SPS acros dying from tips.

[Charlie’s Frags]

I think my UV is running 300 gah at the moment but yeah my research a few weeks ago said UV doesn’t do anything for these. I’ve been dosing silicates and mb7. Not sure if I should be doing water changes or siphoning my sand bed?

Did the corals start looking stressed before or after you started dosing silicates and mb7

And btw
I was told silicates fuel dinos.

Can you list everything you dose or did dose when your corals started deteriorating

 

[tundraguy1106]

Did the corals start looking stressed before or after you started dosing silicates and mb7

And btw
I was told silicates fuel dinos.

Can you list everything you dose or did dose when your corals started deteriorating

Way before. First coral that went was my bird nest. Then my acros one by one. I did have that little alk spike in the middle of all of this but only for maybe a day and then it was corrected. I also lost my space invader pectinia and a trumpet coral as well. Those could have been lighting related.

I only dose live phyto and acropower every other day with some reef roids (once I did 2 days of dosing H2o2 (15ml each day) but stopped worrying about adverse affects. Aminos and phyto I’ve been dosing for months. I started mb7 around the time I sent out my ICP test (end of February).

Other than that I only daily dose alk and cal (B-ionic) through my doser.

I’ve confirmed with a couple of people including Randy on this forum that dosing silicates won’t harm anything.

I was running a refugium with macros but my macros were getting covered in hair algae and my No3 and Po4 levels seemed balanced, so I’ve since removed them. I do have algae and some snails still in there so I keep my fuge light running for 0200-0700.

 

[Charlie’s Frags]

Way before. First coral that went was my bird nest. Then my acros one by one. I did have that little alk spike in the middle of all of this but only for maybe a day and then it was corrected. I also lost my space invader pectinia and a trumpet coral as well. Those could have been lighting related.

I only dose live phyto and acropower every other day with some reef roids (once I did 2 days of dosing H2o2 (15ml each day) but stopped worrying about adverse affects. Aminos and phyto I’ve been dosing for months. I started mb7 around the time I sent out my ICP test (end of February).

Other than that I only daily dose alk and cal (B-ionic) through my doser.

I’ve confirmed with a couple of people including Randy on this forum that dosing silicates won’t harm anything.

I was running a refugium with macros but my macros were getting covered in hair algae and my No3 and Po4 levels seemed balanced, so I’ve since removed them. I do have algae and some snails still in there so I keep my fuge light running for 0200-0700.

But the silicates could be fueling the dinos. Are you seeing more or less dinos since you started dosing silicates?

 

[ScottB]

I think my UV is running 300 gah at the moment but yeah my research a few weeks ago said UV doesn’t do anything for these. I’ve been dosing silicates and mb7. Not sure if I should be doing water changes or siphoning my sand bed?

Mixed opinions on disturbing the sand bed with amphids. I am in the Do Not Disturb camp. These are edge competitors that get traction when the biome is disturbed. Or starved. So there is my logic.

General consensus is not to do WCs until they are back under control. The theory is that WCs replenish some trace stuff that over time becomes limiting. In my case -- with ostreopsis -- it was potassium, iodine and something else.

 

[ScottB]

But the silicates could be fueling the dinos. Are you seeing more or less dinos since you started dosing silicates?

The point of the silicates is to fuel competitor growth, namely the sand based diatoms. Silicate dosing came AFTER the dinos were already established. Not saying you are wrong necessarily, just stating the logic of the treatment protocol.

 

[ScottB]

So Tundra, I understand WHY you wanted to change salts to keep ALK lower, but what about WHEN you made the change?

Can we establish any correlation between the salt switch & subsequent WCs and your SPS decline?

Given all the anecdotes around here relaying the supposed impact of switching salts, I am not sure I will ever switch from IORC even though my system is 8 dkh. If I have to do a large WC, I just knocking down the dkh, gas it off for an hour and go.

 

[tundraguy1106]

So Tundra, I understand WHY you wanted to change salts to keep ALK lower, but what about WHEN you made the change?

