Warning on overdosing Cupramine

[Ridgeback1]

This is 100% operator error, but I figured posting about it might be useful to others who might be as negligent as I was. I am a very experienced aquarist (had a 375 gallon FOWLR tank for 15 years) and earlier this year got back into it after a few years off because of work travel. I decided to do it right in every way--including running the full Humblefish quarantine procedure for every single fish. I set up two QT tanks--a 10 gallon and a 20 gallon. I bought only captive-bred fish. And proceeded to inadvertantly kill most of them...because I used Cupramine and instead of reading the Cupramine label which says to dose no more than 0.50 ppm, I blindly followed the quarantine procedure instructions which call for >2.00 ppm copper...using Coppersafe.

I overdosed at 5X. Most of the fish died quickly (within a week). I couldn't figure it out and blamed suppliers. So I tried three different suppliers. Same result each time. I was literally yesterday about to give up and switch to fresh water. I was already researching nature aquariums. Then on a whim I read the Cupramine label and the lightbulb went on. I have three remaining fish in the QT tank and they were hurting--very little movement and not eating. I quickly got the copper levels down to 0.50 ppm and, lo and behold, they now are swimming happily all around and eating like crazy (others before I tried moving to the other QT tank without copper out of a random attempt to try anything and many of them died--so there is no guarantee that a copper-overdosed fish will survive even when removed from the copper...the damage is sometimes done and irreversible apparently).

I feel terrible for the fish (and money) losses and am kicking myself. But I hope highlighting my mistake might help someone else avoid it.

 

[vetteguy53081]

This is 100% operator error, but I figured posting about it might be useful to others who might be as negligent as I was. I am a very experienced aquarist (had a 375 gallon FOWLR tank for 15 years) and earlier this year got back into it after a few years off because of work travel. I decided to do it right in every way--including running the full Hemdahl quarantine procedure for every single fish. I set up two QT tanks--a 10 gallon and a 20 gallon. I bought only captive-bred fish. And proceeded to inadvertantly kill most of them...because I used Cupramine and instead of reading the Cupramine label which says to dose no more than 0.50 ppm, I blindly followed the quarantine procedure instructions which call for >2.00 ppm copper...using Coppersafe.

I overdosed at 5X. Most of the fish died quickly (within a week). I couldn't figure it out and blamed suppliers. So I tried three different suppliers. Same result each time. I was literally yesterday about to give up and switch to fresh water. I was already researching nature aquariums. Then on a whim I read the Cupramine label and the lightbulb went on. I have three remaining fish in the QT tank and they were hurting--very little movement and not eating. I quickly got the copper levels down to 0.50 ppm and, lo and behold, they now are swimming happily all around and eating like crazy (others before I tried moving to the other QT tank without copper out of a random attempt to try anything and many of them died--so there is no guarantee that a copper-overdosed fish will survive even when removed from the copper...the damage is sometimes done and irreversible apparently).

I feel terrible for the fish (and money) losses and am kicking myself. But I hope highlighting my mistake might help someone else avoid it.

Important is to know the levels and monitor with a reliable copper test kit

Ionic copper needs to be at least 0.18
Cupramine needs to be at 0.50
Coppersafe needs to be at 2.5 max

 

[Ridgeback1]

Yep. That was my mistake. I didn't notice that Cupramine needed to be dosed at 1/5th the level of Coppersafe (which is what is listed in the quarantine procedure). I tested regularly with a Hanna kit. So I knew I was at >2 ppm. I did it on purpose. It wasn't lack of testing--it was not realizing the level was too high for the product I was using.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

Oh man, that is rough. I'm sorry to hear about your learning experience. I keep multiple kinds of copper on hand, So have used a sharpie to write the concentration requirements on the bottle so it's very clear.

 

[SaJon]

This is 100% operator error, but I figured posting about it might be useful to others who might be as negligent as I was. I am a very experienced aquarist (had a 375 gallon FOWLR tank for 15 years) and earlier this year got back into it after a few years off because of work travel. I decided to do it right in every way--including running the full Humblefish quarantine procedure for every single fish. I set up two QT tanks--a 10 gallon and a 20 gallon. I bought only captive-bred fish. And proceeded to inadvertantly kill most of them...because I used Cupramine and instead of reading the Cupramine label which says to dose no more than 0.50 ppm, I blindly followed the quarantine procedure instructions which call for >2.00 ppm copper...using Coppersafe.

I overdosed at 5X. Most of the fish died quickly (within a week). I couldn't figure it out and blamed suppliers. So I tried three different suppliers. Same result each time. I was literally yesterday about to give up and switch to fresh water. I was already researching nature aquariums. Then on a whim I read the Cupramine label and the lightbulb went on. I have three remaining fish in the QT tank and they were hurting--very little movement and not eating. I quickly got the copper levels down to 0.50 ppm and, lo and behold, they now are swimming happily all around and eating like crazy (others before I tried moving to the other QT tank without copper out of a random attempt to try anything and many of them died--so there is no guarantee that a copper-overdosed fish will survive even when removed from the copper...the damage is sometimes done and irreversible apparently).

I feel terrible for the fish (and money) losses and am kicking myself. But I hope highlighting my mistake might help someone else avoid it.

