Tank question about po4

[Andreaitaly]

do not carbon dose!!

Ok ok sorry

 

[92Miata]

the secret sauce of live rock absolutely is the bacteria and microfauna. They are consumers that fill a void, outcompeting algae

The bacteria that are relevant to this have population doubling times measured in hours. They're really not the problem. I'm not arguing that microflora/microfauna are unimportant.


Seriously - try what I've done - take some dry rock, and put it in a tank with some actual good live rock. Wait 6 months.


By that point the dry rock has spots of corraline, it has feather dusters, it has all of the bacteria specie that the live rock does. It is almost equal in *biodiversity* (in that it has all the same specie).

What it lacks - is biomass of desirable consumers. And because of this - it will continue to grow hair algae - while the rock next to it looks great. It will grow algae irrespective of how much phosphate and nitrate are in the water column. This is why adding little scraps of live rock, or adding bottle bacteria, or all those little things doesn't fix the issue. If it was a biodiversity issue - adding a scrap of rock that introduced the missing species would fix the issue - and Dr. Tims would sell it, and we wouldn't be dealing with dry rock tanks being a mess.

Its about mass of consumers. Its the same issue that fresh water planted tanks have - where keeping a lightly planted tank is hard - and prone to algae - but fill it up with stem plants? No problems.


Here's a secret - corals and coralline prefer ammonia to nitrate - its much easier for them to consume. In an ideal reef tank environment - all the ammonia that is introduced into a tank is consumed by corals - and never makes its way into the bacterial nitrogen cycle. Significant residual/measurable nitrates are a sign that there's not enough coral/coraline to process all the ammonia coming into your tank - which means they're going through the nitrogen cycle, and ending up in your water column as nitrate. Algae is way better at consuming nitrate than corals are.

Dry rock starts with nothing on it that consumes ammonia. Live rock starts with tons of live mass on it that almost all consumes ammonia.

 

[boxed_reef]

The bacteria that are relevant to this have population doubling times measured in hours. They're really not the problem. I'm not arguing that microflora/microfauna are unimportant.


Seriously - try what I've done - take some dry rock, and put it in a tank with some actual good live rock. Wait 6 months.


By that point the dry rock has spots of corraline, it has feather dusters, it has all of the bacteria specie that the live rock does. It is almost equal in *biodiversity* (in that it has all the same specie).

What it lacks - is biomass of desirable consumers. And because of this - it will continue to grow hair algae - while the rock next to it looks great. It will grow algae irrespective of how much phosphate and nitrate are in the water column. This is why adding little scraps of live rock, or adding bottle bacteria, or all those little things doesn't fix the issue. If it was a biodiversity issue - adding a scrap of rock that introduced the missing species would fix the issue - and Dr. Tims would sell it, and we wouldn't be dealing with dry rock tanks being a mess.

Its about mass of consumers. Its the same issue that fresh water planted tanks have - where keeping a lightly planted tank is hard - and prone to algae - but fill it up with stem plants? No problems.


Here's a secret - corals and coralline prefer ammonia to nitrate - its much easier for them to consume. In an ideal reef tank environment - all the ammonia that is introduced into a tank is consumed by corals - and never makes its way into the bacterial nitrogen cycle. Significant residual/measurable nitrates are a sign that there's not enough coral/coraline to process all the ammonia coming into your tank - which means they're going through the nitrogen cycle, and ending up in your water column as nitrate. Algae is way better at consuming nitrate than corals are.

Dry rock starts with nothing on it that consumes ammonia. Live rock starts with tons of live mass on it that almost all consumes ammonia.

I don’t want to go back and forth about semantics, I agree with much of what you’re saying. Rock will absorb or release po4 until it reaches equilibrium, in OP case it is absorbing. Let’s get this thread back on track to help the OP.

 

[92Miata]

I don’t want to go back and forth about semantics, I agree with much of what you’re saying. Rock will absorb or release po4 until it reaches equilibrium, in OP case it is absorbing. Let’s get this thread back on track to help the OP.

This isn't about semantics - it's a vital distinction - and relevant to OPs tank.

Dosing bacteria like some people are suggesting isn't going to fix this. Adding rubble is not going to fix this. They won't fix it because they don't address the real issue.

Water quality fixes (like water changes and nopox) won't fix the issue because water quality isn't the problem.


There's no quick easy fix with dry rock. The fix is lots more consumers, and that takes time. When you buy dry rock you trade a little cash savings and that mythical 'no pests' for a whole lot of time and elbow grease.

And that's what he needs to do here - keep beating the hair algae back - keep maintaining alkalinity - and give corals and coraline every advantage you can.

And you have to be active about it - you can't just wait it out - because the hair algae will win.

 

[Andreaitaly]

This isn't about semantics - it's a vital distinction - and relevant to OPs tank.

Dosing bacteria like some people are suggesting isn't going to fix this. Adding rubble is not going to fix this. They won't fix it because they don't address the real issue.

Water quality fixes (like water changes and nopox) won't fix the issue because water quality isn't the problem.


There's no quick easy fix with dry rock. The fix is lots more consumers, and that takes time. When you buy dry rock you trade a little cash savings and that mythical 'no pests' for a whole lot of time and elbow grease.

And that's what he needs to do here - keep beating the hair algae back - keep maintaining alkalinity - and give corals and coraline every advantage you can.

And you have to be active about it - you can't just wait it out - because the hair algae will win.

So in that Moment u want to Say ....Better not di nothing and wait ...correct ??? No amino no bacteria no carbon no gfo ....nothing

 

[Charlie’s Frags]

So in that Moment u want to Say ....Better not di nothing and wait ...correct ??? No amino no bacteria no carbon no gfo ....nothing

Are you using carbon and gfo now?

 

[Andreaitaly]

No only black carbon

 

[Andreaitaly]

Black coal

 

[S.Pepper]