T5s leaking voltage into tank...how do I fix it?

[bct15]

I'm in need of some fix it advice from some of you knowledgable people.

In answering a question about a tang earlier, I decided to check the voltage in my tank which I haven't done in a long time. I found out I had a lot of voltage in my tank and found one of the sources, when I unplug my retrofit t5s my voltage drops from 49 volts to 12 -15 volts. So my question is how is the t5s getting voltage into my water? It is a retrofit kit with the lights attached to a glass beam in the top of my tank and none of it touches water. Pic below

There is another one exactly like that on the front. I thought glass was an insulator but the voltage must be running through the glass into the water. When I check the reflector, I get a very high voltage that makes my multimeter beep. When I hover the probe in the air between my t5s with them on I am getting a voltage that fluctuates from 5.6 volts to 8.7 volts.

So how do I fix this, I have second retrofit kit in the shed...should I swap it out, or is there a particular cause I should look for?


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[-Logzor]

I've played this exact same game before in my system. I suspected that the plug was somehow backfeeding into my other equipment in the aquarium (heater, pumps, etc). I ended up running a new cord to a grounded outlet and it fixed the problem.

Get a plug checker and see if the plug you're using is properly grounded.

 

[bct15]

It seems like every single thing I unplug reduces the voltage by three to five volts except the t5s reduce it by thirty or forty volts. My protein skimmer, mh, mp40s and uv have no effect. What is an acceptable voltage in a tank, last time I checked it my voltage was 7 volts.


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[bct15]

And also, whatever voltage I read in the tank my t5 reflector will read a volt to a half volt lower even with the t5s unplugged, I wonder if it is serving as some sort of ground for my tank...


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[kacrocorals581]

How are you checking the voltage putting neg and point of sale post in water?

 

[bct15]

No, I'm grounding the ground probe with an extension cord plugged into an outlet and sticking the hot plug in my water or touching my t5 reflector with it.


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[bct15]

All of the outlets Are wired correctly, checked them last night with an outlet checked. They are all upside down for some reason though, very outlet in the house is like that. (neutral on top of outlet)


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[Reefing Madness]

What is the reading with the probe in the water? Not touching the reflector. If your touching the reflector to ground, and getting voltage, theres something wrong with the light unit. But thats not getting into the water.
They flip outlets upside down when they are attached to switches, or you have the ability to turn them on and off via a light switch.

 

[bct15]

What is the reading with the probe in the water? Not touching the reflector. If your touching the reflector to ground, and getting voltage, theres something wrong with the light unit. But thats not getting into the water.
They flip outlets upside down when they are attached to switches, or you have the ability to turn them on and off via a light switch.

Before I unplugged the light the voltage would range from 49 to 75 volts with one probe in the water and the other on my neutral or ground in my extension cord, and when I touch the reflector and extension cord groud with the light plugged in I got over 100 volts.

With the t5s unplugged I am now getting 18 volts in the water and 17 volts in the reflector tested the same way. The t5s are copletely unplugged but i'm still getting a voltage in the reflector that is always a little lower than what is in the water.

When I unplug my reactor feed pump it drops by about five volts and when I unplug my quiet one return it drops by about two volts. With both unplugged I get about 9 volts in the tank but I can't figure out what the last nine is.

I though my heater or uv sterilizer were culprits but when I unplug each one there is no change in voltage at all. Also my skimmer feed pump and recirculation pump have no change in voltage, and nothing else touched the water but there is still nine volts in there.

What is an acceptable voltage in a tank, I know it wont be zero but where do I draw the line? My yellow belly blue tang was misbehaving a lot and seems to have calmed down after taking the lights off line.


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[Reefing Madness]

Can't be the lights. Unless you have them stuck in the water, they don't touch it. Theres no way for the light to throw voltage into the water just by chance. If your still getting a reading when everything is unplugged, its in your ground that your picking that up.

 

[-Logzor]

Achieving zero voltage is impossible because the magnetic field from spinning impellers from our pumps cause this voltage to occur. Only in some cases, when voltage is very high, is the cause "leaking voltage". I would say 7-10 is a normal range.

 

[bct15]

Thanks for the replies, can you guys answer these questions for me;

If the voltage is coming through my ground how do I fix that?

Can the current conduct through the glass the t5 is sitting on into my tank?

Why is there a voltage in my reflector when the t5 is unplugged?

Should I replace the retrofit kit with my other one, or should I look at doing something else?

What should I inspect on the installed kit first, the power cord and ground to the ballast?


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[Reefing Madness]

So let me get this straight. With everything unplugged, and nothing running yoiu still get voltage in the tank?
Trouble shooting it would mean, plug one thing in at a time, until it jumps up, not faint, but jumps. Thats your problem child. But your lights.......Can't figure it being the lights, not with the units legs being plasitc. Just can't see it.
Heater, powerheads, skimmer motor, those things I'd be thinking about. Anything in the water. You should be under i'd say 4 volts with everything on.

 

[bct15]

I'm absolutely positive when I unplug the t5s the voltage drops from 49-79 volts to 18 volts. I am also positive the skimmer pump, uv, and skimmer feed pump do not add a measurable difference to the voltage. I'm about to mess around with it some more.

My thinking is like yours, I can not comprehend how the t5s are getting a voltage in the tank but they are, I'll snap some pics and post them up.


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[slapshot]

T5 lights produce an induced voltage. Put a grounding probe in the tank when you are working in it and remove it when you are done. Remember current kills not voltage.

 

[Reefing Madness]

AMPs kill. But
Anyway you can kinda get rubber around the legs on this thing to get it isolated from the glass and tank itself?

 

[Badfish83]

Current is measured in amps. Like slapshot said your dealing with induction and the only thing you can do is get new lights or use a grounding probe.


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[Bow]

Try testing neutral to ground on a few outlets. Especially on other circuits. Off chance but it may not be your tank setup. Could be from something else in the house and u are just noticing it there. The water main bond may be loose or possibly having a loose neutral in the panel

 

[aslmx]

Get a ground probe. $15 it takes the stray voltage away.

 

[bct15]

For those of you that were following along or trying to help I solved the problem, figure I'll post the solution for anybody else having a similar problem.

I haven't been running my t5s since I posted the problem, and was contemplating uninstalling them when I decided to take another look at it this morning.

The symptoms were screaming ground problem, but I had a tough time figuring out exactly what was not grounded properly. The ballast was grounded properly, the outlets were installed properly and each is grounded. The high voltage in the refelctors (over 120) wasn't registering to me at first, but thinking about it this morning a lightbulb went. It turns out the voltage was getting into the tank by conducting through the glass from the reflectors. The glass was working as a semiconductor, that is why 70 volts in tank and 120 volts + at reflectors. Apparently, I was not aware of this, each reflector needs to be grounded along with the ballast. I attached a groundwire to a screw that holds the clip on each reflector then attached this to a screw that holds the ballast in place, this was the closest ground point I could find. Problem solved, there is now 1.23 volts in the reflector and no noticable difference in voltage in the tank. I still have 15 volts in there from a couple other things I need to get sorted out, but that is a lot better than 70.

Thanks to everybody who helped me get this figured out.