Whats the next trend in the hobby?

[lapin]

I will get back to original question
The latest trend I see is "automation".
Not having to do anything to your tank seems to be the growing trend.

 

[RC Corals]

Automation is definitely the trend, but the problem with automation is that the protect things from failure of automation it takes duplication of that automation or more automation to protect the tank from the automation itself. Failsafes are a rabbit hole that really has no end depending how "safe" you choose to be.

Personally I do not mind being able to monitor things, and even testing (though I currently am not doing automated monitoring/testing), but I'm just not comfortable putting automation in to much of control.

 

[Stigigemla]

When I saw this thread I hoped the new trend would something about animals.
And I certainly hope that automation will not be the new trend for beginners. It is dangerous because it leads to getting sloppy with the daily maintenance like checking that every fish feel good and are eating well. Checking that no coral is being burnt by its neighbour. Or is buried under sand.

 

[Paul B]

@Paul B are you saying that if you're upgrading to a new tank you can use the live rock and sand from you're old tank? Because I'm trying to get an upgrade for Christmas and go from a 20g to a 70g, and I'd like to keep my rock because I spent like $150 on it. Sand was a bit cheaper but I'm thinking of getting new sand, live black hawaiian. In conclusion, can I use my old rock with new live rock?

Yes of course. I still have rocks and original gravel in my tank from the 70s. I had to add more because my tank went from a 40 gallon to a 100 gallon to a 125 gallon in 50 years.
I moved it 3 times and just put everything in vats for the move.
I don't like sand, I use dolomite gravel.

You just summed up about 60% of reefers on this forum, who insist that if you arent running a barebottom sps dosing tank with fiji live rock they gathered themselves, ecotech wavemakers, kessils, apex, etc etc, then you arent as good as they are

I don't even know what any of those things are.
As I said, I am as old school as you can get. I started when the hobby started and you don't need any of that stuff.

I collected most of my rock SCUBA diving. You are not allowed to do that now or they shoot you. I bleached it in the hotel room because we didn't use live rock in those days. Most of it over the years I replaced with rocks I built out of cement just because I like it better but there is still a lot of real rock in there.
A good portion of my rock I also collected in New York water just for the bacteria.
I don't have any ecotech, wavemakers, kessils, apex, quarantine, hospital tanks, medications, dosers , UV sterilizers, etc.

 

[samnaz]

My baby octopus specific tank.

Tell me everything! Is there a build thread?

 

[mort]

I don't get why so many people still have new tanks and can't get good rock. What happened to the rock you bought 10 years ago? You set up a tank and it matures along with you. What happened to all the tanks that were started 5, 10, or 20 years ago when live rock was cheap and plentiful? The rock doesn't evaporate.

I still have the rock I started with and it's why I don't want to shut the tank down as it would be impossible to get any new rock locally. The rock that comes in now that they call live is either just dense base rock that once met a bacteria somewhere or supposed rock from a reef that they have jet washed all the life off it.
There is a movement in the hobby that says all hitchhikers are bad and that we shouldn't risk getting an aiptasia on anything we add, so shops have just followed that logic and made things easier on themselves.

Man made rock/quarried rock is fine but they attach greater "environmental" credentials to it than I believe it is due. That might be different in the US but here in the uk we still have to ship the rock in from half the world away, for the most part, and that's after its been manufactured. We also get the standard line that live rock is evil as it destroys the reefs when in fact it is sustainable because it's seen as a resource and if we don't buy it then the locals still use it for building houses or aggregate for roads. I'd rather pay someone a premium to harvest some nice fresh living rock than let it be destroyed for nothing.

As to where the old rock goes, well I ran a lfs and people give up the hobby pretty quickly as they just don't have any patience, they sell their rock on and the new person inherits their problems, which is then passed onto the rest before finally someone just makes a rockery. We also live in a world where as soon as a spot of hair algae erupts we get everyone advising the person to cook their rocks because they'd prefer a nice sterile white shiny rock than a healthy life encrusted rock that will probably lose the algae in a month or two with no intervention.

