Vortech M1 or L1?????

litenyaup · Apr 22, 2017

Ok so I'm going to be setting my tank back up and want a new return pump. I really wanna do the controllable vortech both for noise reduction and less power usage. My question is which would be the better choice for my system? I have a custom 190 gallon display with about a 30 gallon sump. Off my return I run UV, 2 reactors (carbon and gfo), algae reactor, and have a spare in case I decide to add something else. The pump I used while my tank was up and running was an iwaki MD 55RLT and had it dialed down quite a bit. It was rated for 1140 gph. The M1 is rated at 2000 gph and the L1 at 3100 gph. If anyone has any input on this please let me know which choice would be the best.

Here is what my under side looks like.

Scorpius · Apr 22, 2017

I run an M1 on a 65 gal tank. I like overkill. I vote L1 for your tank.

litenyaup · Apr 23, 2017

What level intensity did you run it at?

Scorpius · Apr 23, 2017

litenyaup said:
What level intensity did you run it at?

I calibrated it to my plumbing. I don't know how to tell what gph it's running.

litenyaup · Apr 23, 2017

Scorpius said:
I calibrated it to my plumbing. I don't know how to tell what gph it's running.

On the controller what setting/ level did you have it at? 1/4, 1/2, 3/4, full all the way up? How many dots where lit on the controller?

Scorpius · Apr 23, 2017

Just checked 75%.

d2mini · Apr 23, 2017

I run the L1 on my 120g Elos with no manifold or anything. Running it at 85%. Could run it at 100% but I found it runs hot at that level.
Power seems to drop quick with any restriction. I'm getting just 600 gph with my return plumbing in the overflow dropping down to 3/4".
You won't get anything near the max listed output. That's at zero head.

mcarroll · Apr 24, 2017

Well...

Doing your flow in the tank with powerheads leaves your return pump free just to be a return pump.

This means you don't need anything like variable flow.

And you only need it to deliver anywhere between 2x and 4x your display size in GPH. Anything in that range will keep any skimmers and reactors well-fed.

For a 190 Gallon, that means any flow rate in between 380 and 760 GPH will be fine. Let's say 400-800 GPH to keep it simple.

A simple AC pump like a Quiet One, Mag, Eheim or Sicce would be my recommendation.

A $50 Quiet One 2200, 3000 or 4000 would be my budget choice....also VERY VERY quiet....model depending on how high your tank is. Even the largest of those is only 58 watts.

A Mag 7 or 9.5, Eheim 1260 or 1262 or Sicce Syncra 2.5 or larger would also be great choices.

litenyaup · Apr 28, 2017

mcarroll said:
Well...

Doing your flow in the tank with powerheads leaves your return pump free just to be a return pump.

This means you don't need anything like variable flow.

And you only need it to deliver anywhere between 2x and 4x your display size in GPH. Anything in that range will keep any skimmers and reactors well-fed.

For a 190 Gallon, that means any flow rate in between 380 and 760 GPH will be fine. Let's say 400-800 GPH to keep it simple.

A simple AC pump like a Quiet One, Mag, Eheim or Sicce would be my recommendation.

A $50 Quiet One 2200, 3000 or 4000 would be my budget choice....also VERY VERY quiet....model depending on how high your tank is. Even the largest of those is only 58 watts.

A Mag 7 or 9.5, Eheim 1260 or 1262 or Sicce Syncra 2.5 or larger would also be great choices.

Right now how I have it setup is with an external pump. I did it that way to reduce heat production in the water from equipment.

That being said is it truly going to make that much of a difference with having my return in sump? My skimmer is the only other pump that will be in the water. I run mp40's for circulation in my tank and led's for lighting. Reactors and UV are run off my return as well.

My ultimate goal in "fixing what was not broke" is to reduce noise and energy consumption.

mfinn · Apr 28, 2017

I use a Vectra M1 as my return pump on my 240.
It's running at about 60%-70%.
It is one of the quietest pumps I've ever used.

I spent the extra money for it, just because of how quiet it really is.

faisal629 · Apr 28, 2017

Nice sump! I love a well put together system!

mcarroll · Apr 28, 2017

Thanks to the laws of thermodynamics, watts of pumps are just like watts of heaters.

Do you currently run a chiller?

litenyaup · Apr 28, 2017

mcarroll said:
Thanks to the laws of thermodynamics, watts of pumps are just like watts of heaters.

Do you currently run a chiller?

I do not.

litenyaup · Apr 28, 2017

mfinn said:
I use a Vectra M1 as my return pump on my 240.
It's running at about 60%-70%.
It is one of the quietest pumps I've ever used.

I spent the extra money for it, just because of how quiet it really is.

Do you run it internal or external?

kmatehws12 · Apr 28, 2017

I have a L1 on a 175 gallon and you can calibrate the min. and max. levels. I have the max set to about 80% of pump capacity but like the "headroom" to get more flow if I need it. The main reason I went to this pump is how quiet it is and when I do water changes I can dial it to low rather than fully off and maintain a small amount of water flow to reduce micro bubbles. It has a slow start from when the pump is off which also helps with the bubbles when you turn it on. Be aware that these pumps (M1 and L1) come with BSP threads (not US Standard found at Lowes or HomeDepot) and may need an adaptor that ECOTECH sells for around $10-$12 to go to Sch 40 fittings. The adaptor threads over the male threads on the output side of the pump to give you the most unrestricted flow path. On the M1 the blue cap is slightly smaller than the pump housing (white inner circle on adaptor picture) but it is more restrictive on the L1. The L1 is in my tank and I cannot show the disassembly pictures. I bought both and ending up going with the L1 over the M1, its definitely powerful but does not feel to big for the tank.

These are pictures of the M1... the white output is the BSP to Schedule 40 adapter, the blue cap is what comes with the pump, you can see the difference in the size of the opening. Hope this helps...

mcarroll · Apr 28, 2017

litenyaup said:
I do not.

If you get by without a chiller it's doubtful whether you'll save any significant amount of money on power either way.

Based on your location, I'm assuming you have HVAC and keep the house somewhere around 70ºF?
I also assume that your heaters run as-needed to keep the tank around 80ºF.
100% of the watts from all your gear end up as heat – either the in your water or in the house. (thermodynamics)
None of that heat dissipates without having an effect on your power bill. (Thanks to #1)
If you reduce the heat inputs on your tank by getting lower wattage pumps, your heaters simply have to run more to compensate. (Thanks to #2)

You would have to do a little homework with a KillAWatt (~$20) to see if you really stand to gain anything at all.

Usually the big savings is being able to dial back or shut off a chiller or switching from high-powered lights.

If it were me, I'd definitely switch to a quality submersible AC pump for my return.....but I'm not sure I'd be in a rush if the existing pump is in fine condition. The submersible would be the on-hand backup....I might even plumb it in now, in advance, so it's ready to roll at a moment's notice. Right, @bwmalloy?

(And one extra good thing about a $50 return pump – it's easy to afford keeping a backup pump around. Any pump will fail someday and that someday is guaranteed not to be at a good time to find a replacement.)

2¢

Liquid360 · Apr 28, 2017

DEF the L1. I have the M1 on my 130g system and wish I'd bought the L1. You can always dial it down, but not up

SethOF · Apr 28, 2017

litenyaup said:
Ok so I'm going to be setting my tank back up and want a new return pump. I really wanna do the controllable vortech both for noise reduction and less power usage. My question is which would be the better choice for my system? I have a custom 190 gallon display with about a 30 gallon sump. Off my return I run UV, 2 reactors (carbon and gfo), algae reactor, and have a spare in case I decide to add something else. The pump I used while my tank was up and running was an iwaki MD 55RLT and had it dialed down quite a bit. It was rated for 1140 gph. The M1 is rated at 2000 gph and the L1 at 3100 gph. If anyone has any input on this please let me know which choice would be the best.

Here is what my under side looks like.

If you are open to it, consider other options including some newer generation AC pumps.