Tropic Marine Pro Alkalinity

[Chopers49]

I did a water change recently with TM Pro, and for no reason but curiosity decided to do parameter tests and my Alkalinity shot up to 15.3!!! Before the test I was at 11.7! Now I'm praying my corals don't take a hit, or tank crash until I can do another water change! Has anyone had this happen to them recently?

 

[Chopers49]

A LFS owner gave me that advice yesterday

 

[Chopers49]

Mix a small amount ( 1 liter) let sit for an hour then check the fresh mix. I just checked mine and it was 7.7.

if it is the salt, try mixing up the bag, could be some separation during shipment.

I just mixed up a fresh batch and it tested at 20.0!!!! My tank water is at 15.2. Prior to a 30 gal water change my Alkalinity was at 11.0 and shot up to 15.2! So it's definitely the TMP salt.

 

[Jon's Reef]

I just mixed up a fresh batch and it tested at 20.0!!!! My tank water is at 15.2. Prior to a 30 gal water change my Alkalinity was at 11.0 and shot up to 15.2! So it's definitely the TMP salt.

Did you try mixing the bag and then making a new sample? Just take the bag out and tumble it several times. If it still is high... contact the vendor.

Sometimes TM checks these forums... maybe @Lou Ekus has some advice.

Unfortunately there is not an easy way to drop alk in the tank (citric acid or vodka will temporarily drop it... but it will just go back up).

 

[Reef.]

It’s almost certainly a testing error, TMP salt is only around 7dkh and even if it were 20 you would have to do a large water change for your alk to increase that much with just one water change.

Sounds like your LFS uses maybe Instant ocean salt as that is around 11.5dkh.

 

[Chopers49]

Did you try mixing the bag and then making a new sample? Just take the bag out and tumble it several times. If it still is high... contact the vendor.

Sometimes TM checks these forums... maybe @Lou Ekus has some advice.

Unfortunately there is not an easy way to drop alk in the tank (citric acid or vodka will temporarily drop it... but it will just go back up).

I'm dumbfounded. But I'm going g to take a sample and the TMP back to where I bought it. I'm sure we will figure out what's wrong! Also might I add my coral is looking spectacular!!! Best I've seen to date! So I'm really confused! I hope they stay that way. Thank you!

 

[Chopers49]

It’s almost certainly a testing error, TMP salt is only around 7dkh and even if it were 20 you would have to do a large water change for your alk to increase that much with just one water change.

Sounds like your LFS uses maybe Instant ocean salt as that is around 11.5dkh.

No Sir. I ran 2 test and both came back exactly at 20.0.... I am not sure what he uses, Also the test I did was on the fresh batch alone! I didn't add it to my aquarium then test!

 

[Reef.]

No Sir. I ran 2 test and both came back exactly at 20.0.... I am not sure what he uses, Also the test I did was on the fresh batch alone! I didn't add it to my aquarium then test!

That does not prove it’s not a testing error, many ways it could be an error, your alk reagent could be from a bad batch, I have just bought a new packet of PO4 Hanna reagents and they all give a zero reading when the last batch gave a reading of 0.1.

obviously something is off, not sure why it can’t be a testing error and has to be the salt, and as I said for 1 water change to increase your alk by over 3dkh it would have to have been a large change.

 

[Chopers49]

Tropic Marin Reef Pro salt?

Yes

 

[Chopers49]

That does not prove it’s not a testing error, many ways it could be an error, your alk reagent could be from a bad batch, I have just bought a new packet of PO4 Hanna reagents and they all give a zero reading when the last batch gave a reading of 0.1.

obviously something is off, not sure why it can’t be a testing error and has to be the salt, and as I said for 1 water change to increase your alk by over 3dkh it would have to have been a large change.

I get you now. I was thinking you meant I made an error! But yes you could be right. I'm taking a sample and mix to my LFS tomorrow and see what comes out of it. Thanks

 

[Chopers49]

Did you check the salinity?

Yes on the new batch of 30 gal came out to 1.026

 

[Chopers49]

I usually get like 7.5 dkh with pro reef, were you using pro reef before?

No first time. I barely started mixing my own batches. I got tired of buckets! Figured I'd give TMP a shot.

 

[Reefinmike]

No Sir. I ran 2 test and both came back exactly at 20.0.... I am not sure what he uses, Also the test I did was on the fresh batch alone! I didn't add it to my aquarium then test!

Despite what the BRS hivemind wants to tell you… hanna is a pretty tick poor testing device for almost everything. I’d trust their ulr phosphate test but the Red Sea pro is SO much easier and just as precise/accurate.

-they’re produced in romania
-Reagent regularly vary +/-1dkh batch to batch
-reagents quickly oxidize and degrade once opened. Expect readings to start drifting on day 30 and consider the reagent trash 45 days after opening.

Salifert is a much more reliable and stable alk kit. Once you know your way around the test, it can easily be performed faster than the hanna for a fraction of the price.

even better- test alkalinity the proper way with a pH probe and 0.1N(very weak) acid. http://www.reefedition.com/a-diy-alkalinity-test-by-randy-holmes-farley/

 

[Lou Ekus]

I just mixed up a fresh batch and it tested at 20.0!!!! My tank water is at 15.2. Prior to a 30 gal water change my Alkalinity was at 11.0 and shot up to 15.2! So it's definitely the TMP salt.