 

[Ippyroy]

iWhether a person uses live, dead, or manmade rock shouldn't matter. There is overwhelming proof that any and all work and can be successful. One may be better than the others on some points and they all have different points against. Instead of sitting around lamenting the past, we should be figuring out what to do today and what to do in the future. To be successful with dry rock the concept of cycling needs to change. The dry rock will be able to cycle ammonia into nitrates easily and quickly, but it will not have the bacteria film nor any microfauna that is so important to a successful tank. I cycled my dry rock for 5 months in a Brute can and ghost fed heavily the whole time. My rocks came out of the Brute covered in a bacterial slime and packed full of PO4. My PO4 was a little high after setting the tank up, it was .27. It slowly came down. I never had a bad ugly cycle other than the hard green algae that went away with time. No cyano, no GHA to speak of. I barely even had diatoms. I used dry sand and rinsed very well.
Live rock as you knew is gone. Now is the time to reconsider the cycle. Not the nitrogen cycle, but how to cycle dry rock to have the bacterial mats and microfauna that help a tank to be stable and successful. We need to learn more about the pests like bristle worms. Is there an alternative to them, like maybe spaghetti or mammias that will work. Why can't I just order some pineapple sponges? The past is history. The future is a mystery. The present is a gift and that's why it's a present.

 

[Zionas]

The next trend? Maybe a return to the tried and true methods over relatively niche methods? xD

Personally I’d like to see some of kind of cover for tanks become mandatory, a shift away from bare bottoms, more customer vetting for certain species of fish, the end of the market altogether for certain species of fish, greater hobbyist involvement in conservation, the rise of the amateur marine biologist, more automation.

More species being collected, species being collected from deeper waters and more remote regions. I’d love to see a fully mesophotic / rariphotic setup someday. A shift away from tanks stuffed with larger fish to tanks with lots of smaller fish and just a couple of large fish.

Just to name a few.

 

[Paul B]

Tell me everything! Is there a build thread?

No build thread, that was many years ago. I had a small tank, probably 10 gallons. I bought an octopus and fed it live fiddler crabs that I can easily collect by the hundreds. The octopus gave birth to many babies. They grew a little on live brine shrimp than I assume they died. I don't really remember.

As for not wanting to use real live rock because of hitch hikers, I feel that is silly. I have everything growing in my tank from brittle worms, pineapple sponges, invasive sponges, tunicates, spaghetti worms, flatworms, aiptasia, majano's, parasites like ich and velvet and Godzilla larvae.

Absolutely none of those things ever harmed anything and my tank has been thriving for fifty years. Not one problem from those things as they are natural and normal. In all cases they disappeared or shrunk in size to where they never bother anything with no help from me.

I also feel bare bottom tanks are silly as many or most of the creatures we keep like substrait. Just my opinion of course as I can't read the minds of most snails.

 

[CelestialCorals]

@Paul B are you saying that if you're upgrading to a new tank you can use the live rock and sand from you're old tank? Because I'm trying to get an upgrade for Christmas and go from a 20g to a 70g, and I'd like to keep my rock because I spent like $150 on it. Sand was a bit cheaper but I'm thinking of getting new sand, live black hawaiian. In conclusion, can I use my old rock with new live rock?

I recently started a second smaller tank, I used water, sand & rock from my DT. I also bought more live sand & rock to complete the amount I needed for my second tank which only sped up the cycle process as if I had just did a water change. Enjoy your upgrade!

 

[pseudorand]

The next trend? Maybe a return to the tried and true methods over relatively niche methods? xD

Personally I’d like to see some of kind of cover for tanks become mandatory, a shift away from bare bottoms, more customer vetting for certain species of fish, the end of the market altogether for certain species of fish, greater hobbyist involvement in conservation, the rise of the amateur marine biologist, more automation.

More species being collected, species being collected from deeper waters and more remote regions. I’d love to see a fully mesophotic / rariphotic setup someday. A shift away from tanks stuffed with larger fish to tanks with lots of smaller fish and just a couple of large fish.

Just to name a few.

In the vein both fish cruelty and conservation, I'd like to see more captive bred and aquaculture. What if we all only bought lineages of fish proven to thrive in home aquariums. No burden on the wild. Fewer fish dieing in transport and less than perfect noon tanks (like mine). Let the pros figure out which ones those are and breed them.

I planned to do only captive bred fish originally, but the selection is very limited, availability is hit or miss and the prices are much higher than wild caught for the most interesting ones.

I suppose it's a matter of scale though. I'm sure one could run a cheap and efficient breeding operation, but only if there were enough customers to justify a big one.

 

[Zionas]

I have the same wish as you and would jump at the chance to have a tank with only CB fish. In my part of the world (Asia) selections for CB fish are even more limited. I’d totally pay more money for sustainability and a hardier fish, unfortunately the average consumer is short-sighted and money oriented.

