Well Water Chewing through DI Resin

[JordanM]

I was thinking of putting it there just so i know when the silicabuster is depleted with the color change since the others dont change colors when depleted and i dont want to have to monitor the tds continually.

 

[JordanM]

Using this calculator
https://www.hamzasreef.com/Contents/Calculators/CO2DIDepletion.php

and entering your numbers, we get

If the water is 15 ppm TDS, the % consumed by CO2 is 13%.
If the water is 30 ppm TDS, the % consumed by CO2 is 7%.

So you won't see a huge improvement by degassing the well water (about a 10% DI lifespan increase).

Randy, So you would say not to waste my time with the degassing? Will the spectrapure resins be better at dealing with the CO2 and not depleting as fast?

 

[Admann]

I recently upgraded my RO/DI to a 6 stage from 4 and bought a new 75 GPD membrane. The stages are as follows, 1 micron sediment (going to 0.5 micron after I use up all my 1 micron on hand), AquaFX Chloramine blaster, and a 5 micron carbon block. This sends on average 380 TDS to my (new) DOW 75 GPD membrane. The membrane sends 15 to 17 TDS to my seperate color changing cation and anion DI cartridges delivering 0 out to my bucket. I also use a booster pump the "Smart Buddy". This setup changed my time to make 5 gallons in 2 hours to 45 minutes. Way over the rated 75 GPD spec for the membrane with no measurable chlorine or chloramines.
There are some differences between my situation and yours. I have city water as opposed to your well water.
Having spent a great deal of my career treating water from the ground, including saltwater, it is a fact that CO2 in water can have very significant effects on the elements (filters, resin, membrane, etc.) used in filtration. CO2 can be bad enough that when in solution with water it will create carbonic acid that will eat steel if in a high enough concentration, we're talking about less than 100 PPM. The only way I know to get rid of CO2 in solution is chemically, through time exposed to air or through aeration. I wish I new of some sort of CO2 scrubber for aquarists (chemical or mechanical) for people that might have your problem, if CO2 is the problem. I know this was long winded but I am a really detail oriented person (my wife calls it anal retentive, among other things)
Happy Reefing.

 

[mfinn]

Randy, So you would say not to waste my time with the degassing? Will the spectrapure resins be better at dealing with the CO2 and not depleting as fast?

I know you asked Randy specifically, but IMO doing the degassing looks like it would be a pita and add to a already big list of equipment and space.
I have some co2 in my water, but I went with the highest rate of rejection membrane I could get and use bulk resin.

 

[JordanM]

Thanks for both of your input. Looks like i should be getting the new resin and membrane on Friday so I will have to give it a try next week.

 

[JordanM]

I am re-plumbing the system right now and ran across this fitting on the output of the RO housing. It looks like some sort of filter 1/8"npt to 1/4" push connect. Should I leave this or replace it with a straight 90 fitting without the filter? This fitting was on the clean water coming out of the RO.

I also did not find any restrictor of any kind unless that afr is acting as a restrictor on the waste line coming off the the RO. I looked for a capillary as well and did not find anything.
This was setup as a dual RO membrane in series 150 gallon per day (aka two 75gpd in a series). I am going to just go to the one 90gpd spectrapure for now and remove the second RO membrane.

 

[theMeat]

What is “afr”?

That looks like a one way valve of some sort. Blow through it both ways. If you can only blow one way, that’s what it is

Flow restrictor might be in line. Take off the waste line from membrane and look inside tube

 

[JordanM]

What is “afr”?

That looks like a one way valve of some sort. Blow through it both ways. If you can only blow one way, that’s what it is

Flow restrictor might be in line. Take off the waste line from membrane and look inside tube

I could not blow through it in any direction. Also i looked inside the line and there is nothing. afr has to do with the pump. I think it performs a flush every now and then or something like that. BRS mentioned it here at 3:38 :

 

[theMeat]

Remembering....
That is a check valve that comes on BRS 150 gpd upgrade kit

You should have a flow restrictor, if not that’s an issue, or something/ some kind of design I never saw and don’t understand how it could work. Would certainly explain low product output and your membrane lasting 5 years

 

[JordanM]

Remembering....
That is a check valve that comes on BRS 150 gpd upgrade kit

You should have a flow restrictor, if not that’s an issue, or something/ some kind of design I never saw and don’t understand how it could work. Would certainly explain low product output and your membrane lasting 5 years

Ya, that is what i am guessing that there is no restrictor. I will replace the waste lines just in case I missed it somewhere and install the new capillary. Should i just leave that check valve or remove it?

