Vodka Vinegar dosing not working?

[1979fishgeek]

I was using NoPox for over a year and it was very affective but cost a lot in 1200l system so I switched 6 weeks ago to 40% Vodka and White Vinegar 50/50 mix. But since switching I noticed my Nitrates have risen from undetectable to 20ppm!
I was dosing 6ml of NoPox over 24 hours so dosed the same with vodka/vinegar and noticed the steady increase in no3 so been dosing 11ml for last 2 weeks and it’s still raising? What am I doing wrong...before I switch back to NoPox!

 

[DFR]

Providing you haven’t seen any adverse signs, I would try dosing a little more. In theory your 1:1 mixture you made should work fine, but if I’m not mistaken, the nopox formula is more of a 1:1 using 60 proof.

 

[1979fishgeek]

Providing you haven’t seen any adverse signs, I would try dosing a little more. In theory your 1:1 mixture you made should work fine, but if I’m not mistaken, the nopox formula is more of a 1:1 using 60 proof.

Thank you, I will try a little more, but I’m thinking the amount of vodka compared to NoPox I’m using it’s going to work out costing the same. But at least I’m giving a go.

 

[DFR]

Since you are using 80 proof vodka, try diluting it before you mix it to the vinegar. This should make the vodka last longer, and save you some money. If you buy 750mL of vodka, add 250mL of DI water (in a larger container). Then use this to make a 1:1 with vinegar. I would continue using that ratio going forward. Every week try increasing the volume being dosed until you start seeing a decrease in nutrient levels, start seing some sort of bacterial bloom, or the value of what is being dosed exceeds what you were dosing with nopox.
You really shouldn’t need to use more than about 2x what you were dosing with nopox. So I would expect your nutrient levels to begin decreasing soon. Hope this helps!

Also what is your current fish stocking in the tank, and what are you running for filtration, and how much live rock or biomedia do you have?

 

[The Reefing Scotsman]

What is your PO4 concentration?

 

[1979fishgeek]

Also what is your current fish stocking in the tank, and what are you running for filtration, and how much live rock or biomedia do you have?

Two systems feeding one sump, 6x2x2 sps dominated mixed reef and a 4x2x2 softie tank both draining to a 5ft sump. Filtration is via a lot of live rock can’t rememner how many kilos, but it’s old school with the entire back wall stacked with rock. Koi matting in sump and then 2 protein skimmers, Deltec AP850 and a bespoke huge Deltec from a aquarium shop, the total tank volume is 1200l, skimmers can easily handle double to triple that volume.
Refugium also in sump.
Fish stock
Desjardinii Red Sea Sailfin Tang - 8 inch
Pacific Sailfin Tang - 2 inch
Yellow Tang - 5 inch
Regal Tang - 8 inch
Lawnmower Blenny
Pair of Spotted Dragonette
Six Line Wrasse - 2 inch
Blue Throat Trigger - 6 inch
Niger Trigger - 2inch
Porcupine Puffer - 4 inch

 

[1979fishgeek]

What is your PO4 concentration?

Measured with a Hanna ULR phosphorus checker at 0.089ppm

 

[1979fishgeek]

Main sps dominated mixed reef display.


Softie/ nem display



Refugium


Skimmer that does most the work

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

How much of what were you mixing?

Here's my DIY recommendation if you want to use a NOPOX-like mixture (I personally prefer vinegar alone, but both work).

"Mix one part vinegar to one half part vodka and one half part water. If you want to get even closer, add a little more vodka and a little less water."

DIY mixtures of vodka and/or vinegar are definitely less expensive than NOPOX (and similarly effective) unless you are in a place with alcohol taxes very much higher than in the usual US locations.

 

[1979fishgeek]

Im

How much of what were you mixing?

Here's my DIY recommendation if you want to use a NOPOX-like mixture (I personally prefer vinegar alone, but both work).

"Mix one part vinegar to one half part vodka and one half part water. If you want to get even closer, add a little more vodka and a little less water."

DIY mixtures of vodka and/or vinegar are definitely less expensive than NOPOX (and similarly effective) unless you are in a place with alcohol taxes very much higher than in the usual US locations.

I’m doing 500ml of vodka to 500ml of Vinegar. 50/50 mixed via a auto doser, 1ml at a time, now dosing 12ml a day.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Im

I’m doing 500ml of vodka to 500ml of Vinegar. 50/50 mixed via a auto doser, 1ml at a time, now dosing 12ml a day.

That should be a tad more potent than NOPOX. My expectation is that if you dosed 12 ml of NOPOX, you'd see a need for more too, but regardless, dosing more is fine.

 

[1979fishgeek]

Thank you, I’ve increased it to 14ml per 24 hours now. So hopefully see some reduction soon.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

It may take a while.

Good luck.

 

[1979fishgeek]

It may take a while.

Good luck.

Thank you!

As it’s a (slightly?) different carbon source does a different strain of bacteria need to grow? I’m just wondering why changing from NoPox to Vodka Vinegar has made such a difference?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Thank you!

As it’s a (slightly?) different carbon source does a different strain of bacteria need to grow? I’m just wondering why changing from NoPox to Vodka Vinegar has made such a difference?

Maybe. We really have no idea how the dosing impacts species of bacteria. For example, does dosing a mix ultimately end up with one dominating species that eats all of the organics dosed in the mix, one different dominating species that consumes each organic in the mix, or a big spectrum of dozens of different species with no dominating one. I have no idea.

 

[m1923]

Thank you!

As it’s a (slightly?) different carbon source does a different strain of bacteria need to grow? I’m just wondering why changing from NoPox to Vodka Vinegar has made such a difference?

Hi,any updates,is it working now?

 

[1979fishgeek]

Hi,any updates,is it working now?

Unfortunately no, I’ve gone back to NoPox and learnt the lesson “of it ain’t broke don’t fix it!”. My nitrates we’re reaching 60ppm and phosphates were 0.2ppm and I ended up with nightmare hair algae, my Acro browned out and lost a little tissue in areas then algae grew on the dead pataches. I’ve gone back to the NoPox, I have a huge heterotrophic bacteria explosion from the very high nutrients, I’m only dosing the nopox at 10ml a day and need to increase to triple that for max dose but with the bacteria explosion I’m having to do it slooooooow. It’s dropped to 30ppm no3 and PO4 is 0.02 so it’s going in the right direction but really slowly.

I switched from NoPox to vodka/vinegar to save money, but with the price of vodka and the amount I was dosing the NoPox is cheaper. It might have worked out given time, but I knew NoPox worked in my tank very well.

Photo of the Heterotrophic Basteria stringy slime in low flow areas, it looks unsightly but it’s obviously doing something as nutrients are finally dropping.

 

[DFR]

Sorry it didn’t work out. Every tank is different so trial and error will show what’s best for your system.

 

[1979fishgeek]

Thanks, Just did another test, No3 25 and PO4 0.05 so NoPox is def doing its thing.

 

[m1923]

I guess I have the same problem, so I asked. I try vodka for several months, not very good, the vinegar I bought from supermarket has sugar inside, much worth, I can’t find pure vinegar here.so I only try vodka. Maybe every tank is different, the magic just didn’t happen. Maybe it’s about the bacteria. I guess I should try nopox then, maybe it’s better than vodka, as a commercial product, it may contain something different ?as to pure vodka?