Support your local fish store!!

[Waynerock]

Just got to remind everybody to always try to shop local. My LFS who has an awesome shop might be closing very soon because his sales are so bad. This is the last true shop within a 80 mile radius for me and It truly sucks. Online sales are killing him and yes he does not get the truly exotic stuff that is hot right now but his fish are always super healthy and his corals are in perfect shape. Ex. this goni I got yesterday

. I am bummed and felt like reminding everyone to maybe spend a little more, or drive a little further and help a small business out!

 

[kchristensen8064]

I completely agree with you. Unfortunately the best LFS I had near me closed and left one that is just okay but further than I like to drive, and the other doesn't have a single fish that doesn't have ich or is dead. That really keeps me from even supporting them on dry goods as well. So I say if you have a good one definitely support them as much as you possibly can. It's seems that good ones are hard to find these days.

 

[road_runner]

+1, I always buy live stocks, food, additives and consumables exclusively from LFS.

 

[tehmadreefer]

I always see this support your local lfs blah blah blah, but what if one of your lfs's is a big online shop such as wwc?

Do you not support them?

 

[BadFish619]

Always pay the extra few dollars to support mine. I'll even have them order the very thing I can order myself online and pay the couple bucks just for the support.

 

[mitch91175]

It's not solely the online stores causing retailers to go out of business, it is a number of things.

1. Facebook auctions - more means for a hobbyists to start selling anything and everything hobby related
2. Having decent stores to buy from at decent prices (this will not occur as long as there isn't universal online tax)
3. Some stores are just not good to begin with

The stores are more to blame than anything else really. They have the same opportunity to do more business online, but many of them aren't savvy enough to get that going.

 

[sergebmw2]

It's not solely the online stores causing retailers to go out of business, it is a number of things.

1. Facebook auctions - more means for a hobbyists to start selling anything and everything hobby related
2. Having decent stores to buy from at decent prices (this will not occur as long as there isn't universal online tax)
3. Some stores are just not good to begin with

The stores are more to blame than anything else really. They have the same opportunity to do more business online, but many of them aren't savvy enough to get that going.

While I agree with you about Facebook auctions and the fact that there are hardly any great LFS. It's not just the stores fault, they are focusing on selling fish, corals and other equipment. While the Facebook guys tend to focus on fragging. I love the auctions online, but lots of them are over edited to give that pop. I love to see my corals in real life to see what they will look like under my t5 light.

I support my local fish store cause I can get most of ally stuff without waiting for shipping and get freebies [emoji41] [emoji41]

 

[Peace River]

It's not solely the online stores causing retailers to go out of business, it is a number of things.

1. Facebook auctions - more means for a hobbyists to start selling anything and everything hobby related
2. Having decent stores to buy from at decent prices (this will not occur as long as there isn't universal online tax)
3. Some stores are just not good to begin with

The stores are more to blame than anything else really. They have the same opportunity to do more business online, but many of them aren't savvy enough to get that going.

Unfortunately I have seen far too many LFSs go out of business (or are currently barely scraping by) because of #3 (this could include poor service, poor business model, failure to adapt, etc.). The Internet has clearly changed the marketplace and added new challenges and benefits to LFSs and consumers. I try to support local businesses of all types when reasonably possible, but some local business make that hard to do!

 

[Js.Aqua.Project]

I don't always put the blame for closing on the store, so I do disagree there. However, if a store is using competing with online sales as the excuse then they are just using it a scapegoat and there are probably other problems too...

I can honestly that I've never bought a coral/fish/invertebrate from a store I haven't physically stood in. I believe in supporting the LFS as much as possible, but they have to understand that in our society customers will tend to spend where they can find a better product at the same/lower price.

(In this hobby there seems to be an exception; if you add a WWC tag to the front of it people will pay $30 for 1/2" frag of GSP or Xenia that is $5 at your LFS)

 

[mitch91175]

Unfortunately I have seen far too many LFSs go out of business (or are currently barely scraping by) because of #3 (this could include poor service, poor business model, failure to adapt, etc.). The Internet has clearly changed the marketplace and added new challenges and benefits to LFSs and consumers. I try to support local businesses of all types when reasonably possible, but some local business make that hard to do!

Another major problem that I see is that a lot of stores hire minimum wage employees that some do not know simple things about the hobby in general. Lord knows if you go in a store and ask a "regular" employee something more advanced.

Not even elaborating on the issue of limited stock availability or healthy products as was mentioned.

Have you ever bought water from an LFS and it was just terrible? Stopped that over 16 years ago. I know someone local to my market that had been selling fish for over 10 years and finally opened a store (more on that later) and didn't even know how to work his ATO, but was selling water. His sediment filter was "black". In all my time reefing I have never seen a black sediment filter. I was there one day and saw someone buy some water from him and was dumbfounded. Needless to say I do not associate with his any longer. Same individual has said to me he would rather people fish die so they will buy more.

