Tank crashing for no reason, need help!

[MadTownFess]

My tank has been setup for 16 months. Prior to yesterday, my tank was in its best place it has ever been, which is why this is so troubling. My 45 gallon tank has had rock solid parameters: 8.0 alk/420 cal/1350 mag/5 ppm nitrate/.05 ppm phosphate for a half a year. Tank has been stable for as long as I can remember. Then yesterday, a lot of corals seem very ticked off. All my ACANs were closed or less inflated than they usually are, Hammer coral closed up, and my meteor shower cyphastrea went from a deep blue base, to a very pale base color. This morning one of my acros has STN starting on the base. All my other acro's so far seem normal. Rock flowers normal, cespitularia normal. Fish are all acting normal.

I tested for Ammonia, which was at 0. Also retested salinity, which is 1.026. (retested all water parameters, everything is what I would expect) I added ROX carbon in case any toxins in the water. I also added Poly Filter Pad in case any metals are in the water. After 12 hours the PolyFIlterPad is still white, so I dont think its metals.

I have had no recent changes to the tank, I do a weekly 5 gallon water change on Saturday (this started on Monday).

I am completely clueless and starting to freak out. Any ideas?

 

[W1ngz]

Temperature wobble?
More people home than usual depressing your pH a lot?
Stray current? Is there a ground probe/GFI outlet?

 

[Just_Pete]

Are you happy everyday? Same with your corals. Some days they’ll just be ticked off and others they’ll be ok. It’s only been a day or two. I’d wait a few more days before jumping into thinking your tank is crashing.

also check your temp

 

[Rubblereefer]

stray voltage? Check any magnets also to make sure they aren’t leaching.

 

[NS Mike D]

+1 on the above posts.

Good that you added ROX in case (and that is usually my first suspect) it was coral warfare. If indeed that is the culprit, it may take time for the corals to get comfortable to reopen.

rule out temp, pH and stray current and give time for the comeback.

 

[MadTownFess]

Temperature wobble?
More people home than usual depressing your pH a lot?
Stray current? Is there a ground probe/GFI outlet?

Temperate has been consistent 77 degrees.

I have put my fingers in the water and not felt any "shock". I do have a DMM, is there a way to test it? Its just plugged into your standard 120V outlet

 

[xxkenny90xx]

Are you happy everyday? Same with your corals. Some days they’ll just be ticked off and others they’ll be ok. It’s only been a day or two. I’d wait a few more days before jumping into thinking your tank is crashing.

also check your temp

While there is some some truth to this I would start investigating when that many corals are unhappy. Check all the equipment for rust or stray voltage. Carbon and water changes!

 

[Dragon52]

Post pics if you have them, it will HELP everyone trying to figure it out.

 

[MadTownFess]

+1 on the above posts.

Good that you added ROX in case (and that is usually my first suspect) it was coral warfare. If indeed that is the culprit, it may take time for the corals to get comfortable to reopen.

rule out temp, pH and stray current and give time for the comeback.

I just tested pH, its 8.3, which is what it always is. Any suggestions on how to test for stray voltage?

 

[W1ngz]

I do have a DMM, is there a way to test it?

Digital isn't the most accurate thing for this I've read, as they'll measure induced voltage that is normally held by the water, but won't ground it out the same way an analog would.

You'll need to get the ground from the meter into the ground pin of an outlet, probably by using a 3 prong extension, and the + wire in the water. You will see a voltage, which is normal. Anything too high or close to line voltage is bad.

Set the range for wherever 120vAC would be on the meter, some of them are 240, some will read 500 but that depends on the meter.

 

[MadTownFess]

Post pics if you have them, it will everyone trying to figure it out.

Just took this, lights have only been on for 45 minutes.

 

[ScottB]

You are doing the right things with the Poly & carbon

A couple suggestions:
- Ship out an ICP test.
- Check magnets, heaters, pumps. Any motors that are wet.
- Any new household products in use? Aerosols?
- Any new skin cleansers?
- Different or new bucket of salt?
- Total long shot, but test water with a $15 voltmeter
- Review your actions, tools used, process on that Saturday WC.

 

[NS Mike D]

I just tested pH, its 8.3, which is what it always is. Any suggestions on how to test for stray voltage?

when I had a pump wire exposed, I was getting a little shock when I would touch the metal tank rim and something else. My nem was crashing (which lead to a series of events that ended in the tank crash).

I inspected every device and found that a pump cord had touched a heater and melted a tiny hole in the insulation exposing the wires.

A GFi/GFCI will trip with any imbalance due to stray current.

 

[brandon429]

imagine how many suspected param or water condition contams could be neutralized with a full water change. Vs waiting for results, you can make that tank read what a new bag of salt would read

-but large water changes during stress are harmful

do I have a track record of harming people’s fish tanks? lol
we have innumerable examples of nano full water changes handy, going back to early 2000s. A full water change is ideal, not bad, but stirring up detritus while tank is under stress is bad.


when people move homes or set up at Reefstock, they ‘disrupt’ tanks, but we are told not to do it to save distressed tanks....no, thats wrong logic.

If you choose to do a big wc to avoid waiting and hesitation, you should consider how best to deal with the dsb underneath. I would sample ideas, use what big threads show. If you’d rather forego the direct intervention then the water and sand can remain.