I can try to help with some information. First let me say, that while nothing is "impossible", it is extremely unlikely that any freshly mixed batch of Tropic Marin Pro Reef salt was actually 20 dkH. It doesn't matter how much it may have "settled" or "separated". That value is just not usually possible to see. Was your water clear when it was dissolved? If it was clear, then it is even more unlikely, as that dkH value would almost certainly produce a calcium carbonate precipitate if it were true.

I also agree that this is almost certainly a testing error. I'm not saying that you are doing anything wrong. Just that the values just don't make sense, so a testing error is the most likely explanation. As an example, if your tank system was actually at 11 dkH, and you did a 20% water change (I don't know the size of your system, this is just an example) with water change water that was actually 20 dkH. The resulting tank system alkalinity would still only be 12.8 dkH, not 15.2. To achieve that tank system value your water change would have to have been close to 50%.

All that being said, if you still are in doubt, there will be a lot number on the lid of the bucket of Pro Reef salt that you have. If you have a box of Pro Reef, the lot number will be on the side of the box. Send me that lot number and I will be happy to check our batch controls of that lot, to verify the alkalinity value from manufacturing.

I hope this information is helpful.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Are you using tap water to make it? Some folks have a lot of alkalinity in their tap water, and it adds to the alk in the salt mix.

 

[Chopers49]

I can try to help with some information. First let me say, that while nothing is "impossible", it is extremely unlikely that any freshly mixed batch of Tropic Marin Pro Reef salt was actually 20 dkH. It doesn't matter how much it may have "settled" or "separated". That value is just not usually possible to see. Was your water clear when it was dissolved? If it was clear, then it is even more unlikely, as that dkH value would almost certainly produce a calcium carbonate precipitate if it were true.

I also agree that this is almost certainly a testing error. I'm not saying that you are doing anything wrong. Just that the values just don't make sense, so a testing error is the most likely explanation. As an example, if your tank system was actually at 11 dkH, and you did a 20% water change (I don't know the size of your system, this is just an example) with water change water that was actually 20 dkH. The resulting tank system alkalinity would still only be 12.8 dkH, not 15.2. To achieve that tank system value your water change would have to have been close to 50%.

All that being said, if you still are in doubt, there will be a lot number on the lid of the bucket of Pro Reef salt that you have. If you have a box of Pro Reef, the lot number will be on the side of the box. Send me that lot number and I will be happy to check our batch controls of that lot, to verify the alkalinity value from manufacturing.

I hope this information is helpful.

I figured it out. It's not the salt I tested another small batch of water and the Alk was at 20.0 again. So then I tested the RO Water and THATS WHERE THE PROBLEM IS AT! NOT TROPIC MARINE PRO SALT! I apologize for the mix up, and I'd like to thank everyone that took a moment to help! @Lou Ekus thank you for reaching out Sir!

 

[Chopers49]

I did a water change recently with TM Pro, and for no reason but curiosity decided to do parameter tests and my Alkalinity shot up to 15.3!!! Before the test I was at 11.7! Now I'm praying my corals don't take a hit, or tank crash until I can do another water change! Has anyone had this happen to them recently?

IT WAS NOT TROPIC MARINE PRO SALT!!!! IT WAS MY RO UNIT. AFTER TESTING MY RO WATER IT CAME BACK @ 18.2. THERE IS MY PROBLEM! APOLOGIES TO TROPIC MARINE FOR JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I figured it out. It's not the salt I tested another small batch of water and the Alk was at 20.0 again. So then I tested the RO Water and THATS WHERE THE PROBLEM IS AT! NOT TROPIC MARINE PRO SALT! I apologize for the mix up, and I'd like to thank everyone that took a moment to help! @Lou Ekus thank you for reaching out Sir!

I show in this article that some city tap water supplies have more than 10 dKH of alkalinity, and if you use some type of water that isn't appropriately purified, it can have lots of alk.

Aquarium Chemistry: Tap Water in Reef Aquaria

As will become clear in this article, using tap water is risky business. Short of testing your own water, there is no way to be certain that your water is acceptable.

reefs.com

That said, you mentioned RO water? Where did it come from? Do you know the TDS? Maybe it's the test that is bad, not the water. Many kits cannot even read that high.

 

[Chopers49]

I show in this article that some city tap water supplies have more than 10 dKH of alkalinity, and if you use some type of water that isn't appropriately purified, it can have lots of alk.

Aquarium Chemistry: Tap Water in Reef Aquaria

As will become clear in this article, using tap water is risky business. Short of testing your own water, there is no way to be certain that your water is acceptable.

reefs.com

That said, you mentioned RO water? Where did it come from? Do you know the TDS? Maybe it's the test that is bad, not the water. Many kits cannot even read that high.

I just started mixing my own. I'm using a Kold-steril filter, but I didn't even consider that my water quality out of the tap. I went with that because of the zero waste, but now I'm stuck with it! I'm looking into some kind of compatible DI chamber. I'm using the Hanna Checker and up until now my results have been almost spot on with my LFS. So back to the drawing board I go. Thank You

 

[Reef.]

Good catch Randy, saying it could be the water.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I just started mixing my own. I'm using a Kold-steril filter, but I didn't even consider that my water quality out of the tap. I went with that because of the zero waste, but now I'm stuck with it! I'm looking into some kind of compatible DI chamber. I'm using the Hanna Checker and up until now my results have been almost spot on with my LFS. So back to the drawing board I go. Thank You

Kold steril? That's not RO water. It will not remove alkalinity from the tap water. I'm not a big fan of it for reefs.