Tank just won't stabilize

[gbru316]

That’s just the first hit. Read on and you’ll find many more. Like this one

The “Old Tank” Syndrome

Now that a tank no longer needs to be broken down and tanks are being maintained for long periods of time a new

reefs.com

If you read your second source, you’d find absolutely nothing but anecdotal evidence about “bad sand.”


You still haven’t provided scientific literature backing up your assertion that sand “goes bad.”

what you HAVE provided — and what I absolutely agree with — is that a sand bed can become a nutrient source, both from detritus and from binding of organics to the media itself. Which — to be clear — still doesn’t rise to the level of “bad sand,” because detritus can be removed and bound organics unbound. The sand is still perfectly fine once those things happen.


I’ve been doing this for over 20 years. I’ve had deep sand beds, bare bottoms, shallow sand beds — the works. When discussing sand beds, you either run a deep sand bed and never touch the anaerobic parts or you run a shallow sand bed (1” or so max”) and keep it clean. Shallow enough for adequate flow to keep anaerobic pockets at-bay.

To-date, any literature I’ve read concerning “bad sand” has used that term synonymously with “bad sand bed.” Though as I’ve repeatedly said — if you can provide scientific literature that details how rock particles can “go bad,” I’m all ears.

 

[gbru316]

The logic here is that the sand absorbs the nutrients from the crappy water, and then releases it when the nutrient level surrounding the sand, is less than the nutrient levels in the sand, and since the sand is always surrounded by the crappiest water in the tank, it absorbs nutrients to a level equal to that crappy water. Think you understand now?

no. That’s not “bad sand,” it’s “bound organics”

By running things like GFO, we can strip the organics.

the sand hasn’t changed in composition one bit, even with bound organics.

 

[bruno3047]

If you read your second source, you’d find absolutely nothing but anecdotal evidence about “bad sand.”


You still haven’t provided scientific literature backing up your assertion that sand “goes bad.”

what you HAVE provided — and what I absolutely agree with — is that a sand bed can become a nutrient source, both from detritus and from binding of organics to the media itself. Which — to be clear — still doesn’t rise to the level of “bad sand,” because detritus can be removed and bound organics unbound. The sand is still perfectly fine once those things happen.


I’ve been doing this for over 20 years. I’ve had deep sand beds, bare bottoms, shallow sand beds — the works. When discussing sand beds, you either run a deep sand bed and never touch the anaerobic parts or you run a shallow sand bed (1” or so max”) and keep it clean. Shallow enough for adequate flow to keep anaerobic pockets at-bay.

To-date, any literature I’ve read concerning “bad sand” has used that term synonymously with “bad sand bed.” Though as I’ve repeatedly said — if you can provide scientific literature that details how rock particles can “go bad,” I’m all ear

Sure pal. Whatever you say. Why don’t you post two pictures of your tank taken right now from different distances.

 

[gbru316]

Sure pal. Whatever you say. Why don’t you post two pictures of your tank taken right now from different distances.

I’m not trying to shut you up. I’m merely relaying decades of experience and knowledge. I’ve no desire to “win” or “lose” anything, or to further engage with someone who’s more interested in arguing and attacks (implying I’m too stupid to understand what you’re trying to say) than discussing.

have a good one.

 

[bruno3047]

Yep. That’s what I thought. There’s an old saying. Before you take anyone’s advice on this board, look at their tank and ask yourself if you want your tank to look like theirs. Have a nice day.

 

[redfishbluefish]

Just a reminder.....debate is just fine, but let's do it without insults. I had to edit a number of posts.

Thanks, Team R2R

 

[Shooter6]

Who has the job of changing all that expired sand in the ocean....

 

[bruno3047]

Who has the job of changing all that expired sand in the

Are you trying to say that your tank has the cleansing properties of the ocean? Interesting. I would love to see a couple of pictures of your tank, taken from different distances, of course.

 

[Shooter6]

Yep. That’s what I thought. There’s an old saying. Before you take anyone’s advice on this board, look at their tank and ask yourself if you want your tank to look like theirs. Have a nice day.

2 of mine, yours doesn't look like anything to be challenging others with.

