To treat with copper or not?

[sneakerhead]

Started a new tank a few weeks ago and added 2 clownfish from the LFS without quarantining them.

I purchased 3-4 fish from a local seller, and he is holding them for me; he has been quarantining them for 6-8 weeks.

He recommended I do a copper treatment on the clownfish in my display(just FOWLR for now) just to be safe.

Especially since the new fish are quarantined and if I added them and the clownfish transferred something to them, it would be very devastating.

What do you guys think? How should I proceed?

 

[MnFish1]

1. If you have rocks/sand, etc - that you're going to use - in the future with inverts - copper can/will leach out. Whether significant or not - I'll leave that to others.
2. The NEW fish should be quarantined in a separate tank. according to the protocols above,

 

[Alexoss]

I wouln t put copper in my display tank, use a separate one

 

[Miami Reef]

How big is the tank?

There’s no easy answer with quarantine because for every 99 persons there are 100 opinions.

I drank the quarantine cool-aid. I tore my tank down multiple times for ich, tried copper…ich eventually came back every single time.

In all honestly, I think lost more fish by trying to quarantine + going fallow than I would have if I just left them in the tank with the ich.

So my opinion is to take it as it comes. Try to keep your fish in your tank. If you see progression of a disease, there is a new hydrogen peroxide in tank dosing regimen that is reef safe. There are a lot of new tools for management nowadays.

 

[sneakerhead]

How big is the tank?

There’s no easy answer with quarantine because for every 99 persons there are 100 opinions.

I drank the quarantine cool-aid. I tore my tank down multiple times for ich, tried copper…ich eventually came back every single time.

In all honestly, I think lost more fish by trying to quarantine + going fallow than I would have if I just left them in the tank with the ich.

So my opinion is to take it as it comes. Try to keep your fish in your tank. If you see progression of a disease, there is a new hydrogen peroxide in tank dosing regimen that is reef safe. There are a lot of new tools for management nowadays.

90 gallons

Thanks for your honest opinion. Ill evaluate my options and do further research.

1. If you have rocks/sand, etc - that you're going to use - in the future with inverts - copper can/will leach out. Whether significant or not - I'll leave that to others.
2. The NEW fish should be quarantined in a separate tank. according to the protocols above,

1. I did not know that; that's good to know.

I wouln t put copper in my display tank, use a separate one

will look into that.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Started a new tank a few weeks ago and added 2 clownfish from the LFS without quarantining them.

I purchased 3-4 fish from a local seller, and he is holding them for me; he has been quarantining them for 6-8 weeks.

He recommended I do a copper treatment on the clownfish in my display(just FOWLR for now) just to be safe.

Especially since the new fish are quarantined and if I added them and the clownfish transferred something to them, it would be very devastating.

What do you guys think? How should I proceed?

He is quarantining them almost 8 weeks and recommending further quarantine?
Sounds fishy but I would perform that in a separate tank and will have to be for a full 30 days at therapeutic level 2.25-2.5 and again a full 30 days
You will want to monitor the copper levels with a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna brand and also monitor the ammonia levels also with a reliable ammonia test kit
Increase oxygen during treatment adding an air stone

 

[Ben.QLD2]

How long have the clowns been in the tank for? Are they symptomatic of anything?

IIf they look fine and healthy with no blemishes or breathing trouble then I'd just wait about 4 to 6 weeks before adding anything else. That will give plenty of time for any disease to show itself.

IIf they are already showing white spots or putting a lot of effort into breathing then you should treat appropriately.

The go to treatment for protozoa like Marine whitespot and velvet, in a non-invert setting, is copper.

With copper, you want to treat fast and treat correctly. Don't wait a few days before treating, 'just to see if they get better', and don't add the wrong amount. Too much is harmful and too little is useless. You need to monitor the levels during treatment. If you're using a commercial treatment then just follow their directions.

If you don't have a quarantine tank, maybe use a large bucket/bin/container to put your live rock and sand into (with a couple of air stones/circulation pump) while you treat the main tank?

After the treatment period you'll need to water change and use carbon to remove all copper before returning the rock and sand to the tank.

