Transferring Tank Questions

[Chris_Noles]

Switching from a 10 gallon tank to a NUVO 25 AIO.
1. The tank is used so what do I clean it out with?
2. Do I have to cycle the tank again if I am going to put already established rock into the rockscape on the new tank?
3. Will using new sand cause a die off?
4. What filtration do I run in the back caddy?

 

[Brett S]

Switching from a 10 gallon tank to a NUVO 25 AIO.
1. The tank is used so what do I clean it out with?

Depends on what you need to clean. If you let the tank dry out completely you shouldn’t need to worry about transferring any nasties. If you just want to clean it then depending on how dirty it is you can use plain water, or water with some bleach (then let it dry completely to remove the bleach and/or fill it with fresh water with a high dose of chlorine nutralizer). If there is any calcification then you can use some acid to help remove it. (Vinegar, diluted muriatic acid, or citric acid)

2. Do I have to cycle the tank again if I am going to put already established rock into the rockscape on the new tank?

Generally no, especially if you just pick stuff up and move it from one tank to another with little time out of the water. The longer things spend out of the water the more chance there is for die off.

No matter what though, I would check your ammonia levels frequently after you get the new tank running (maybe as often as twice a day for the first week or two, then once a day for another week or two) and keep some ammonia neutralizer on hand just in case you do detect some.

3. Will using new sand cause a die off?

New sand by itself won’t cause a die off. If you transfer old sand from the tank and then cover it in new sand then that could cause problems as the stuff in the sand that is used to being at the surface no longer would be. If you do plan to transfer the sand put the new sand at the bottom and the old sand on the top. Or just use all new sand.

4. What filtration do I run in the back caddy?

I’ll let someone more familiar with smaller tanks answer this.

The only other thing I’ll mention is that you should plan to use mostly new water in the new tank. After you remove your rocks and livestock from the old tank the water will be cloudy and murky, so you don’t want to be reusing that water. You could take a little water from the old tank and transfer it to the new tank before you start moving things, but you don’t want to take so much that your rocks and corals have no water in the old tank before you move them.

The beneficial bacteria doesn’t live in the water column, so not transferring water won’t affect your cycle. Just make sure the new water matches the parameters of the old water as closely as possible.

 

[Justin Cook]

I don't have anything to add as a direct response to your questions, @Brett S did a great job. I've done this a few times and once things settle, there's always some amount of 'new tank uglies' that pop up. I've never seen an ammonia issue (have tested) but as the "new" tank matures, I've always gotten some diatoms and/or algae. It's never been as bad as a truly new tank but there usually is some sort of break in period even when I use the same amount of biological filtration (rock, matrix, etc...).

 

[Chris_Noles]

Depends on what you need to clean. If you let the tank dry out completely you shouldn’t need to worry about transferring any nasties. If you just want to clean it then depending on how dirty it is you can use plain water, or water with some bleach (then let it dry completely to remove the bleach and/or fill it with fresh water with a high dose of chlorine nutralizer). If there is any calcification then you can use some acid to help remove it. (Vinegar, diluted muriatic acid, or citric acid)



Generally no, especially if you just pick stuff up and move it from one tank to another with little time out of the water. The longer things spend out of the water the more chance there is for die off.

No matter what though, I would check your ammonia levels frequently after you get the new tank running (maybe as often as twice a day for the first week or two, then once a day for another week or two) and keep some ammonia neutralizer on hand just in case you do detect some.



New sand by itself won’t cause a die off. If you transfer old sand from the tank and then cover it in new sand then that could cause problems as the stuff in the sand that is used to being at the surface no longer would be. If you do plan to transfer the sand put the new sand at the bottom and the old sand on the top. Or just use all new sand.



I’ll let someone more familiar with smaller tanks answer this.

The only other thing I’ll mention is that you should plan to use mostly new water in the new tank. After you remove your rocks and livestock from the old tank the water will be cloudy and murky, so you don’t want to be reusing that water. You could take a little water from the old tank and transfer it to the new tank before you start moving things, but you don’t want to take so much that your rocks and corals have no water in the old tank before you move them.

The beneficial bacteria doesn’t live in the water column, so not transferring water won’t affect your cycle. Just make sure the new water matches the parameters of the old water as closely as possible.

I was thinking of just letting some citric acid sit in the tank to get whatever is left in there out because its been sitting in my lfs for a couple of months. If I was to break up my old rock and glue it together and let it sit for a day or so to let the glue set would I be killing the beneficial bacteria is there any way to go about this so I don't kill off the bacteria?

 

[Brett S]

I was thinking of just letting some citric acid sit in the tank to get whatever is left in there out because its been sitting in my lfs for a couple of months.

That would be fine, other than using a fairly significant amount of acid to make enough to fill a 20G tank. But usually the acid works pretty quickly, if you just put a little in the bottom of the tank and use a washcloth to wet and wash the sides of the tank every few minutes you should be able to get it clean pretty easily. Obviously you’ll want to wear gloves as you do this.

If I was to break up my old rock and glue it together and let it sit for a day or so to let the glue set would I be killing the beneficial bacteria is there any way to go about this so I don't kill off the bacteria?