The reason a lot of stores do close is because they aren't businessmen. They are hobbyists that had to open a store because of how this industry works. Take this for example, in order to order bulk salt, you HAVE to be in a brick-and-mortar. At least that is what it's like in DFW. No matter if you are running a legitimate home-based business, you cannot buy certain items. So those individuals end up getting a storefront and not being nearly as prepared as they should; resulting in closing down.

 

[road_runner]

Another major problem that I see is that a lot of stores hire minimum wage employees that some do not know simple things about the hobby in general. Lord knows if you go in a store and ask a "regular" employee something more advanced.

Not even elaborating on the issue of limited stock availability or healthy products as was mentioned.

Have you ever bought water from an LFS and it was just terrible? Stopped that over 16 years ago. I know someone local to my market that had been selling fish for over 10 years and finally opened a store (more on that later) and didn't even know how to work his ATO, but was selling water. His sediment filter was "black". In all my time reefing I have never seen a black sediment filter. I was there one day and saw someone buy some water from him and was dumbfounded. Needless to say to do not associate with his any longer.

The reason a lot of stores do close is because they aren't businessmen. They are hobbyists that had to open a store because of how this industry works. Take this for example, in order to order bulk salt, you HAVE to be in a brick-and-mortar. At least that is what it's like in DFW. No matter if you are running a legitimate home-based business, you cannot buy certain items. So those individuals end up getting a storefront and not being nearly as prepared as they should; resulting in closing down.

For me I almost stopped buying dry goods from LFS because they usually are biased for whoever give them better margin and end up limiting hobbyist exposure to what's going on beyond the brand they support.

 

[mitch91175]

For me I almost stopped buying dry goods from LFS because they usually are biased for whoever give them the beat margin and end up limiting hobbies exposure to what's going on beyond the brand they support.

Reef Crystals come to mind, lol

 

[road_runner]

Reef Crystals come to mind, lol

YES!!

 

[Js.Aqua.Project]

Another major problem that I see is that a lot of stores hire minimum wage employees that some do not know simple things about the hobby in general. Lord knows if you go in a store and ask a "regular" employee something more advanced.

This tends to be a problem at the main LFS here in Ocala, ask a question beyond "what type of coral is that?" or "how much?" and you will be met with a lot of blubbering as they don't know simple requirements of what it needs to thrive.

Have you ever bought water from an LFS and it was just terrible? Stopped that over 16 years ago. I know someone local to my market that had been selling fish for over 10 years and finally opened a store (more on that later) and didn't even know how to work his ATO, but was selling water. His sediment filter was "black". In all my time reefing I have never seen a black sediment filter.

There is an LFS up in Gainesville that has a TDS of the "RODI" water higher than the water IN to my RODI. Hasn't changed filters in year. But he has been in town for 20+ years and is in a college town with a rotating population, so he gets new clientele every year. I hear he is looking to sell and get out of the business.....

The reason a lot of stores do close is because they aren't businessmen. They are hobbyists that had to open a store because of how this industry works. Take this for example, in order to order bulk salt, you HAVE to be in a brick-and-mortar. At least that is what it's like in DFW. No matter if you are running a legitimate home-based business, you cannot buy certain items. So those individuals end up getting a storefront and not being nearly as prepared as they should; resulting in closing down.

This has been the rise/fall of numerous stores across Central Florida. Right now, within 20 miles of me, there are 3 "traditional" stores and almost 20 "hobbyist" home stores who have all teased opening a store...luckily the "smart" ones are content running out of their house/garage.

For me I almost stopped buying dry goods from LFS because they usually are biased for whoever give them the beat margin and end up limiting hobbies exposure to what's going on beyond the brand they support.

Stores have a habit of preferring brands they trust while stocking brands that help them make money. We had an LFS here that preferred Red Sea products (average 30% markup) but would also carry Brightwell, Instant Ocean, and Seachem (50% markup) because of the extra profits off the items.

Unfortunately this hobby is competitive on the LFS front from multiple sides, competing with other LFS, hobbyists in the area as well as online vendors. Sometimes a store doesn't make it, and while that can suck, that is what happens...you can have an amazing LFS full of good livestock, knowledge, and customer support go out of business while a less reputable LFS has better business since thrive.

 

[road_runner]

This tends to be a problem at the main LFS here in Ocala, ask a question beyond "what type of coral is that?" or "how much?" and you will be met with a lot of blubbering as they don't know simple requirements of what it needs to thrive.



There is an LFS up in Gainesville that has a TDS of the "RODI" water higher than the water IN to my RODI. Hasn't changed filters in year. But he has been in town for 20+ years and is in a college town with a rotating population, so he gets new clientele every year. I hear he is looking to sell and get out of the business.....