I'd give thought to getting your own quarantine tank though, and I wouldn't trust an LFS to quarantine for me. Unless you can personally confirm that at least 6 weeks of fully compliant quarantine has happened, then it hasn't happened.

Cheers,

Ben.

 

[sneakerhead]

He is quarantining them almost 8 weeks and recommending further quarantine?
Sounds fishy but I would perform that in a separate tank and will have to be for a full 30 days at therapeutic level 2.25-2.5 and again a full 30 days
You will want to monitor the copper levels with a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna brand and also monitor the ammonia levels also with a reliable ammonia test kit
Increase oxygen during treatment adding an air stone

There might be some misunderstanding here from my side.

He was recommending I put my current livestock, that is the 2 clownfish. That way I don't put his work to waste, which is him quarantining his fish for almost 2months.

Hope that makes more sense.

 

[vetteguy53081]

There might be some misunderstanding here from my side.

He was recommending I put my current livestock, that is the 2 clownfish. That way I don't put his work to waste, which is him quarantining his fish for almost 2months.

Hope that makes more sense.

Yes- In this case I would in a separate tank as described quarantine the 2 existing clowns and add the new arrivals to display assuming they are carrying nothing

 

[sneakerhead]

How long have the clowns been in the tank for? Are they symptomatic of anything?

IIf they look fine and healthy with no blemishes or breathing trouble then I'd just wait about 4 to 6 weeks before adding anything else. That will give plenty of time for any disease to show itself.

IIf they are already showing white spots or putting a lot of effort into breathing then you should treat appropriately.

The go to treatment for protozoa like Marine whitespot and velvet, in a non-invert setting, is copper.

With copper, you want to treat fast and treat correctly. Don't wait a few days before treating, 'just to see if they get better', and don't add the wrong amount. Too much is harmful and too little is useless. You need to monitor the levels during treatment. If you're using a commercial treatment then just follow their directions.

If you don't have a quarantine tank, maybe use a large bucket/bin/container to put your live rock and sand into (with a couple of air stones/circulation pump) while you treat the main tank?

After the treatment period you'll need to water change and use carbon to remove all copper before returning the rock and sand to the tank.

I'd give thought to getting your own quarantine tank though, and I wouldn't trust an LFS to quarantine for me. Unless you can personally confirm that at least 6 weeks of fully compliant quarantine has happened, then it hasn't happened.

Cheers,

Ben.

Thanks for the extensive write-up, Ben.

Currently, there are no signs the clownfish are showing that is worrisome or indicate anything more serious.

I will wait 4-6 weeks, and see how things go before I take possession.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Started a new tank a few weeks ago and added 2 clownfish from the LFS without quarantining them.

I purchased 3-4 fish from a local seller, and he is holding them for me; he has been quarantining them for 6-8 weeks.

He recommended I do a copper treatment on the clownfish in my display(just FOWLR for now) just to be safe.

Especially since the new fish are quarantined and if I added them and the clownfish transferred something to them, it would be very devastating.

What do you guys think? How should I proceed?

Copper in your DT can prove problematic later on. I understand your dealers point though - the lowest common denominator are your un quarantined clowns. He doesn’t want to sell you fish and have those clowns get them sick.
You could use hyposalinity in your DT as opposed to copper, that will help for ich and flukes but not velvet.
My current quarantine protocol is here:

Current Quarantine Protocol

2024 Quarantine Procedures Jay Hemdal David Scarborough Protozoans (Cryptocaryon/ich, Amyloodinium/velvet) and Metazoan trematodes/flukes are by far the most common parasites found on newly acquired fish. A carefully managed, proactive quarantine process can effectively eliminate these...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

 

[moz71]

Although I am one to quarantine all fish. In your case I would just proceed. If the clowns you got were captive bred that gives you more assurance they are ok. And if you had awhile with no symptoms more the better. No guarantee but quarantining is also no guarantee if you don’t do perfectly. Also. If you go that far you would need to fallow your tank for 70 or whatever days too to make sure. At this point I would just dump in. But that’s me.