You need to keep the rocks wet with salt water during this entire process. Keep the rocks you aren’t using wrapped in wet newspaper (or better yet, submerged in one of the tanks) and keep a spray bottle filled with salt water to wet the rocks that you are working on. Both superglue and epoxy will cure under water, so you don’t need to worry about leaving the rocks out to let the glue set. If you leave the rocks out for a day (or even a few hours) without constantly wetting them they will dry out and kill anything on them and then you absolutely will have a new cycle.

 

[Chris_Noles]

That would be fine, other than using a fairly significant amount of acid to make enough to fill a 20G tank. But usually the acid works pretty quickly, if you just put a little in the bottom of the tank and use a washcloth to wet and wash the sides of the tank every few minutes you should be able to get it clean pretty easily. Obviously you’ll want to wear gloves as you do this.



You need to keep the rocks wet with salt water during this entire process. Keep the rocks you aren’t using wrapped in wet newspaper (or better yet, submerged in one of the tanks) and keep a spray bottle filled with salt water to wet the rocks that you are working on. Both superglue and epoxy will cure under water, so you don’t need to worry about leaving the rocks out to let the glue set. If you leave the rocks out for a day (or even a few hours) without constantly wetting them they will dry out and kill anything on them and then you absolutely will have a new cycle.

Okay I think I'll go the route of getting the tank cleaned, build the stand, THEN build the scape and then put the saltwater in, how much of my old rock should I use in the new scape? or could I technically put just one of the old rocks into the new tank with nothing else and put the salt water in and let it sit for a couple of days then put the new rock scape with one of the older rocks still in the tank just sitting on the sand bed?

 

[Brett S]

To avoid a cycle you really need to transfer all of your old rock to the new tank. The bacteria lives in all of the rock, so if you only transfer one rock then you’ll be transferring maybe 5% of the bacteria, which will not be enough to keep the tank cycled.

The bacteria lives in other places as well, such as on the sand, on the walls of the tank, in any filter media that you have, etc. So even moving all of your rock is only going to be moving a subset of the bacteria. But usually moving all of the rock will transfer enough of the bacteria that you can avoid another cycle.

Initially it sounded like you wanted to reuse all of the rock from your old tank, but now it sounds like that might not be the case? If you do want to go with all new rock, one option would be to put in all of your new rock and get it set up the way you want, then also transfer all of the rock from your old tank to the new tank. Leave it there for several weeks, then over time (maybe once a week) remove one of the old rocks.

As I stated above, the old rocks will bring enough bacteria to keep the tank cycled and over time the bacteria will start to colonize on the new rocks. Once that has happened you can slowly remove the old rocks without removing too much bacteria at once and the tank will stay cycled.

However, you will want to be testing your ammonia frequently during this process just to make sure that things are going well.

 

[Chris_Noles]

To avoid a cycle you really need to transfer all of your old rock to the new tank. The bacteria lives in all of the rock, so if you only transfer one rock then you’ll be transferring maybe 5% of the bacteria, which will not be enough to keep the tank cycled.

The bacteria lives in other places as well, such as on the sand, on the walls of the tank, in any filter media that you have, etc. So even moving all of your rock is only going to be moving a subset of the bacteria. But usually moving all of the rock will transfer enough of the bacteria that you can avoid another cycle.

Initially it sounded like you wanted to reuse all of the rock from your old tank, but now it sounds like that might not be the case? If you do want to go with all new rock, one option would be to put in all of your new rock and get it set up the way you want, then also transfer all of the rock from your old tank to the new tank. Leave it there for several weeks, then over time (maybe once a week) remove one of the old rocks.

As I stated above, the old rocks will bring enough bacteria to keep the tank cycled and over time the bacteria will start to colonize on the new rocks. Once that has happened you can slowly remove the old rocks without removing too much bacteria at once and the tank will stay cycled.

However, you will want to be testing your ammonia frequently during this process just to make sure that things are going well.

Yeah I originally was going to use all of the old rock but it seems like it might just be easier to just make a new scape and cycle the tank again, but if I was to use the old rock in my new tank I could almost transfer everything over immediately?

 

[Brett S]

Yeah I originally was going to use all of the old rock but it seems like it might just be easier to just make a new scape and cycle the tank again, but if I was to use the old rock in my new tank I could almost transfer everything over immediately?

Yeah, if you use all of the old rock you can transfer everything over immediately. If you can have both tanks set up at the same time then it’s possible to set up the new one and cycle it and then transfer the fish. You can also speed up the cycle in the new tank by moving over one of your rocks. That won’t be enough to allow you to move over your livestock immediately, but it can provide a starting culture for the bacteria and significantly increase the speed of the cycle.

Changing tanks is always a lot of work, but if it was me I would just move it all at once and be done with it, unless you really don’t like your current rock or want to replace it anyway for some reason.

 

[Chris_Noles]

Yeah, if you use all of the old rock you can transfer everything over immediately. If you can have both tanks set up at the same time then it’s possible to set up the new one and cycle it and then transfer the fish. You can also speed up the cycle in the new tank by moving over one of your rocks. That won’t be enough to allow you to move over your livestock immediately, but it can provide a starting culture for the bacteria and significantly increase the speed of the cycle.

Changing tanks is always a lot of work, but if it was me I would just move it all at once and be done with it, unless you really don’t like your current rock or want to replace it anyway for some reason.

My current scape is just 5 rocks set up as a cave, so now that I have a tank that has some size and depth I would actually want to set up something decent to look at lol