Super Slow Growth

[xthunderx]

Some of the things that made my corals grow more rapidly:

1. More light
2. More flow
3. More fish

These three variables all contributed to better growth in my experience. For my tank, I believe I was low on all three. Eventually, I think I did too much fish and slowly fine tuned my bioload to get the best color and growth. Right now I'm pretty happy with my tank, but it's clear to me now how much more light and flow was required to get to where I am today.

 

[TJ's Reef]

Yes , absolutely Roy you can run a very sound/stable Reef without a sand bed and certainly not a prerequisite for success. Healthy is healthy no matter the approach and the opposite is equally true... unfortunately. IMHO / IME water chemistry, nutrient balance followed by water flow/flow direction should be the top three charactoristics one should look when trouble shooting Reeftank issues.
A water change can fix many issues quickly but sometimes it's more complicated and requires more understanding of the livestock we keep. As an example Coral Alleopathy, certain Coral can produce/release chemicals that stunt or harm neighboring colonies/frags and can be as simple if understood to alleviate by changing the flow pattern or switching places of Corals affected. Keeping a healthy Mixed Reef is not easy without great understanding and/or experience to which corals do not play nicely together. Many Soft Corals use chemical warfare towards Stony Corals and when setting up a Mixed Reef's flow patterns or Coral placement must be considered and planned for.

Anyhow, not quite a 100% yet so need to go lay down for a few and once again apologize for my approach on last nights comments above. Not trying to pick on or be mean in any way to anyone. On the contrary, I strive to teach patience and understanding to the many ways one can go about being successful in this hobby. Openly sharing my decades of experiences both positive and negative.


Cheers, Todd

 

[Pete polyp]

I had some Sps that showed almost no growth for 10 months. During that 10 months nitrate was undetectable. I moved the tank, and nitrate showed up (0.5). Within 1 month these same sps started showing lots of growth and a major transformation in color. Within 1 1/2 months the amount of growth tripled the past 10 months.

 

[tomtep]

I think you need more spectrum to your light. Do you have optics on your LEDs?

 

[luke33]

If your parameters are staying constant and your just not getting good growth, from your description i would have to agree with tomtep a bit. I have ran quite a few different LED's in the last 5yrs and i have only gotten good growth on sps with a mix of blue, white, red and violet or green. If just blue and white i never had good growth with led's.

The other thing like mentioned above is your water may be to clean. I have found dirtying up the water a bit helps coral growth. When i say dirty i don't mean dirty i just don't mean 0 trates, .0001 phos...etc. You don't want a sterile tank.

As far as sand goes my sps have always grown 10x's faster without sand : P

 

[Pete polyp]

I have never heard that sps will grow faster without sand in the tank. I'm in no way implying that it isn't true, but is just something I have never heard. I guess I'm going to find out with my current bb build for sps.

 

[ritter6788]

It's not the sand that would slow growth. Detritus and sludge can build up in sandbeds raising phosphates and causing slower growth and algae problems. A well set up and maintained sand bed is fine in a tank. My old sand bed was full of nasty stuff.

 

[joekool]

Todd sounds like you are so over being sick.

 

[specialk]

Had a 90 gallon with SPS and MH's. Good water movement. Decent growth. (sand bed in both tanks) Moved into a 125 and switched over to LEDs (Ocean Revive LED's) and growth took off!! For me I also do CONSISTENT (consistency is so key in this hobby as many know) 15-20% water changes every 2 weeks. I was seriously blown away as to how fast and how much more growth I got under LED's then I did when they were under MH's. Also, some SPS grow slower then others obviously. BUT for me, my SPS are growing like weeds just with water changes and I do NOT feed any chemicals or coral food to them. For me the biggest thing is god flow obviously, good lighting and good consistent water changes. Just my dos pesos and what works for me. And after all, as a businessman I must say ... the first rule of business is --> "Don't ever mess with a good thing" ... and for me it works and is good so I'm sticking to it and not doing anything else different.

 

[m88a2]

i have found that increasing the feeding of my fish has helped my growth. however i have also increased my water change amount to deal with this. increased volume of input and export of bio.

