USING WASHING SODA FOR ALK.

[BOWHUNTER4250]

Randy ,
I have had numerous discussions with various people about the use of washing soda for Alk . I am currently using this as my main source for Alk in my 300 gallon display and people keep telling me that this cant be used long term as their are other " bi products " in this that are harmful to mt tank.

Can you please chime in here and settle this discussion once and for all for me as i would greatly appreciate your input ...
I use this for my Alk
Dowflake Calcium Chloride for my Calcium
Magflake magnesium chloride for Magnesium

Thank you
Mark

 

[Treefer32]

Randy ,
I have had numerous discussions with various people about the use of washing soda for Alk . I am currently using this as my main source for Alk in my 300 gallon display and people keep telling me that this cant be used long term as their are other " bi products " in this that are harmful to mt tank.

Can you please chime in here and settle this discussion once and for all for me as i would greatly appreciate your input ...
I use this for my Alk
Dowflake Calcium Chloride for my Calcium
Magflake magnesium chloride for Magnesium

Thank you
Mark

I know this is not what you're looking for, but do you have access to a Costco or Sams Club? They have 10 or 13lb bags of food grade Baking soda for $10 or so. That lasts me over a year on my 340 gallon display with no water changes. around a $1.00 per month for alk dosing...

 

[BOWHUNTER4250]

I know this is not what you're looking for, but do you have access to a Costco or Sams Club? They have 10 or 13lb bags of food grade Baking soda for $10 or so. That lasts me over a year on my 340 gallon display with no water changes. around a $1.00 per month for alk dosing...

Yes i do have a cosco card ... now to be honest i was using regular baking soda in the past but i was putting it in the oven for 45 minutes to help keep a higher PH that got to be time consuming and i have a crazy schedule .....mine since using the washing soda has been staying around 8.5 ???

 

[Treefer32]

Yes i do have a cosco card ... now to be honest i was using regular baking soda in the past but i was putting it in the oven for 45 minutes to help keep a higher PH that got to be time consuming and i have a crazy schedule .....mine since using the washing soda has been staying around 8.5 ???

yeah, I bake mine too. I just did a batch yesterday. I filled an entire cookie sheet around 2 inches thick and baked for 3 hours at 350 and then pulled out and let cool for an hour. I bake enough to last 6 months (half a bag or so). A couple hours of baking every 6-7 months isn't terrible. I spend more time on worse things for the tank (like scraping the glass every 3 days.).

 

[BOWHUNTER4250]

yeah, I bake mine too. I just did a batch yesterday. I filled an entire cookie sheet around 2 inches thick and baked for 3 hours at 350 and then pulled out and let cool for an hour. I bake enough to last 6 months (half a bag or so). A couple hours of baking every 6-7 months isn't terrible. I spend more time on worse things for the tank (like scraping the glass every 3 days.).

What does your PH stay at ? and how much are you dosing for your Alk daily ? im at 365 ml daily for a TWV of approx. 450 gallons

 

[KStatefan]

From Randy's article

https://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

"I prefer to use baked baking soda rather than washing soda in this recipe as baking soda from a grocery store is always food grade, while washing soda may not have the same purity requirements."

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

From Randy's article

https://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

"I prefer to use baked baking soda rather than washing soda in this recipe as baking soda from a grocery store is always food grade, while washing soda may not have the same purity requirements."

Couldn’t have said it better myself. lol

 

[homer1475]

Couldn’t have said it better myself. lol

Pretty sure you did. LOL

 

[KQuillan]

yeah, I bake mine too. I just did a batch yesterday. I filled an entire cookie sheet around 2 inches thick and baked for 3 hours at 350 and then pulled out and let cool for an hour. I bake enough to last 6 months (half a bag or so). A couple hours of baking every 6-7 months isn't terrible. I spend more time on worse things for the tank (like scraping the glass every 3 days.).

Just curious, why do you have to bake it?

 

[homer1475]

Baked baking soda, or soda ash give a small PH boost when dosed, as opposed to sodium bicarbonate(regular baking soda) which has a small PH lower effect.

EDIT:
And the Soda ash recipe is twice as strong as regular baking soda.

 

[BOWHUNTER4250]

Just curious, why do you have to bake it?

When you bake it the PH will be higher

 

[Treefer32]

Baked baking soda, or soda ash give a small PH boost when dosed, as opposed to sodium bicarbonate(regular baking soda) which has a small PH lower effect.