Can we establish any correlation between the salt switch & subsequent WCs and your SPS decline?

Given all the anecdotes around here relaying the supposed impact of switching salts, I am not sure I will ever switch from IORC even though my system is 8 dkh. If I have to do a large WC, I just knocking down the dkh, gas it off for an hour and go.

I was already way into SPS die off when I switched over. That was another reason for my switch. I was thinking my salt was causing alk swings which was killing my SPS.

 

[tundraguy1106]

But the silicates could be fueling the dinos. Are you seeing more or less dinos since you started dosing silicates?

I’m seeing less Dinos with silicate dosing. Less brown sand in my case. I do notice that the sand is cleaner in the morning? Do these Dinos go somewhere at night as well? I could do some nighttime bubble scrubbing to pull the Dinos from the way column and into my sump where my UV will blast them before returning to my tank.

 

[Charlie’s Frags]

The point of the silicates is to fuel competitor growth, namely the sand based diatoms. Silicate dosing came AFTER the dinos were already established. Not saying you are wrong necessarily, just stating the logic of the treatment protocol.

Okie dokie. The only thing that sort of worked for me dealing with dinos in my dry rock back up system was silicate removers. But they would return later after a WC or adding new frag racks etc . I haven’t seen them since I just over stocked it with corals and fish

But the dinos never harmed my acros or any corals. They just looked nasty

 

[tundraguy1106]

Okie dokie. The only thing that sort of worked for me dealing with dinos in my dry rock back up system was silicate removers. But they would return later after a WC or adding new frag racks etc . I haven’t seen them since I just over stocked it with corals and fish

But the dinos never harmed my acros or any corals. They just looked nasty

I never thought I even had Dinos. My tests were showing nutrients in my system. While making a post about my SPS dying a fellow reefer pointed out my sand and asked if I had a microscope. So I grabbed a sample and boom DINOS!

so I was trying to figure out my SPS issues while battling Dinos. I know mine aren’t toxic but I thought maybe they were smothering the SPS since the tips were turning brown and dying.

even now after an ICP test and knowing my levels are good, I’m still watching acros die. This adds to the confusion but I guess it’s a long recovery so I just have to wait. I’m gonna lengthen my peak lighting 20 minutes per week till I get up to 7-8 hours. I’m at 4 hours now at peak lighting.

 

[Perry]

Perhaps give "why you can't keep sps" thread a read. Nothing to really lose at this point BTW, I lost 3 rounds of frag startup packs, and they died in a very similar way. Sorry for the troubles, but this can be corrected

 

[ScottB]

I’m seeing less Dinos with silicate dosing. Less brown sand in my case. I do notice that the sand is cleaner in the morning? Do these Dinos go somewhere at night as well? I could do some nighttime bubble scrubbing to pull the Dinos from the way column and into my sump where my UV will blast them before returning to my tank.

No, these buggers burrow at night. Even blackouts don't seem to get them moving.

 

[ScottB]

Perhaps give "why you can't keep sps" thread a read. Nothing to really lose at this point BTW, I lost 3 rounds of frag startup packs, and they died in a very similar way. Sorry for the troubles, but this can be corrected

Yeah, that is where I started on the OPs opening, but it has been running for 2 years. Although I don't know how long he was successfully keeping acropora before this die off.

Usually by this time in an SPS STN thread I have at least formed my own opinion on cause(s) but this one stumps me.

 

[Perry]

Yeah, that is where I started on the OPs opening, but it has been running for 2 years. Although I don't know how long he was successfully keeping acropora before this die off.

Usually by this time in an SPS STN thread I have at least formed my own opinion on cause(s) but this one stumps me.

I tend to believe that a well fed fish load, skimmer, and maybe a sock of carbon is a good place for most mature systems. I believe the OP expressed concerns of pests or hitchhikers, so deliberately avoided life, possibly in fear of the wrong life entering the eco-system, or really lack thereof. That said, a scoop of sand from a mature system, live sand activator, rubble from another reefers tank could help. Unfortunately, in all of my years, keeping pests out is nearly impossible, let the tank do its thing, allow for all life to flourish, or, use a program to add beneficial bacteria and carbon source to mimick this natural process. Heavy in and heavy out, cannot hurt. And in my case, stop testing nutrients if correction is even a remote thought.

 

[ScottB]

I tend to believe that a well fed fish load, skimmer, and maybe a sock of carbon is a good place for most mature systems. I believe the OP expressed concerns of pests or hitchhikers, so deliberately avoided life, possibly in fear of the wrong life entering the eco-system, or really lack thereof. That said, a scoop of sand from a mature system, live sand activator, rubble from another reefers tank could help. Unfortunately, in all of my years, keeping pests out is nearly impossible, let the tank do its thing, allow for all life to flourish, or, use a program to add beneficial bacteria and carbon source to mimick this natural process. Heavy in and heavy out, cannot hurt. And in my case, stop testing nutrients if correction is even a remote thought.

Lordy do I hear you on the challenge of keeping pests out. I think if someone sends me some black bug/worms I can check off the pest list as complete.

I will speculate that while I won't quit heavy in / heavy out, it is not the easiest place to be regarding pest control.
I seem to cycle through aiptasia, vermetids, aefw, white & red bugs, symbiodinium. Actually they all seem about as happy as my acropora.

Back when I was ULNS, I only had to deal with pale/dying sticks and dinoflagellates. Quite the trade.

Why I am so deprived of just something simple like GHA? Oh. That is likely next. NVM.

 

[tundraguy1106]

Lordy do I hear you on the challenge of keeping pests out. I think if someone sends me some black bug/worms I can check off the pest list as complete.

I will speculate that while I won't quit heavy in / heavy out, it is not the easiest place to be regarding pest control.
I seem to cycle through aiptasia, vermetids, aefw, white & red bugs, symbiodinium. Actually they all seem about as happy as my acropora.

Back when I was ULNS, I only had to deal with pale/dying sticks and dinoflagellates. Quite the trade.

Why I am so deprived of just something simple like GHA? Oh. That is likely next. NVM.

In my old tank (36 gallon bow) I rarely tested for anything other than alk and cal. I was able to keep everything but gionoporas. The worst thing I battle was bryopsis. Normally I wouldn’t care however I’m watching $1500 worth of SPS slowly die away while all my parameters are in check now... what a hobby.

 

[Charlie’s Frags]

In my old tank (36 gallon bow) I rarely tested for anything other than alk and cal. I was able to keep everything but gionoporas. The worst thing I battle was bryopsis. Normally I wouldn’t care however I’m watching $1500 worth of SPS slowly die away while all my parameters are in check now... what a hobby.

$1500 ain’t too bad
I killed at least 5k of acros the first year back

 

[ScottB]

In my old tank (36 gallon bow) I rarely tested for anything other than alk and cal. I was able to keep everything but gionoporas. The worst thing I battle was bryopsis. Normally I wouldn’t care however I’m watching $1500 worth of SPS slowly die away while all my parameters are in check now... what a hobby.

One of my LFS refers to gonis as "rent-a-coral". You can have them for a while all happy and growing then the lease is up. I recently killed my 4th. Same pattern. I buy a little ping pong ball sized beauty. In six months precisely it is a softball. Six months and a few days...Next!

I get the frustration.

 

[tundraguy1106]

One of my LFS refers to gonis as "rent-a-coral". You can have them for a while all happy and growing then the lease is up. I recently killed my 4th. Same pattern. I buy a little ping pong ball sized beauty. In six months precisely it is a softball. Six months and a few days...Next!

I get the frustration.

I thought this one was a goner and then I started target feeding reef roids once or twice a week. Still hanging in there. It’s not my favorite coral but I’m hoping it does well. All my other LPS are so easy, I don’t know what I was thinking when I decided to go SPS... lol

 

[ScottB]

Hey Tundra. How goes the battle? Things settling down yet?