Fixing that tank would be easy, I would clean it top to bottom using known safe means, change the water out, then id reduce overall light level and re ramp and I’d be spot feeding with rods feed 2x weekly with water changes sustained for six weeks and it would fix the whole system.

no form of dosing or extra filtration in place such as poly filters, the extra rox surface area, remove po4 and nitrate targeting media and let the display run for two months.


The number one things the masses hate, and make fun of recommending, is direct decisive intervention without hesitation...they loathe that method. I keep using it for fifteen years for very specific reasons- the 8 month follow up pics we log that nobody else will post when requested.


when a system is accessible, making use of that access can be done preemptively, during an outbreak, or during a home move, to set the tank up at Macna, or to demonstrate the method for others using our own reefs. Access isn’t harmful or reef conventions would kill tanks, hesitating by training is harm. If the tank was 180 gallons the options would be less clear.

 

[MadTownFess]

Digital isn't the most accurate thing for this I've read, as they'll measure induced voltage that is normally held by the water, but won't ground it out the same way an analog would.

You'll need to get the ground from the meter into the ground pin of an outlet, probably by using a 3 prong extension, and the + wire in the water. You will see a voltage, which is normal. Anything too high or close to line voltage is bad.

Set the range for wherever 120vAC would be on the meter, some of them are 240, some will read 500 but that depends on the meter.

The voltage read 4.6V...I would imagine this is acceptable/nominal?

 

[brandon429]

Test it against fresh made saltwater in diff container

 

[NS Mike D]

lol. right on queue. As I was typing my replies, I was pondering if this was a good time to send up the @brandon429 signal. having done it a lot this week, so I hesitated.


@MadTownFess follow along with Brandon and his rip clean process. I wish I had known about his method a year ago instead of the band aids that only led to worse things.

here is my tank a year ago (or two, I have to look up as it's all a blur to me now)

and here is my 29 gal tank today. Little by little the cyano and then the deadly dinos wiped out most of the corals, a number of snails etc. to the point where I had to pull the rock and sand and start over. If I had only done a full water change and rinsed that darn sandbed ........

The stray current was not the problem. That was fixable and recoverable, IMO. It was the band aid approach without dealing with the detritus in the rocks and sand (note: I overly simplified the events to make a main point and have two threads documenting the details).

 

[brandon429]

it sounds like i advocate total reef anarchy.

ive learned to invoke the legit ways reefers totally accept takedown cleaning lol such as conventions, home moves, upgrades, downgrades that always work fine using ________________ as a recurring theme in making them work fine

its fun to point out the #1 thing people dont think of, change out the suspect water, is ok across all reefs. Here's jon at 120 gallons
a 45 is nothing.

Jons tank wasnt harmed, he did it to prevent harm, twice in one month. Its the most thorough rip cleaning Ive ever seen in such an amnt of time. check his results, his icp measures

120 gallon rip clean

I’ve decided to perform a rip clean on my 120 with 100% new water. The tank has been running for 5 years and was battling Dino for several months. I used the bacteria method from elegant corals and worked great I haven’t seen Dino in months now. But I tried several other methods including...

www.reef2reef.com

we could also rehab it with the bet totally in place, that's just a 5th best solution compared to #1 solution. the waste in a sandbed is not beneficial, and limits the lifespan potential of the ecosystem. To clean a sandbed is to impart extra life points awarded to the system. <---also doubted by many but a recurring theme in 30 page work threads fixing reefs.

the best part to uncover is our training as reefers; we suspect possible water issues but we'll leave all that water. --> perceived consequence is harm, if we dont. Jons thread undoes that rule.

A rip clean can be ran on a perfectly running reef at any time, any number of times. Its a simulated storm, reefs are adapted to storms. A side benefit of rip cleaning is removing all the water plus the waste which is a solid form of skimmate; even if no param is causing irritation, a tank is better off post-storm due to reduced organic loading

 

[ScottB]

The voltage read 4.6V...I would imagine this is acceptable/nominal?

Correct. Nominal.

 

[Reeftroubles]

My tank has been setup for 16 months. Prior to yesterday, my tank was in its best place it has ever been, which is why this is so troubling. My 45 gallon tank has had rock solid parameters: 8.0 alk/420 cal/1350 mag/5 ppm nitrate/.05 ppm phosphate for a half a year. Tank has been stable for as long as I can remember. Then yesterday, a lot of corals seem very ****** off. All my ACANs were closed or less inflated than they usually are, Hammer coral closed up, and my meteor shower cyphastrea went from a deep blue base, to a very pale base color. This morning one of my acros has STN starting on the base. All my other acro's so far seem normal. Rock flowers normal, cespitularia normal. Fish are all acting normal.

I tested for Ammonia, which was at 0. Also retested salinity, which is 1.026. (retested all water parameters, everything is what I would expect) I added ROX carbon in case any toxins in the water. I also added Poly Filter Pad in case any metals are in the water. After 12 hours the PolyFIlterPad is still white, so I dont think its metals.

I have had no recent changes to the tank, I do a weekly 5 gallon water change on Saturday (this started on Monday).

I am completely clueless and starting to freak out. Any ideas?

Oh I've done this and freaked out, lost a lot and tested for everything except one thing I didnt consider. My testing equip was old and giving me bad readings, particularly my bleeping hydrometer. My salt levels were sky high and my corals looked like they were melting.