Also, there is alot of rust color inside the RO housing on the outside walls. Should I be concerned about this or no because the product water will exit through the center. Im guessing the only concern would be to get a good seal with the new membrane, maybe put a little Molykote 111 on the rubber seal of the membrane to ensure it seals well against the sides of the housing.

 

[theMeat]

If you use a capillary, get the right color and do this step
Could use a regular type flow restrictor, or the one with the flush valve on it as you ordered, the membrane won’t mind either way.
The “afv” does an auto flush if it’s installed correctly btw, so another flush valve is redundant

Could use a brush to get at some of the rust but unless it’s caked on wouldn’t worry too much
No molycoat. If need be use a lil spit to get it to slide in smooth. The pressure pushes on the seal and it will seal fine

Would leave the check valve on, no harm

 

[JordanM]

Thanks for the help! This is the restrictor I got:
https://www.marinedepot.com/Flow_Re...ystems-Captive_Purity-RO1215-FIRORAFR-vi.html

Will it come with a chart to say how long to cut it?

 

[theMeat]

You’re welcome, that’s what makes this site such a gem

Depends on pressure
Watch the vid, it explains and tells how long to cut

 

[JordanM]

You’re welcome, that’s what makes this site such a gem

Depends on pressure
Watch the vid, it explains and tells how long to cut

Ok I found the chart from spectrapure. What waste to product ratio should I target with this membrane to get the lowest tds and I don’t care about how much waste is produced since it’s well water?

 

[theMeat]

4 to 1

 

[mfinn]

Ok I found the chart from spectrapure. What waste to product ratio should I target with this membrane to get the lowest tds and I don’t care about how much waste is produced since it’s well water?

I went with the best spectrapure ro membrane and am getting close to 2:1, which they say their membrane is made for.
They also use a capillary flow restrictor that is 471ml. I wanted to use a flow restrictor/by pass valve combo so I got the BRS 550ml one and then put a valve on the waste line that restricts the flow a little more until I got it down to 475-480ml.

 

[JordanM]

I dumped out the DI resin yesterday and left it open to atmosphere. This morning I woke up and looked at it and the color is back to being blue. Is this normal or could this have been caused from the potential CO2 off gassing from the resin into the atmosphere over night?

 

[JordanM]

Do any of you have any opinions on this:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/slow-cycling-120-gallon-with-raw-shrimp-and-mb7.385357/

 

[JordanM]

I need your input again with the system. I have a 5um then booster pump, then 1um and 0.5um sediment filter before it goes to the DI which is a maxcap, silicabuster and BRS combo. I bought the 75-100GPD capillary from marinedepot and after testing the waste to product ratio i came up with 700/60 or 11.6:1 ratio. This is without trimming any of the capillary down. I remembered the guy from spectrapure telling me something the other day though that i could fine tine this with a block/needle valve so i added this in the waste line after the capillary to tune the waste down more and got it to a 7.2:1 ratio that almost maxes the needle valve out. If i turn it any further it may just shut off the water completely.

1. So my first question is should this needle valve go before or after the capillary? I think it should go before and not how i have it currently because then the capillary is not serving much of a purpose as the needle valve is really performing almost all of the regulating.

2. Question two. I have the Y that splits into a flush valve( block valve) and the capillary. Im guessing the needle valve and capillary should go in one of these lines and the flush valve portion bypass them. Not how i currently have them because when i switch it to flush it doesn't do much as them needle valve is also regulating this down slower.

3. You monitor waste to product ratio after the membrane but the DI Resin is also going to slow the flow down further will it not?

I have the bypass in line to go to waste instead of the DI and when i have this set to waste i am getting 75 PSI before the membrane but when I switch it to the DI i am getting 80 psi. It seems that my product is alot slower after the DI then it was after the membrane was.

Also is the silicabuster supposed to smell like sulfur?

I have attached some pictures of the setup and circled the capillary and flush section as well as the needle valve down further.

Thank you all for your help.

 

[JordanM]

Also forgot to mention the tds is 2ppm out of membrane and is 300 going in so hopefully this di last a lot longer!