SPS RTN - How quickly they go!

Birddog · Jul 17, 2016

What a week! Had a few frags RTN'd about a week ago and this week had a hand full of mini-colonies go up in a poof of smoke. Total loss of my Red Planet, able to salvage a couple of frags of Pink Lemonade, Thurman's Rainbow, Pearly Cadaver and Spainbow. Really worried about my Aussie Gold, ASD Rainbow, PC Rainbow, Grape Juice, Jared's Rainbow, Red Wing and Bonsai. Any suggestions?

NO3 3 ppm
PO4 .06 ppm
pH 8.0 - 8.3
Mg 1400 ppm
Ca 475 ppm
dKH 8.4

Pretty unhappy that I've gone from nearly baseball size colonies down to 1" frags.

twilliard · Jul 17, 2016

Oh man I am sorry this is happening to you!
It is unusual how fast the can go both in growth and death.
Try not to make drastic changes with chemistry when you see this happening but rather focus on anything that has changed in the daily routine.

reefwiser · Jul 17, 2016

Treatment for RTN, STN use doxycycline at mg/per gallon for 24 hours in a QT tank to arrest tissue sloughing. Research has shown this is a bacterial infection.

Battlecorals · Jul 17, 2016

Shoot man That is a heartbreaker. Sounds like some kind of rapid contamination for sure. either source water or something like a rusty magnet or worse like the old "battery in the sump" meltdown

you aren't running a dual membrane RO system at all are you?

twilliard · Jul 17, 2016

reefwiser said:
Treatment for RTN, STN use doxycycline at mg/per gallon for 24 hours in a QT tank to arrest tissue sloughing. Research has shown this is a bacterial infection.

Agreed I studied 2 corals that was having an issue with tissue loss and indeed the bacterial population was massive at the intersection of the tissue and skeleton

Birddog · Jul 17, 2016

Battlecorals said:
Shoot man That is a heartbreaker. Sounds like some kind of rapid contamination for sure. either source water or something like a rusty magnet or worse like the old "battery in the sump" meltdown

you aren't running a dual membrane RO system at all are you?

Running a BRS Chloramines 5 stage Adam. Admittedly, the only thing I did, due to my work schedule, is went one additional week on my normal schedule of WC's (which normally occurs weekly) and two extra weeks on a change out of my ROX carbon and GFO .

reefwiser · Jul 17, 2016

Jamie Graggs the great coral biologist posted this back in May.

Birddog · Jul 17, 2016

reefwiser said:
Treatment for RTN, STN use doxycycline at mg/per gallon for 24 hours in a QT tank to arrest tissue sloughing. Research has shown this is a bacterial infection.

I don't know this compound Ed... and honestly wouldn't know how to get the colonies into a QT. The Aussie Gold, Bonsai are roughly the size of a softball and have encrusted big areas of LR. Can I treat the display and where do I find doxycycline?

cginter · Jul 17, 2016

Battlecorals said:
Shoot man That is a heartbreaker. Sounds like some kind of rapid contamination for sure. either source water or something like a rusty magnet or worse like the old "battery in the sump" meltdown

you aren't running a dual membrane RO system at all are you?

Just out of curiosity, where were you going with the dual membrane RO unit?

Birddog · Jul 17, 2016

twilliard said:
Oh man I am sorry this is happening to you!
It is unusual how fast the can go both in growth and death.
Try not to make drastic changes with chemistry when you see this happening but rather focus on anything that has changed in the daily routine.

Thank you Twilliard!

twilliard · Jul 17, 2016

Birddog said:
I don't know this compound Ed... and honestly wouldn't know how to get the colonies into a QT. The Aussie Gold, Bonsai are roughly the size of a softball and have encrusted big areas of LR. Can I treat the display and where do I find doxycycline?

Don't treat the display
It may be the same as this Oxytetracycline which is in the same drug class
Found here
http://www.jehmco.com/html/medications.html

Battlecorals · Jul 17, 2016

The problem with any kind of medication is, that if your water its contaminated you will only exacerbate the problem and pulling them all and QT'ing would surely be the final blow to already stressed sps. . That is an extremely drastic measure if you aren't 100% sure it's a bacterial issue

I'd rule out any possible pollution before assuming that the issue is bacterial. Inspect your sump thoroughly , not sure if you have any kids or its its a possibility but things get thrown in there that shouldn't be. I'd Inspect every single magnet, pump and heater as well for starters. Did you have any warning signs at all or any kind of visible change or symptom prior to the first frags crashing?

John Carroll · Jul 17, 2016

Birddog said:
I don't know this compound Ed... and honestly wouldn't know how to get the colonies into a QT. The Aussie Gold, Bonsai are roughly the size of a softball and have encrusted big areas of LR. Can I treat the display and where do I find doxycycline?

Doxy is a strong antibiotic. It is used as an antimalarial med. DFS sells it online but I don't know if you need to show a script or not.

Birddog · Jul 17, 2016

Battlecorals said:
The problem with any kind of medication is, that if your water its contaminated you will only exacerbate the problem and pulling them all and QT'ing would surely be the final blow to already stressed sps. . That is an extremely drastic measure if you aren't 100% sure it's a bacterial issue

I'd rule out any possible pollution before assuming that the issue is bacterial. Inspect your sump thoroughly , not sure if you have any kids or its its a possibility but things get thrown in there that shouldn't be. I'd Inspect every single magnet, pump and heater as well for starters. Did you have any warning signs at all or any kind of visible change or symptom prior to the first frags crashing?

No, no signs Adam... Actually was very happy with color and growth prior. My kids are grown and basically it just me and my wife, so as far as something getting tossed into the tank or sump I think I can rule it out. I'm just finishing a water change and will begin work / inspection on sump. Thank you Adam!

Graffiti Spot · Jul 17, 2016

I agree with Adam in that moving stressed corals to a new qt tank is very risky.
I would love to read about doxy as a treatment for bacterial infections as well guys. Any links would be appreciated!
I would think a quick weak iodine dip in any corals showing signs would be a good idea until you figure out what's up.

reefwiser · Jul 17, 2016

Learned this from Joe Yaiullo. It's brought up in discussions on RTN and STN nature and treatment. It's something you pick up at MACNA. When you get a bunch SPS freaks sitting around the bar late at night and talking corals. [emoji3]

ksc · Jul 17, 2016

Doxy is used to treat lyme disease too. You need a prescrip. to get it for humans or dogs. For some reason you don't need it if you're purchasing for birds.

https://www.campingsurvival.com/can...cycline-100mg-30-tablets-tl-02-50036-t02.html

SeaDweller · Jul 17, 2016

John Carroll said:
Doxy is a strong antibiotic. It is used as an antimalarial med. DFS sells it online but I don't know if you need to show a script or not.

Is a good broad spectrum, i wonder if it has application in treating ich (totally off topic but Chloroquine phosphate is used as anti malarial prophylaxis/tx too)?

reefwiser · Jul 18, 2016

No[emoji3]

North Borders · Jul 18, 2016

Tetracycline is in the same drug family and is readily available for aquariums. Anyone have any treatment success with Tetra? Now, with that said, doxy has many more uses than tetra in humans. However, tetracycline is one of the drugs of choice used in a cocktail to treat Vibrio in humans (along with a third-generation cephalosporin) and I wonder if mono therapy would be as effective as doxycycline.