EDIT:
And the Soda ash recipe is twice as strong as regular baking soda.

Correct! Be careful dosing baked baking soda as it is potent. I use 3/4 cup in 1.5 liters of RODI water and that lasts my 340 gallon system around 4 weeks at 48 ml per day (2 ml per hour). A couple years ago when I had a lot crap load of hammers and most of my corals were really taking off I was going through 10 ml per hour. However, my nutrients got too high and killed all my hammers and killed off some of the alk consuming corals. Don't really know what caused the cascade failure, but phosphates hit .5 ppm and nitrates hit 50 ppm for several months. Stuff is finally recovering with phosphates down to .09 and nitrates down to 25. So, I'm back up to 2 ml per hour.

I supplement (Right now until I run out) All for reef an additional 3 ml per hour of that. Once that's gone I'll bump the calcium and baked baking soda up.

But those amounts are for 340 gallon display and 75 gallon sump. So around 350 gallons total water volume and 1-2 water changes a year.

 

[BOWHUNTER4250]

Correct! Be careful dosing baked baking soda as it is potent. I use 3/4 cup in 1.5 liters of RODI water and that lasts my 340 gallon system around 4 weeks at 48 ml per day (2 ml per hour). A couple years ago when I had a lot crap load of hammers and most of my corals were really taking off I was going through 10 ml per hour. However, my nutrients got too high and killed all my hammers and killed off some of the alk consuming corals. Don't really know what caused the cascade failure, but phosphates hit .5 ppm and nitrates hit 50 ppm for several months. Stuff is finally recovering with phosphates down to .09 and nitrates down to 25. So, I'm back up to 2 ml per hour.

I supplement (Right now until I run out) All for reef an additional 3 ml per hour of that. Once that's gone I'll bump the calcium and baked baking soda up.

But those amounts are for 340 gallon display and 75 gallon sump. So around 350 gallons total water volume and 1-2 water changes a year.

Do you have SPS in your system ? 48ml a day for that kind of volume seems very low ? im at 365 for SPS dominated tank with approx. 425 Gal. of TWV

 

[homer1475]

Do you have SPS in your system ? 48ml a day for that kind of volume seems very low ? im at 365 for SPS dominated tank with approx. 425 Gal. of TWV

Agreed. I dose 105ml a day to an 80G acro dominant system.

EDIT:
never actually figured it out till now. Thats 2dkh a day. Interesting.

 

[Treefer32]

Do you have SPS in your system ? 48ml a day for that kind of volume seems very low ? im at 365 for SPS dominated tank with approx. 425 Gal. of TWV

I have several Acros, a massive Chalice, and some purple montipora. It's not heavily populated. I have a 40 head or so Duncan, 2 different colors of candy canes that are taking off (these have really taken off growing new heads in the last 2-3 months after reducing nutrients). I have a orange branching acro that is slowly finally taking off. My Acros are around 6-7" in diameter colonies. My Chalice is 3 tiers and each tier is around 10" in diameter.

Yeah, I thought the alk consumption is low compared to when I was up to 240 ml per day. My high nutrients really set me back as well as switching to all for reef. Between the two, my Acros stopped growing, my montipora had a 80% die off. (all of which is slowly recovering now.) Even the 10-20% of the montipora that remained a few months ago is growing back over the large old skeleton. The old skeleton is 70% covered again! I lucked out and it didn't die completely!

I'm checking alk every 3-4 days now, and I've had to bump it up for the first time in 6 months! (This is a positive sign). 2 days ago it was 8.3. Today it's 8.2. I can't wait for the all for reef to be gone. My corals didn't like it.

 

[Treefer32]

One other thing to mention is I recently did an ICP test. Everything - calcium, magnesium, salinity was all in check. No harsh metals detected. The only issue I could find with my water was - 0 manganese and 0 iodine. I know Iodine is critical to some coral immune systems. I suspect, All for reef does not have the concentration of iodine or manganese needed to supplement coral and algae consumption. (especially when nutrients were high).

I'm switching back to red sea trace elements, specifically iodine. And then dosing ATI or Triton manganese as a supplement weekly. I think the increased missing elements and lower nutrients is causing my corals to heal. Too bad I lost all my hammers.

 

[BOWHUNTER4250]

Couldn’t have said it better myself. lol

So switching back to baked baking soda from the washing soda how much difference will there be in terms of Alk change ? If I’m dosing 360 Ml now of washing soda How much would I want to start with going back to baking soda ?