 

[bruno3047]

2 of mine, yours doesn't look like anything to be challenging others with.

Yea. Right. I mean two pictures like mine. From the same vantage point but different distances.

 

[Shooter6]

Are you trying to say that your tank has the cleansing properties of the ocean? Interesting. I would love to see a couple of pictures of your tank, taken from different distances, of course.

Posted pics already so please tell my your reefing experience? Mine started in 1988. And still learning....

 

[bruno3047]

Posted pics already so please tell my your reefing experience? Mine started in 1988. And still learning....

Two pictures from the same vantage point but different distances, like mine. I’ll be here.

 

[Shooter6]

If you read your second source, you’d find absolutely nothing but anecdotal evidence about “bad sand.”


You still haven’t provided scientific literature backing up your assertion that sand “goes bad.”

what you HAVE provided — and what I absolutely agree with — is that a sand bed can become a nutrient source, both from detritus and from binding of organics to the media itself. Which — to be clear — still doesn’t rise to the level of “bad sand,” because detritus can be removed and bound organics unbound. The sand is still perfectly fine once those things happen.


I’ve been doing this for over 20 years. I’ve had deep sand beds, bare bottoms, shallow sand beds — the works. When discussing sand beds, you either run a deep sand bed and never touch the anaerobic parts or you run a shallow sand bed (1” or so max”) and keep it clean. Shallow enough for adequate flow to keep anaerobic pockets at-bay.

To-date, any literature I’ve read concerning “bad sand” has used that term synonymously with “bad sand bed.” Though as I’ve repeatedly said — if you can provide scientific literature that details how rock particles can “go bad,” I’m all ears.

Exactly, but he doesn't grasp the concepts of different styles of sandbeds. Never learned about the subject he's trying to be a teacher in.

 

[Shooter6]

Two pictures from the same vantage point but different distances, like mine. I’ll be here.

Already posted different angles

 

[bruno3047]

Posted pics already so please tell my your reefing experience? Mine started in 1988. And still

Exactly, but he doesn't grasp the concepts of different styles of sandbeds. Never learned about the subject he's trying to be a teacher in.

40+ years keeping saltwater tanks dude. I’m waiting for your pictures.

 

[redfishbluefish]

Last warning guys. I'm now deleting posts. If you can't say something without insulting each other I'm going to lock up this thread. Play nice!

 

[bruno3047]

Last warning guys. I'm now deleting posts. If you can't say something without insulting each other I'm going to lock up this thread. Play nice!

.

 

[bruno3047]

The logic here is that the sand absorbs the nutrients from the crappy water, and then releases it when the nutrient level surrounding the sand, is less than the nutrient levels in the sand, and since the sand is always surrounded by the crappiest water in the tank, it absorbs nutrients to a level equal to that crappy water. Think you understand now?

You might be able to “recharge” the sand by putting it into RO water and giving it enough time to leach out all it’s absorbed nutrients. But that would involve removing it from the display tank and replacing it with new sand which confirms my point. By the way. The reason I specified two photos taken from the same vantage point but at different distances, is because you won’t find those all over the Internet, the way you could find the photos you posted.

 

[bruno3047]

You might be able to “recharge” the sand by putting it into RO water and giving it enough time to leach out all it’s absorbed nutrients. But that would involve removing it from the display tank and replacing it with new sand which confirms my point. By the way. The reason I specified two photos taken from the same vantage point but at different distances, is because you won’t find those all over the Internet, the way you could find the photos you posted.

Of course, even in this endeavor, you would have to change the water a number of times because once the water reaches the same level of nutrients as is in the sand, the transfer of nutrients from the sand to the water ceases. So you might as well just get new sand. It’s not that expensive.

 

[Shooter6]

Of course, even in this endeavor, you would have to change the water a number of times because once the water reaches the same level of nutrients as is in the sand, the transfer of nutrients from the sand to the water ceases. So you might as well just get new sand. It’s not that expensive.

Vacuum the sandbed removes the surrounding detritus but leaves the beneficial bacteria that grows on and in the sand behind. Replacing the sand will cause a drop in beneficial bacteria which can cause a cycling event.