Two Part Solution

GMaquarium · Jun 9, 2009

For some time now the two part solution has been an easy favorite method for many reef hobbyist to boost alkalinity and calcium, as well as the third part magnesium. I am just a bit curious if this is still the case as some folks have moved away from liquid two part dosing. I am also a little interested in the types or brands of products that you guys/gals use.

#1 Do you purchase two part additives from your local shop B-ionic, C-balance, Kent marine, seachem, Dt's, sera or other large scale brands?

#2 Do you purchase two part ingredients from places like Bulk reef supply and mix it with water?

#3 Do you make your own from scratch?

#4 I do not use two part at all

GPhiAce · Jun 9, 2009

I use Randys recipe #2 using Turbo Calcium, baking soda and epson salts (changing to the Mg from bulk reef supply soon, but I do weekly water changes). I mix using RO/DI water that I make. Dose using an Aquamedic dual doser

milkman · Jun 9, 2009

I use the Bulk Reef two part kits. Works great.

evad1 · Jun 9, 2009

warner marine 2 part is great

JR's Reef · Jun 9, 2009

milkman said:
I use the Bulk Reef two part kits. Works great.

I use the same

gparr · Jun 9, 2009

BRS for me, too.
Gary

Mchava · Jun 9, 2009

I make my own, using Leslies Pool Hardner for Ca and Arm and Hammer Backing soda for Alk. I also use MgCl and NCl for Mag. (Randy's 2part+mag) I tried the BRS stuff and did not see any difference. just my 0.02

Yellowtang · Jun 9, 2009

I make my own. Driveway deicer for CA Arm and hammer for alk and epsome salts, ocational mag from seachem seens how I have a ton of it on the shelf.

JR,

Jon Warner · Jun 9, 2009

When selecting a 2 Part Calcium/Alkalinity product, one must consider a number of factors.

1) DIY products are NOT ionically balanced. After continued use, your Chloride and Sodium levels will be elevated in relation to the palette of NSW elements.

2) Formulation matters. Even different commercial formulations are different, with different compositions and different chemical properties. Some formulations will hold Alkalinity better and some will supply more/less of an increase in pH.

3) Look for the "Big 3" in your 2 Part. Proper 2 Part products will contain Magnesium, Strontium and Iodide.

4) Look for growth and color promoting Trace Elements such as Potassium and Bromine.

Having said that... DIY 2-Part won't kill off your tank obviously, it just depends on how carefully you watch your water chemistry and are prepared to correct ionic imbalance.

evad1 · Jun 10, 2009

Jon Warner said:
When selecting a 2 Part Calcium/Alkalinity product, one must consider a number of factors.

1) DIY products are NOT ionically balanced. After continued use, your Chloride and Sodium levels will be elevated in relation to the palette of NSW elements.

2) Formulation matters. Even different commercial formulations are different, with different compositions and different chemical properties. Some formulations will hold Alkalinity better and some will supply more/less of an increase in pH.

3) Look for the "Big 3" in your 2 Part. Proper 2 Part products will contain Magnesium, Strontium and Iodide.

4) Look for growth and color promoting Trace Elements such as Potassium and Bromine.

Having said that... DIY 2-Part won't kill off your tank obviously, it just depends on how carefully you watch your water chemistry and are prepared to correct ionic imbalance.

nuff said

brianbigoats · Jun 10, 2009

Jon Warner said:
When selecting a 2 Part Calcium/Alkalinity product, one must consider a number of factors.

1) DIY products are NOT ionically balanced. After continued use, your Chloride and Sodium levels will be elevated in relation to the palette of NSW elements.

Jon
as long as the Calcium and Alk are add in the correct stoimetric ratio you tank will eventually reach equilibrium given your mag is not extremely low. potential build up of Cl and Na can be an issue with any 2 part. if you do water changes on a normal basis it should not an issue. the reduction of these compounds is the basis for the balling method

Mchava · Jun 10, 2009

brianbigoats said:
Jon
as long as the Calcium and Alk are add in the correct stoimetric ratio you tank will eventually reach equilibrium given your mag is not extremely low. potential build up of Cl and Na can be an issue with any 2 part. if you do water changes on a normal basis it should not an issue. the reduction of these compounds is the basis for the balling method

I too agree with what brianbigoats said. I have tried multiple 2part systems from different companies and really didn't see any difference. If you are doing your water changes in a normal basis you should not have to worry.

Jon Warner · Jun 10, 2009

brianbigoats said:
Jon
as long as the Calcium and Alk are add in the correct stoimetric ratio you tank will eventually reach equilibrium given your mag is not extremely low. potential build up of Cl and Na can be an issue with any 2 part. if you do water changes on a normal basis it should not an issue. the reduction of these compounds is the basis for the balling method

well... not exactly

I gave a Powerpoint to a few clubs a few years back that graphically showed how it DOES happen. Please let me try to summarize:

When using DIY Calcium/Alkalinity products... here's what happens

Imagine this: (excuse the crude graphics below)

What we have here is a graph showing the relative concentrations of 12 elements in sea water. This is the CORRECT balance, the CORRECT ratio of elements in natural sea water. In every ocean, in every reef this is the way it is.

In the lower diagram, this is the "after" continued use aof a DIY 2-Part product.

I promise... the Powerpoint looked MUCH better!

Here's what happened. You WILL have an increase in the ratio of Na and Cl to other elements. This is simply because you're ADDING Cl and Na while you're DEPLETING Mg, Sr, K and other trace elements.

In the ocean there is ALWAYS a perfect balance... let's say element A:B is ALWAYS 13:1... continued use of a DIY 2-Part will change that to 20:1...

Now there is a debate as to whether it's harmful or not to have imbalanced water... I don't think I'd consider it harmful. But it's not NATURAL either.

A balanced ion 2-Part will raise ALL elements in the correct NSW ratio. After continued use of a balanced 2-Part your salinity may go from 34ppt to 36ppt. But the balance won't change, similar to adding more salt mix to your salt bucket...

Not trying to change anyone's mind... just passing along the facts.