 

[Pete polyp]

I can think of other reasons that sps can grow better without sand, but the nutrient stuff I'm not so sure about. The reflection of light I can understand. The more intense flow I can understand. But stating that a system will be "less stable" with sand I have a problem wrapping my head around. The sand will actually help buffer Ph, which would be more stable. The sand will actually absorb po4 and process no³, so I don't understand that theory either. There will have to be a different method in removing both of these with a barebottom tank. I could understand that with the different methods of removing po4 and no³ that there may be a difference in growth also. Let me ask the people that have noticed a difference in growth with a barebottom setup a question. Do you have sand anywhere in the system? In the sump maybe? I'm not trying to argue pro sandbed. I'm only trying to get an understanding as to why there would be a difference.

 

[ritter6788]

lLet me ask the people that have noticed a difference in growth with a barebottom setup a question. Do you have sand anywhere in the system? In the sump maybe? I'm not trying to argue pro sandbed. I'm only trying to get an understanding as to why there would be a difference.

I don't have a scrap of sand in my tanks. My sump is barebottom too. (I do have scraps of sand but you get what I'm saying ) A sandbed is not a requirement for a successful tank.

 

[Eckolancer]

Ive had one tank crash in my 15 years and only thing I could think that caused it was a DSB. One of my fish was messing with the top layer of sand and it nearly killed everything over night.

 

[Pete polyp]

I don't have a scrap of sand in my tanks. My sump is barebottom too. (I do have scraps of sand but you get what I'm saying ) A sandbed is not a requirement for a successful tank.

What methods of nutrient and phosphate export are you practicing? I'm finding this very interesting.

 

[ritter6788]

What methods of nutrient and phosphate export are you practicing? I'm finding this very interesting.

Just a skimmer. I don't run GFO, biopellets or anything to remove phosphates. I even took my cheato out of my fuge and just run it dark with liverock. The cheato never grew and it was always full of detritus. I've tried GFO several times and my corals always stop growing or die when I use it. Even in small amounts. I feed everyday and sometimes 2-3 times a day if I'm home. I don't rinse my foods and I always over feed. I just create a 'snowstorm' of food in the tank so the entire reef gets some.

 

[NeverlosT]

feed more/more fish = more nutrients/aminos/goodies/fish poop in the water = more complete ecosystem.

I just ran a little experiment and ran no GFO for a few months, growth was awesome. Started running GFO again and growth halted. It isnt a study ready for science magazine, but it is a datapoint. I think that GFO and its consequences to the water, if used in too large a dose or too high flow, can be detrimental to coral growth.

Ritter - I feed like you but I run a fuge (tank is newer than yours though). I hope to be able to just run the fuge with rock as a pod sanctuary someday.

GFO is a problem in my opinion.

 

[Pete polyp]

Well, before finding all if this I have planned a bb for my sps. I did include a phosban reactor and a biopellet reactor to the purchases I have made. I was wanting a multifaceted approach to nutrient removal. I have hoped to never get the gfo wet. I will be using a skimmer and have a lit fuge for cheato, not just to aid nutrient export, but to aid in limiting Ph swings. The reactor will be put to use for carbon at first though. This will be my first setup with a sump, so I'm kinda clueless. I chose this setup so that I would not have a problem turning the display into a snow globe with all the flow I will be throwing at it. I have every intention in stocking it heavily with fish, and feeding the heck out of it. This is where I'm at so far.
https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150583

 

[Eckolancer]

Mine is a BB with skimmer and bio pellets. No lights unless I open a door. Here is a week of temp and ph from apex. Not much fluctuations from it. I dose over a 24 hour period alk and cal.

 

[PaulKreider]

Over the whole system I only have 24 less running right now. I normally don't run the other 12 cool whites but I think I'm going to give them a shot and slowly turn them on starting at 15%. And ramp them up over the course of a month or so. Il see how this plays out. Honestly I was worried about burning up the corals so maybe this will help.

 

[TJ's Reef]

Hey Paul, thanks for the response. What are your lighting schedule hours or duration ? I'm thinking that your Corals are just lacking in light energy. As an example for my 125g 60x24x20 dimensions I have 91 mixed 3w emitters running at 41% overall for 13 hours start to finish and 12 3w 6500K's running 2 hours at 70% for a Noonday PAR blast. I really believe you'll get a nice burst of Coral growth adding some more intensity especially in the broader spectrum of White LED's.

Cheers, Todd