This has been the rise/fall of numerous stores across Central Florida. Right now, within 20 miles of me, there are 3 "traditional" stores and almost 20 "hobbyist" home stores who have all teased opening a store...luckily the "smart" ones are content running out of their house/garage.



Stores have a habit of preferring brands they trust while stocking brands that help them make money. We had an LFS here that preferred Red Sea products (average 30% markup) but would also carry Brightwell, Instant Ocean, and Seachem (50% markup) because of the extra profits off the items.

Unfortunately this hobby is competitive on the LFS front from multiple sides, competing with other LFS, hobbyists in the area as well as online vendors. Sometimes a store doesn't make it, and while that can suck, that is what happens...you can have an amazing LFS full of good livestock, knowledge, and customer support go out of business while a less reputable LFS has better business since thrive.

Well said....not brand they trust only...brands they partner with. Partnership is built over multiple factors trust might be only one of the factors...

 

[Peace River]

. . .
(In this hobby there seems to be an exception; if you add a WWC tag to the front of it people will pay $30 for 1/2" frag of GSP or Xenia that is $5 at your LFS)

That’s an important point and it doesn’t have to be an exception. A huge shout out to @WWC for creating a model that includes the creation of both real and perceived value!

WWC is both an online vendor and has a store front with another coming soon (to some people in the Orlando area they are their LFS). However, their approach isn’t the only model to establishing a financially, environmentally, and socially successful LFS in in the Internet era.

 

[road_runner]

That’s an important point and it doesn’t have to be an exception. A huge shout out to @WWC for creating a model that includes the creation of both real and perceived value!

WWC is both an online vendor and has a store front with another coming soon (to some people in the Orlando area they are their LFS). However, their approach isn’t the only model to establishing a financially, environmentally, and socially successful LFS in in the Internet era.

Really? Because I always thought of WWC as someone who hype coral and sell way over its actual worth... maybe am wrong but so far I was able to get mini colonies for the same price I would pay for a tiny frag from wwc....

 

[Paul Sands]

There are many online coral and fish vendors who are small business owners too.

 

[Lowell Lemon]

Well there are many factors the local store has against it. First and foremost is capital. Most stores are under capitalized from the start. So you go to the store to find one of this and one of that on the shelf....low inventory is the kiss of death and is right there with the wrong inventory. Next you discover the new owner loved the hobby and it just led to a store to continue the hobby so they are probably weak on the business side. Next you discover they buy from Central Pet...who owns most of the dry goods distribution and manufacturing. So they buy the same products you can get for less online or at mass merchandisers. As a result they are killed during the dollar a gallon sale at Petco due to the fact Central does not offer that perk to the LFS. So now you have tanks you can't even sell at a loss taking up valuable space on your very expensive rental floor. Then you have the consumer who does not even understand landed cost telling the new owner they just bought an Elos tank for x before reporting the total cost including the shipping. The customer thinks they saved Hugh until they see the freight bill....and the broken tank. The store could have competed if they stocked a similar item with a lower landed cost.

The biggest mistake is thinking you can survive on livestock sales along....and then the store closes.

I could go on and on but I already have. The odds are stacked against the local store all the way to tax free sales by online sellers.

 

[Gaspipe]

Being new to this hobby (and dry) I can say that the internet has 100% crushed B&M stores especially the LFS. Whatever I know about this hobby is 100% from online (mostly R2R and youtube). In the past someone would heavily rely on the LFS for his/her knowledge and expertise. Now days noobz will rely on some of the top users here and let's say the top 5 youtubers (BRS, Saltwater Aquarium, etc) for their information.

There is just so many questions, and finding a good LFS that is somewhat driving distance who is willing to offer the time and correct information is tough. I'm in Cranford, NJ and from this site I was told there are 2 really good LFS within the hour from me. Perhaps if I ever get this tank going I would try and visit them once a month or something. But in all reality, things I need ASAP would be ordered online, supporting the vendors who have nurtured this for me.

Someone mentioned that LFS hire no experience, minimum waged employees. Those people should not be answering any questions other than what aisle an item is OR point the client to the right person.

Regarding not being savvy enough, they can hire for min. wage a HS kid to set-up an online facebook, ebay, whatever avenue of shopping you wish. Take pictures, set up an email, website, etc. The kid does the tech, pictures and other mundane tasks, the owner does the handling (price, shipping, answering questions, detailed information on the item).

There are still a lot of services the LFS can offer that rely on person to person. I can't reasonably have WWC come to my house to set up or maintain my system. I just hope the GOOD knowledgeable LFS are savvy enough that they need to utilize the internet as a tool and not an obstacle.