What Pump would you suggest?

[JoshH]

So with my new tank ordered, for the first time I will have my sump in the basement, which presents the age old issue of pumping water 10+ feet up. I had originally settled on a Sicce SDC 9.0 but upon reading there flow charts I'm pretty concerned about the type of flow I will be getting at the outlet.

I do realize AC pumps would be the easiest route but would like to try a DC to save a little on power. I also however don't want to shell out $2200 for an Abyzz. So hoping to find a little middle ground on this.

For the particulars, the pump will have to push water horizontally 10 feet and Vertically another 11 orso. Plumbing will all be wide radius (2' curved) PVC with only one 90° elbow where it meets the bulkhead of the tank itself.

The tank will be 110 Gallons and I would like atleast 10 times turnover so 1100+ GPH.

So for those who have dealt with this, I'd love to hear your experience and suggestions

 

[cracker]

Josh I don't know. A big one ?

 

[JoshH]

Josh I don't know. A big one ?

Lol VERY helpful It's more a question targeted to those with basement sumps and there thoughts maybe even SDC 9.0 Owners who can confirm the flow rates with head pressure, according to Sicces flow chart the pump SHOULD be able to provide what I need but I feel the flow charts might be exaggerated...

 

[cracker]

Sorry that was SmartA of me.

 

[JoshH]

Sorry that was SmartA of me.

Lol All in good fun, and you aren't wrong either

 

[JoshH]

Going to give this a morning bump

 

[jda]

Forget about DC pumps for this. The only ones that can handle the head are not only the same wattage as an AC pump, but also quite expensive.

You thinking external or internal?

If internal, look at the right sized/head Laguna Max Flo - I used a 2900 on my basement system (15 feet, or so) and it pumped as much as the my AGA MegaFlow could drain (about 1000-1200 GPH at 3/4" vinyl flex line (no elbows either)), but I did not have the Horizontal run. You can get even larger ones than this. They are not huge power eaters... mine was around 110 watts, or so. These pumps say that they have a 15' head stop, but can do quite a bit more if you keep the line smaller.

If external, then Iwaki, PanWorld, GenX are all time-tested-for-decades pumps. These are great options. Iwaki 55 might be OK, but probably only 900 GPH, or so. Iwaki 70 could handle the flow, but will be over 300 watts.

I would NOT use 2" pipe for the return. Use the same size as the outlet of your pump - 3/4, 1" or whatever... smaller will have more head and probably flow.

 

[jda]

If it is not too late, put your basement sump up on a stand. No only are the easier to work on, you can siphon debris from the sump and also have less head height to the second floor. Sometimes three or four feet makes all the difference when pumping and can save you 100 watts each and every hour on a pump.

 

[JoshH]

Forget about DC pumps for this. The only ones that can handle the head are not only the same wattage as an AC pump, but also quite expensive.

You thinking external or internal?

If internal, look at the right sized/head Laguna Max Flo - I used a 2900 on my basement system (15 feet, or so) and it pumped as much as the my AGA MegaFlow could drain (about 1000-1200 GPH at 3/4" vinyl flex line (no elbows either)), but I did not have the Horizontal run. You can get even larger ones than this. They are not huge power eaters... mine was around 110 watts, or so. These pumps say that they have a 15' head stop, but can do quite a bit more if you keep the line smaller.

If external, then Iwaki, PanWorld, GenX are all time-tested-for-decades pumps. These are great options. Iwaki 55 might be OK, but probably only 900 GPH, or so. Iwaki 70 could handle the flow, but will be over 300 watts.

I would NOT use 2" pipe for the return. Use the same size as the outlet of your pump - 3/4, 1" or whatever... smaller will have more head and probably flow.

If it is not too late, put your basement sump up on a stand. No only are the easier to work on, you can siphon debris from the sump and also have less head height to the second floor. Sometimes three or four feet makes all the difference when pumping and can save you 100 watts each and every hour on a pump.

Perfect Advice and exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for. No 2" plumbing, anywhere (the plumbing will be bent with large curves 2' radius orso if that was a misunderstanding from my first post) , I'm pretty set on a 1" Return but depending on the pump that might change. I'm flexible on external or internal and the whole sump will be on a bench, nothing is built yet, tank won't be coming for a few months still so lots of time to plan things out which is why I'm here asking these questions now.

 

[jda]

The other awesome thing about basement sumps is that there is no height requirement for skimmers. This allows you to choose from some of the best-of-breed skimmers like LifeReef or other tall setups which oft don't fit under stands.

Do yourself a favor and get a used Mag 24 or Mag 36...and the right fittings to hook up to your return line. Just use it mix water, or do water changes (or put it on the shelf) and have it around in case your main pump has a failure. They are very powerful pumps that are also very versatile. They use some wattage, but can also handle the head pressure, so they are good to have as a backup pump. These can do well as a mostly-reliable return pump, but you can probably find one with less wattage that is not as noisy (mags tend to get noisy for me after a while) like a Laguna.

 

[Craig Stuart - Reefscaper]

HI Josh, great question and topic here....

Achieving the flow rates you are looking for at only 11feet head is not a big ask with DC pumps.

Sure using an old school gas guzzling pump will do the job really well and reliably.... but the question you asked is if you could do it using a DC pump or pumps.

Both the abyzz, vortech and reef octopus various range for this kind of project are all fine.

Regardless of weather or not you use a DC or AC pump/s to hit your 10x .... it is always best to have 2 return pumps working together to return your tank water from the sump rather than one. That gives you great redundnacy in the case of a failure. Often works out more cost effective that way too.

Many forget that 2 or 3 pumps can run in either series or parallel... It isn't often offered up as a solution, typically "bigger pump is better" attitudes prevail.

But when working out pump performance requirements, remember that you don't necessarily need 2 return lines and that you can ad flow rates of 2 pumps plumbed in parallel or ad the head height of 2 pumps plumbed in series.

A word of warning there however, you may loose the advantage of redundancy with 2 or 3 pumps run in series if an impeller housing seizes. But you will get the water where you need it at the flow rate you want while pumps work well.

DC pumps like the Iwaki, PanWorld, GenX.... will punch through the pressure you need at the flow rate you want reliably and can be plugged in and often forgotten for years. Redundancy, reliability of return of and usable pressure at the tank AC pumps still wins at the moment when higher lifts are needed.


Enjoy!

 

[theMeat]

Dc pumps will work fine for 6 mos a year then flow rate will fall off. Get a pump hi pressure rated, buy it once and be done. Like panworld or iwaki

 

[ca1ore]

When you start introducing significant head pressure to a DC return pump, operating savings mostly evaporate anyhow (plus something like the vectra M1 was pathetic at high head; I tested mine ...... fail). If you use one of the online calaclators, you’ll probably end up with somewhere around 15’ of adjusted head pressure. I run about the same on my system. I would have to disagree with not upsizing the pipe. On my system, when using a PanWorld 200 pushing through 1’” PVC I got about 950; when I upsized to 1 1/2” flex PVC, I got almost 1,200. I now use a PW250 and get about 1,600 GPH (4x turnover).