Vortech MP60 placement and program

powderblue14 · Aug 23, 2016

I have a 325 gallon main display and have a Vortech MP60 on both ends. My tank is 7ft long. I have been trying to grow SPS over the past year and have had a little luck. But was wondering what is the best location for the pumps and also what program is the best to use. Right now I am using the pulse mode and it ramps up to 50% intensity from around noon until 6pm and then scales down.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Anthony Wood · Aug 24, 2016

Not knowing your aquascape is going to make things hard. But I have 2 mp40 QD's on my 220g one on each side pane of glass. Each is just forward of my aquascape a tad more then 1/2 way down the 30+ in tall tank. That was the best placement for me not to create a high flow hot spot right in front of the wetside I wouldn't be able to place corals. I have mine set at one light before 75% any more and the hot spot gets to large but creates the perfect flow in the tank for my all SPS 220g. But in order to provide enough flow for the colony packed tank it will eventually become the mp40's would be perfect at 100% but that would create to large of a hot spot. So ill be investing into either 2 gyre's or 2 mp10's in the future to fill in the dead spots and fill in the remaining amount of flow in the tank.

Idk if your SPS is dieing from water quality, swinging parameters, lights, other variables in general. But you asked for powerhead placement so I won't talk about the other variables out of consideration. So here you go my best way of explaining how I did water flow.

To clarify put the power high enough to create good random turbulent flow in the center. But low enough that you don't create large hot spots on the ends where you can't place corals. If you find you can't get the flow in the center and back corners of the tank where you want without creating a large unusable space for corals it's time to invest into other smaller vortechs or gyre's to fill in the missing flow. Hope this helps and I have mine on whatever the random mode is I forget what ecotech labels it as.

mcarroll · Aug 24, 2016

powderblue14 said:
I have a 325 gallon main display and have a Vortech MP60 on both ends. My tank is 7ft long. I have been trying to grow SPS over the past year and have had a little luck. But was wondering what is the best location for the pumps and also what program is the best to use. Right now I am using the pulse mode and it ramps up to 50% intensity from around noon until 6pm and then scales down.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I think you'll want pumps with more reach for a tank that long. Try one or more Tunze 6105's - or any of their larger models. The difference should be like night and day.

powderblue14 · Aug 24, 2016

Thank you very much for your replies. I know its a difficult question to answer as there are many variables in play. Here is a older picture of my setup, with 1 MP60 on each side. I originally started with them basically pointing at each other. Then I noticed a lot of flow in the middle where they were colliding. So I moved one more towards the front of the tank and the other a little towards the back. Not sure if this is the best way to position them. My SPS are not dying, but they don't appear to be flourishing either so I just thought I would get everyone else's opinion. My water parameters are fairly good(below) so I believe it is down to flow and lighting, which I use Radions.

PH - 8.3
KH-9
Nitrate - 5-10
Phosphate - .02
Calcium - 440
Salinity - 1.026
Temp - average 78.1 - 78.7

mcarroll · Aug 24, 2016

Possibly flow AND lighting.

Even so the tank is looking nice!!

Have you measured the output on your lights? It's conceivable that you're over- or under-lighting some corals.

If you don't have a meter, download a $free [HASHTAG]#lux[/HASHTAG] [HASHTAG]#meter[/HASHTAG] app for your smartphone's camera. The app uses ther camera's light meter and makes some software calculations to make it work like a regular lux meter. "Galactica luxmeter" for IOS, for one example. A $15 handheld lux meter is much better....safer to use around a tank of water too!

Google for the "LX-1010B"...that seems to be the model you find at most places and it works well. There are other similar ones though. Get than app first so you can get some readings tonight though!

See what you get at the water surface for peak values around the tank surface....there are probably multiple peaks. Check back here with your readings!

Are you lighting the tank through glass/acrylic panels? Try to get readings at the water level under a panel if you can do it safely. Also get a reading right above the panel.

(Tell me if I'm interpreting the photo incorrectly!)

reefeqmover · Aug 24, 2016

Just flow wise, I dont think its enough. I run 2x mp60. But also 2x mp40 on the back panel and added 2x gyre 150 to the ends as well. I finally think its enough flow.

powderblue14 · Aug 24, 2016

Thank you very much I have had this tank up and running for about 2 years now. Before this I ran a 150gl and a 90gl.

You are interpreting it correctly. The top is acrylic and there are 3 openings in the top which is where I tried to position my lights. Those openings are covered with a window screen frame and a thin clear netting.

I have a biotek marine par meter I had been using. I will get it out and take some values and post back. Thanks for your help!

powderblue14 · Aug 24, 2016

Wow reefeqmover that is a lot of flow. How big is your tank? What mode and intensity do you run your vortechs on? I am assuming you have this much flow for SPS?

mcarroll · Aug 25, 2016

I see $1700 worth of pumps in that tank right now. I'm almost positive the tank is "underserved" for flow considering that number.

