter. The carbon block(s) need to be replaced when you detect chlorine/chloramines in the waste water from your RO membrane. To do this, buy some simple test strips and test the waste water every so often. If you see chlorine or chloramines, you need to replace your carbon blocks.

For prefilters, always use a very small sediment filter (less than 1 micron if you can find it, 0.6 micron or smaller would be ideal). For carbon blocks, any size will work so long as it's larger than the sediment filter size.

For your RO membrane, you don't need to do much except give it good pressure. If you don't have pressure above 50 PSI, a booster pump is probably a good idea because of your source water. Also, make sure you have a 4 to 1 waste to product ratio. Some people can get away with running less (3:1, 2:1, etc), but you absolutely can't. Because of your dirty source water, you WILL ruin your membrane early if you starve it of the waste water it needs. It sounds like your 50GPD membrane is performing fine, but consider getting a 75GPD membrane when it needs to be replaced. The 75 GPD membranes typically have better rejection rates.

A DI resin setup like the one you have is likely to be the most cost effective, but you really have to keep up on the resin changes. Consider adding a second anion stage if it depletes that quickly. Also something you should really consider is a degassing chamber for your RO water. CO2 could be the reason your DI resin is depleting so quickly, and aerating the water before you run it through your DI could dramatically improve your DI lifespan.
So I need to change the mixed resin everytime I change the anion? Will adding another anion stage help prolong the mixed bed? I have an extra canister I can use.
I have a pressure pump currently set at 60psi., use a 5 micron prefilter, (2) 1 micron carbon filters, 100GPD membrane. I've never checked the rejection rate, but will do that the next time my brute can needs filling. I will also research the degassing chamber, as I've never seen one of those.
 
The only report I could find for your area that had any readings was 2016 and cities always change the way they are doing things. The report only showed, Chlorine, Copper, and Arsenic.
Do you have a link?
 

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