Hey. So sorry for your losses. I know that feeling oh too well. Thank you so much for your honesty. Takes good character to share an experience like this. There are many lessons to be learned and taught in this hobby. If we had more people like you sharing the bad as well as the good, you could have saved me alot of money over the years for sure. By sharing you may have saved someone else from making the same mistake. Keep moving forward and Happy Reefing

 

[MnFish1]

This will sound harsh. In every case - dosing anything FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS. And sorry

 

[MnFish1]

This is 100% operator error, but I figured posting about it might be useful to others who might be as negligent as I was. I am a very experienced aquarist (had a 375 gallon FOWLR tank for 15 years) and earlier this year got back into it after a few years off because of work travel. I decided to do it right in every way--including running the full Humblefish quarantine procedure for every single fish. I set up two QT tanks--a 10 gallon and a 20 gallon. I bought only captive-bred fish. And proceeded to inadvertantly kill most of them...because I used Cupramine and instead of reading the Cupramine label which says to dose no more than 0.50 ppm, I blindly followed the quarantine procedure instructions which call for >2.00 ppm copper...using Coppersafe.

I overdosed at 5X. Most of the fish died quickly (within a week). I couldn't figure it out and blamed suppliers. So I tried three different suppliers. Same result each time. I was literally yesterday about to give up and switch to fresh water. I was already researching nature aquariums. Then on a whim I read the Cupramine label and the lightbulb went on. I have three remaining fish in the QT tank and they were hurting--very little movement and not eating. I quickly got the copper levels down to 0.50 ppm and, lo and behold, they now are swimming happily all around and eating like crazy (others before I tried moving to the other QT tank without copper out of a random attempt to try anything and many of them died--so there is no guarantee that a copper-overdosed fish will survive even when removed from the copper...the damage is sometimes done and irreversible apparently).

I feel terrible for the fish (and money) losses and am kicking myself. But I hope highlighting my mistake might help someone else avoid it.

Thanks for reporting. I WOULD MAKE absolutely sure it was operator error

 

[Ridgeback1]

Thanks for reporting. I WOULD MAKE absolutely sure it was operator error

It was operator error. I am sure. I used Cupramine and Hanna tested at 2.20 PPM. Symptoms on the fish were consistent with what I read (too late) would be copper overdose (trouble breathing, etc.). My assumption was that all copper products were the same and...I was obviously wrong.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

It was operator error. I am sure. I used Cupramine and Hanna tested at 2.20 PPM. Symptoms on the fish were consistent with what I read (too late) would be copper overdose (trouble breathing, etc.). My assumption was that all copper products were the same and...I was obviously wrong.

Sorry to hear. Cupramine has some other issues (it doesn't read well on the Hanna HR tester when dosing at < 0.50, and adding ammonia remover while dosing it can release a toxic amount of copper).

Jay

 

[Ridgeback1]

Sorry to hear. Cupramine has some other issues (it doesn't read well on the Hanna HR tester when dosing at < 0.50, and adding ammonia remover while dosing it can release a toxic amount of copper).

Jay

Good to know. I'm abandoning it (which is not to say the fault was with the product--it was with me) and have ordered Copper Power.

 

[Manny’s Reef]

This is 100% operator error, but I figured posting about it might be useful to others who might be as negligent as I was. I am a very experienced aquarist (had a 375 gallon FOWLR tank for 15 years) and earlier this year got back into it after a few years off because of work travel. I decided to do it right in every way--including running the full Humblefish quarantine procedure for every single fish. I set up two QT tanks--a 10 gallon and a 20 gallon. I bought only captive-bred fish. And proceeded to inadvertantly kill most of them...because I used Cupramine and instead of reading the Cupramine label which says to dose no more than 0.50 ppm, I blindly followed the quarantine procedure instructions which call for >2.00 ppm copper...using Coppersafe.

I overdosed at 5X. Most of the fish died quickly (within a week). I couldn't figure it out and blamed suppliers. So I tried three different suppliers. Same result each time. I was literally yesterday about to give up and switch to fresh water. I was already researching nature aquariums. Then on a whim I read the Cupramine label and the lightbulb went on. I have three remaining fish in the QT tank and they were hurting--very little movement and not eating. I quickly got the copper levels down to 0.50 ppm and, lo and behold, they now are swimming happily all around and eating like crazy (others before I tried moving to the other QT tank without copper out of a random attempt to try anything and many of them died--so there is no guarantee that a copper-overdosed fish will survive even when removed from the copper...the damage is sometimes done and irreversible apparently).

I feel terrible for the fish (and money) losses and am kicking myself. But I hope highlighting my mistake might help someone else avoid it.

I am so glad I read this. I was also under the assumption the cupramine needed to be up to 2.0 ppm. Fortunately I started really slow at .11 ppm and today raised to .22 ppm. Thanks for the info.

 

[Ridgeback1]

I am so glad I read this. I was also under the assumption the cupramine needed to be up to 2.0 ppm. Fortunately I started really slow at .11 ppm and today raised to .22 ppm. Thanks for the info.

So happy that my mistake helped someone. As a followup, this was absolutely the issue (overdosing Cupramine) as I'm doing another quarantine using Copper Power (at proper dosage) with a new set of fish and the fish are coming through with flying colors--eating like crazy while in QT and not a single fish has died or looked ill. (Big fan of QT, btw...I got my AquaBiomics test results back on my DT and I don't have ANY parasite organisms...I attribute that to rigorous quarantining before I put anything in the DT).