Consider that a trio of the new 6150's is only $1000, and they come with a 5 year warranty and can be hidden anywhere in the tank - even within the rock work.

For the amount you have invested presently you could have five Tunze 6105's. (You wouldn't need that many though.)

I'd seriously consider one Tunze pump or the other, or a combo of them, as replacements for your current flow hardware.

If you went with four 6105's, you could consider hiding two of them within your rocks using a couple of these:

I'd play with the Tunze's before adding the rocks though...they are very flexible so can usually be hidden pretty well anyway. No requirement for them to sit up in view like the Vortechs.

mcarroll · Aug 25, 2016

powderblue14 said:
Thank you very much I have had this tank up and running for about 2 years now. Before this I ran a 150gl and a 90gl.

You are interpreting it correctly. The top is acrylic and there are 3 openings in the top which is where I tried to position my lights. Those openings are covered with a window screen frame and a thin clear netting.

I have a biotek marine par meter I had been using. I will get it out and take some values and post back. Thanks for your help!

I'm guessing the light under the mesh is dimmer than expected, but OK since it's right under the fixtures. I'm guessing that the acrylic between the holes gets dirty with salt spray and algae quickly so light under those areas is likely to be very low....it's also on the edge of the fixture's range, which has a lot of light at a high angle of incidence, so a lot of it would reflect anyway. Add in the dirt and there could be hardly any light getting down to those middle zones between the lights.

I await some PAR readings!

Take some readings before scrubbing up the acrylic as well as after!

powderblue14 · Aug 28, 2016

And of course when I need to use my par meter it doesn't work. Hahah. Trying to trouble shoot it and update the firmware. But never that easy. Sorry for not responding sooner with the PAR readings.

mcarroll · Aug 28, 2016

Try one of the many free lux meter apps!

powderblue14 · Aug 31, 2016

Ok finally.....here are my PAR readings. At the water line under netting color 680. At water line under acrylic top 645. At my sunset milli 268, Miyagi tort 285, red planet 230, green goblin 260, and green spongodes 390.

dragon99 · Sep 1, 2016

Awesome tank! Personally, based on those PAR numbers I don't think flow is the issue. Maybe lower the lights a bit and make sure the SPS are directly under the Radions.

https://reefbuilders.com/2015/09/19/grow-colorul-sps-corals/
The general consensus is that a PAR of 450-650 umol is good to maximize the color for most of our sps.

Or, http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2006/1/lines/view

powderblue14 · Sep 1, 2016

Thank you very much. I really appreciate the articles and the advice on the lights. My current light program has the intensity maxing out at 80% , so would you still suggest lowering the lights or just increasing the intensity more?

dragon99 · Sep 2, 2016

I'd start by increasing the intensity (slowly, over a couple weeks) and re-measuring PAR. Then depending on the #'s your getting (and the corals response) you can look at lowering the lights an inch or two.

fab · Sep 2, 2016

Lowering the lights can really make your light spread become "peaky", increasing intensity directly below the lights in hilly patterns where the hills (higher PAR) are taller but narrower with wider valleys (lower PAR) between them.

mcarroll · Sep 6, 2016

Getting back to the original problem of having no luck with SPS....

30,000-40,000 lux peaks is not a problem that keeps someone from having luck with SPS. Or I don't see how it would be.

Most of those corals were getting around 18,000 lux....with the Monti getting closer to 25,000-30,000 lux.

Maybe @powderblue14 could tell us more about what he means by "no luck"?

powderblue14 · Sep 6, 2016

I am just not getting any growth on anything but my green goblin, purple stylopora, and hammer (have plenty of that). So I was trying to determine if it is just a lack of patience on my part or if I was doing something wrong with my equipment or parameters. Several of the corals I have had for 6-12 months and they really have not grown but don't appear to be dead. Such as my sunset milli.

mcarroll · Sep 6, 2016

I don't think lighting is the issue. Everything I can see in the tank photo looks pretty darned good. You have nice coraline growth!

However, your temperature is on the low side....try taking it up a degree for a week or two and see if there's any response. If not, take it up to 81º-82º one degree at a time like that.

Nutrients seem good from the NO3 and PO4 numbers. Are those numbers fair averages, or are they high/low?

Fluctuating alkalinity can stunt growth – how stable has that been?

The happiness of those red mushrooms and Euphyllia in the center of the tank tells me flow still needs to be under suspicion. Certainly from the point of view I mentioned earlier in the thread, but I think you have photographic evidence as well.

Any chance you could shoot a couple short, simple cell phone vids of a close-up of:

The sand under/in front of those red mushrooms
One or more of those frags you mentioned from a dimmer zone
That Monti frag you mentioned that was getting higher light

I'm looking for indications of flow....rolling bits across the sand, algae waving, anything.

(Posting to YouTube or similar and sharing the link here is the easiest way...the "Media" button in the editor says they allow media links from: