The Miracle Tank

siggy · Feb 10, 2020

Its a bummer, just going to ride it out and see.

Katrina71 · Feb 10, 2020

siggy said:
Its a bummer, just going to ride it out and see.

I'd like to see you or Rich use UV. I'd like to see it in action. No QT and no isolation tank concerns me.

siggy · Feb 10, 2020

Katrina71 said:
Yes! Thanks to @siggy! It was a hard pill not to do it myself, but now I have zero concern!

Funny you say that, I am going to build a stand very soon

I have to set up a QT if I want anything other than Gold fish.
2x4's or a cheap kitchen cabinet for the basement.
UV this week

Brew12 · Feb 10, 2020

Katrina71 said:
I'd like to see you or Rich use UV. I'd like to see it in action. No QT and no isolation tank concerns me.

My losses dropped dramatically when I stopped prophylactic treatment. I've added fish with both velvet and ich at this point and my tank is thriving. No UV.

siggy · Feb 10, 2020

Brew12 said:
My losses dropped dramatically when I stopped prophylactic treatment. I've added fish with both velvet and ich at this point and my tank is thriving. No UV.

To what do you credit your success ? Nutrition?

Brew12 · Feb 10, 2020

siggy said:
To what do you credit your success ? Nutrition?

Nutrition, proper stocking, and stability along with a very diverse fauna. I think it all goes together.

Brew12 · Feb 10, 2020

Oh, and I think having a significant amount of coral helps. Most common external parasites fall into the size range that corals consume as food. With high flow and plenty of corals, I feel most parasites in my tank are eaten.

Katrina71 · Feb 10, 2020

Does anyone else hear justification for the addiction in that???

Lowell Lemon · Feb 10, 2020

@Brew12
Welcome to the dark side on fish care lol! I know there are a few in the disease columns who would like to quarantine you from Paul B and win you back to sanity lol.

My experience with prophylaxis is the same as yours. Much better survival rates when I just concentrate on stability, biodiversity, and good nutrition. But hey, most people think I off my nut anyway!

I still love U.V. and ozone for holding systems along with wet/dry filtration. You have so many fish coming and going that it works for the vast majority of cases. The ability to rapidly expand the biological filter capacity of a wet/dry filter makes it a winner for that application.

Your tank still looks great by the way even after Vibrant. I have had much success with Vibrant as well.

Brew12 · Feb 10, 2020

Lowell Lemon said:
@Brew12
Welcome to the dark side on fish care lol! I know there are a few in the disease columns who would like to quarantine you from Paul B and win you back to sanity lol.

My experience with prophylaxis is the same as yours. Much better survival rates when I just concentrate on stability, biodiversity, and good nutrition. But hey, most people think I off my nut anyway!

I still love U.V. and ozone for holding systems along with wet/dry filtration. You have so many fish coming and going that it works for the vast majority of cases. The ability to rapidly expand the biological filter capacity of a wet/dry filter makes it a winner for that application.

Your tank still looks great by the way even after Vibrant. I have had much success with Vibrant as well.

Yup, some people aren't happy I switched over. The dirty truth is that most people who do prophylactic treatment have over 50% losses. It just isn't talked about. However, if you want 8 different types of Tangs in your tank, you probably need to go that route because of the stress from aggression.

I think UV and/or ozone are needed for holding systems. They don't have the same advantages a mature reef tank has to help fish deal with parasites.

And thanks, I'm very proud of my system.

najer · Feb 10, 2020

I know we don't have the same disease problems this side of the pond, it upsets me when I see people with issues.
This is under observation, I know it is actually a convict in only 13.5 G!
Check it's tummy after about 6 weeks in here, one inch fish btw, it has grazed to it's hearts content on various algaes, as it is supposed to do, I only put it in here to fatten it up, it is going in the big tank this coming weekend!
I have never qtd a fish or had a disease and yes I have a very good lfs.
Treating, copper (?) is like given someone chemo "just in case", I know that is harsh but you see what I mean?
I have used fresh water dips for flukes but that is about it.
To further reduce stress fish swim out of the bags, that is how much I trust my lfs!

Katrina71 · Feb 10, 2020

I don't feel right about anything other than bringing our fish home and introducing them to their new home. I can't imagine after the stress they have been through already, a medicated environment could be good. I realize my thinking my be foolish, but it's what feels right in my heart.

Brew12 · Feb 10, 2020

Katrina71 said:
I don't feel right about anything other than bringing our fish home and introducing them to their new home. I can't imagine after the stress they have been through already, a medicated environment could be good. I realize my thinking my be foolish, but it's what feels right in my heart.

It's also supported by science!

KJoFan · Feb 10, 2020

Brew12 said:
Nutrition, proper stocking, and stability along with a very diverse fauna. I think it all goes together.

I could ask this in your build thread to keep things clean, but curious how you determine that you have a "very diverse fauna"? How do you qualify that statement? Are you basing it off of additives you're putting in your system or just assumption based on age? Not condemning the statement, just wondering how you determine that as fact?

LovesDogs_CatsRokay · Feb 10, 2020

Katrina71 said:
I don't feel right about anything other than bringing our fish home and introducing them to their new home. I can't imagine after the stress they have been through already, a medicated environment could be good. I realize my thinking my be foolish, but it's what feels right in my heart.

I agree, I stopped QT'ing and I feel much better about it. It took a long time for me to make the switch, went back and forth on it for a while, but I'm glad I finally did and so are my fish! Congrats on your new tank, this thread has been a very entertaining read!

Katrina71 · Feb 10, 2020

I was told early on to do it the way we do. I am grateful for the wisdom from all of your experience.

Brew12 · Feb 10, 2020

KJoFan said:
I could ask this in your build thread to keep things clean, but curious how you determine that you have a "very diverse fauna"? How do you qualify that statement? Are you basing it off of additives you're putting in your system or just assumption based on age? Not condemning the statement, just wondering how you determine that as fact?

I've added live rock from a few older, very established tanks in my area. Two of those tanks were stocked with rock from Tampa Bay Saltwater. I also added live mud from Fiji back when it was still available. I was shocked that mud still had live algae and critters in it. It's as diverse as I feel I can make it.

Katrina71 · Feb 10, 2020

We were very blessed from the beginning to get live rock from an older tank when we started. Live rock from our first "upgrade" too. I know how blessed we have been.

najer · Feb 10, 2020

KJoFan said:
I could ask this in your build thread to keep things clean, but curious how you determine that you have a "very diverse fauna"? How do you qualify that statement? Are you basing it off of additives you're putting in your system or just assumption based on age? Not condemning the statement, just wondering how you determine that as fact?

Brew will answer his own question, my "top tank" is split 3/5 2/5 at a metre, the right side is a display refugium, life, what things need, not trying to out think things, trying to supply their needs?!

Katrina71 · Feb 10, 2020

I want to try miracle mud in our fuge too. Just cuz. I've heard different opinions, but I'm going to try it. I would just like to learn the best way. A tray?