SPS Coral Dieing Slowly

[MnFish1]

Have you tried Montipora and other easier sps before this? Acropora is a hard first sps. Is your po4 0.5 or 0.05? 0.5 is highly toxic to stony corals IME.

Yes - I misread it - if your PO4 is that high it can be a problem. What are the units of that test? Have you double checked it? I notice that your ICP test doesnt match yoru other test.

 

[ycnibrc]

Why a new reef tank vs mature reef tank can't keep Sps? U can set up a perfect parameters new reef tank however Sps won't survive is because the new tank don't have adequate bacteria population. If you don't have enough live rock for bacteria to grow then the tank can't sustain a higher bio load.

 

[TX_Punisher]

P04 is quite high. I got stn at .1 last week. Water changes and less feedings got me back to .07.

 

[MnFish1]

Why a new reef tank vs mature reef tank can't keep Sps? U can set up a perfect parameters new reef tank however Sps won't survive is because the new tank don't have adequate bacteria population. If you don't have enough live rock for bacteria to grow then the tank can't sustain a higher bio load.

Generally this is thought to be a fact, but there is also a school out there that its not the bacteria or the age of the tank - its the experience of the aquarist thats more of a problem. There are at least a couple threads of people setting up tanks with SPS over a very short time that are successful.

 

[delandreefer]

This tank has supported SPS before. I will look through my records when i get home and see where my tests were back then but from memory its about the same. These are picture from Sept and Oct. of last year respectively.


It is sounding like my PO4 is sky high I will retest tonight and confirm. Should I run some GFO to pull it down if it tests that high again?

 

[MnFish1]

This tank has supported SPS before. I will look through my records when i get home and see where my tests were back then but from memory its about the same. These are picture from Sept and Oct. of last year respectively.


It is sounding like my PO4 is sky high I will retest tonight and confirm. Should I run some GFO to pull it down if it tests that high again?

Im not an expert on GFO - but - when I have tried to use it - it caused more problems that it helped (dropped too quickly or too slowly, etc) water changes may be the way to go? But others with more experience with GFO may be able to answer better thanI.

 

[ycnibrc]

Generally this is thought to be a fact, but there is also a school out there that its not the bacteria or the age of the tank - its the experience of the aquarist thats more of a problem. There are at least a couple threads of people setting up tanks with SPS over a very short time that are successful.

I'm not saying with definitely the cause but every single thread regarding Coral don't do well the first question is always what is your parameters? Alk swing, too much light, not enough flow, check voltage, check rusted , check temp , check salinity etc.... Zeovit system dose bacteria and after 14 days u can start put in Sps.

 

[MnFish1]

I'm not saying with definitely the cause but every single thread regarding Coral don't do well the first question is always what is your parameters? Alk swing, too much light, not enough flow, check voltage, check rusted , check temp , check salinity etc.... Zeovit system dose bacteria and after 14 days u can start put in Sps.

Yes - I wasn't disagreeing with you at all - just that it can be done (but adding early probably fails more than it succeeds due to experience of the person doing the 'adding')

 

[SeaDweller]

Im not an expert on GFO - but - when I have tried to use it - it caused more problems that it helped (dropped too quickly or too slowly, etc) water changes may be the way to go? But others with more experience with GFO may be able to answer better thanI.

I’d use GFO or maybe a little LC here. For an example, I use 9 tbsp/125 g of Rowaphos on my 240 to help maintain po4 below 0.10 ppm.

If I were you, OP, in your size system, I’d use 1-2 tbsp of gfo and check your levels after a couple of days and then change it out and use the same amount again. You don’t need a ton of gfo to help clean up the PO4, and I think that’s where people mess up. I only use about 1/2 the recommended dosage.

 

[bobby.w.hodges]

Water changes should help more than gfo. Gfo should be used as a regular routine not as a problem solver, that's when people go wrong and create problems.

 

[Charlie’s Frags]

A more accurate po4 should be the first step.

This tank has supported SPS before. I will look through my records when i get home and see where my tests were back then but from memory its about the same. These are picture from Sept and Oct. of last year respectively.


It is sounding like my PO4 is sky high I will retest tonight and confirm. Should I run some GFO to pull it down if it tests that high again?

And I mean no offense, but encrusted frags from 8 months ago doesn’t prove systematic support. What happened to all those frags from Oct?

 

[jda]

Confirm the P value. Use a reliable method, like Hannah Ultra Low (or the regular if you have higher readings).

If the P is that high, then it is a definite issue... maybe not the only one, but one for sure. GFO can work fine. It can be safe, but you have to go SLOW. The water is not the only place with P, the rocks and sand will have a bunch too. In fact, if you started with dry rock, this is likely where it is coming from.

If you want to run GFO, put 3-4 tablespoons in a reactor and run it slow. Change this every few days. If you go any faster than this, or with more media, you will quickly lower the amount in the water column a good deal and then the rock will release a bunch and get you almost back up to where you were. This strong down, up, down, up, down and up is what harms the corals, not the GFO. Most people use too much or use it too fast. Small amounts and frequent changes are best to where the levels are lowered slowly and linearly.

 

[dwest]

Confirm the P value. Use a reliable method, like Hannah Ultra Low (or the regular if you have higher readings).

If the P is that high, then it is a definite issue... maybe not the only one, but one for sure. GFO can work fine. It can be safe, but you have to go SLOW. The water is not the only place with P, the rocks and sand will have a bunch too. In fact, if you started with dry rock, this is likely where it is coming from.

If you want to run GFO, put 3-4 tablespoons in a reactor and run it slow. Change this every few days. If you go any faster than this, or with more media, you will quickly lower the amount in the water column a good deal and then the rock will release a bunch and get you almost back up to where you were. This strong down, up, down, up, down and up is what harms the corals, not the GFO. Most people use too much or use it too fast. Small amounts and frequent changes are best to where the levels are lowered slowly and linearly.

Agree with JDA and others. Hannah ULR. Go real sloooooooow with GFO.

Did your stray voltage check come up with anything?

 

[jda]

Lan Chloride can work OK, but you have to have a lot of P in the water column to immediately bind to the LC and produce the floculant, or else it can get messy. If you are at .5, then it would probably work until you get down to .1, or so, but you still have to go slow and make sure that you catch all of the floculant in a small micron fliter sock. Some people just dose their tank and hope that the skimmer gets it, but that freaks me out - to each their own. In any case, once you get below .1, then it is GFO or Aluminum Oxide (Phosguard) to finish the job.

The same think still applies with the rock releasing P after the water column goes lower... gotta really strive not to have the ups and downs and stay on a slow, steady decline.

 

[swirlygig]

Mag of 1200? IME I have lost corals at that level. Get it back to 1350. I would start there.

Don't mess with GFO yet. Your corals are already stressed. Maybe water changes might help a little.

I lost lots of corals due to GFO. Stopped using it and have no issues. I have seen people with extremely high phosphates. Corals couldn't be happier. Too low will cause problems.

 

[swirlygig]

Im not an expert on GFO - but - when I have tried to use it - it caused more problems that it helped (dropped too quickly or too slowly, etc) water changes may be the way to go? But others with more experience with GFO may be able to answer better thanI.

GFO killed lots of coral in my tank. Couldn't agree more.

 

[Ferrell]

I run GFO/carbon reactor but I run for a short time every hour and when I say short I mean about 10 secs and lower PO4 gradually (I use apex and OSC program). I lowered it super fast once from .25 to .1 over the course of a couple days and stn was the result. Since then if I miss the creep up I don’t panic and lower it slooooowly.
I do test every two days and when not needed I turn reactor off.

 

[Ike]

If they're dying that fast there is something majorly wrong and what most people are pointing to as possibilities would be highly unlikely to kill corals quickly. Start by verifying big things like alkalinity, temp and salinity are correct and that you're not getting thrown off by something not being calibrated or testing properly. If all that verifies then I'd just do a couple large water changes with what you know to be 0 TDS water and a quality salt.

 

[Hans-Werner]

Phosphate is high and calcium is very low, close to lethal. Calcium concentration at 339 ppm (ICP test result) is much too low. I saw LPS start to decay at ca. 300 ppm. 430 to 450 ppm would be adequate for your alkalinity and phosphate level. Now your water is undersaturated with calcium carbonate.

 

[tah532]

Its the phosphates....I am having this exact same issue. Thought it was ALK swings but got that dialed in and consistent but it keeps happening. Did an ICP test and my phosphates were just over 0.5. Working currently to bring this down for good.

 

[tah532]

Its the phosphates....I am having this exact same issue. Thought it was ALK swings but got that dialed in and consistent but it keeps happening. Did an ICP test and my phosphates were just over 0.5. Working currently to bring this down for good.

 

[tah532]

Its the phosphates....I am having this exact same issue. Thought it was ALK swings but got that dialed in and consistent but it keeps happening. Did an ICP test and my phosphates were just over 0.5. Working currently to bring this down for good.