Here we pretty much only get CB Clowns and sometimes other kinds of fish. I have seen CB Blue Tangs and Foxface Los, not sure if they’re real. Some CB large angels but that’s about it.

I want to see the hobby become more balanced between business and hobbyists. Hobbyists and experts involved in the trade need to have a greater say over which species should and shouldn’t be imported.

Special provisions must be in place to vet buyers on their experience and ability to care for the fish’s needs long term.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

My thoughts on automation.

There's something to be said about learning the ropes at the beginning. I've read countless threads of people that jump in a little on the advanced side focusing a lot on automation, never learning the basics. There's nothing wrong with that except If you don't have a fundamental understanding of what automation is doing for you then you're doomed to fail. You become subservient to that piece of equipment, if it fails you're stuck behind the 8 ball.

However, there's also something to be said about starting off with a bare bones set up, it helps in many ways. The biggest that come to mind is that it forces you to be in tune with your tank and gives you the opportunity to learn the basics. As you submerge yourself in the hobby you can slowly start adding automation to do those mundane tasks to free you up for other things.

As someone said above, start out with easy corals like lps, and if you're on a budget, there's really nothing wrong with starting out with chinese black box lights and jebao pumps. That way you don't have to break the bank "keeping up with the Jones'".

I was a young E5 with a newborn when I started in this hobby, back then equipment was a lot cheaper and there wasn't pressure like there is today to start off with the best of the best.

I saved my pennies for my first mp40. I collected aluminum cans for my first bubble magus 3 head dosing pump. Fast forward to today my cup runneth over.

To sum up, automation should be an addition to your toolbox to make your life easier, and having the most expensive equipment won't make success easier. Learn the basics and I guarantee that you can handle anything thrown at you.

 

[Doctorgori]

@Paul B ”Dolomite” Paul? Now thats a blast from the past. I’m picturing a “Supreme Superking” and a rusty exposed electric motor

iWhether a person uses live, dead, or manmade rock shouldn't matter. There is overwhelming proof that any and all work and can be successful

I wouldn’t disagree as I finally got a dry rock tank going. Whats arguable is time, ease of setup and problems. Each method has its own set of issues. Dry rock tanks IME never approach the biodiversity of real rock obviously.
Definitely less macro and micro algae consumers under 1” and a lot less filter feeding tunicates, sponges et.

I dunno what the future holds but lets all hope it includes some answers to reef conservation issues and advances in animal husbandry & reproduction

 

[Ippyroy]

@Paul B ”Dolomite” Paul? Now thats a blast from the past. I’m picturing a “Supreme Superking” and a rusty exposed electric motor


I wouldn’t disagree as I finally got a dry rock tank going. Whats arguable is time, ease of setup and problems. Each method has its own set of issues. Dry rock tanks IME never approach the biodiversity of real rock obviously.
Definitely less macro and micro algae consumers under 1” and a lot less filter feeding tunicates, sponges et.

I dunno what the future holds but lets all hope it includes some answers to reef conservation issues and advances in animal husbandry & reproduction

I think the amount of time it takes can be the same. The best thing to do is as soon as you have decided to build a reef tank, get the rocks and start the cycle. With live rock in the past, the best thing to do was this as well. Patience is still the key. The NSA craze is the biggest problem I see right now. It has a lack of fish habitat and is much harder to cycle for months due to it's inability to fit in a container out of the way like a Brute can. I am thinking about trying to build one in pieces and attach it in the tank.

 

[siggy]

Media- Nutrients-additives-testing, even foods have recently expanded.
It seems that all the Hanna and automated testing , and then confirmed with ICP testing we are learning and not just guessing what are tanks need. Thats what I am seeing.... although I am half blind

 

[Paul B]

@Paul B ”Dolomite” Paul? Now thats a blast from the past. I’m picturing a “Supreme Superking” and a rusty exposed electric motor

Doctorgori Dolomite was the only thing available in 1971.
Now you can only get it in a museum or mausoleum.

It is still in my tank and I think I also had it in my brackish tank from the 60s.

I don't think I still have a Superking filter with the rusty motor but if I look hard enough, I may find one. I also still have 4 or 5 diatom filters from then and I still use an undergravel filter. Shoot me.

I use part of one of those old filters for a manifold for my UG.


Surface skimmer.


Water cooled LED.


Diatom filters


My temperature gauge from about 1920 behind the algae scrubber.

 

[Doctorgori]

I think another trend is hobby influencers and trend setters have now become “Celebrities” thanks mostly in part to YouTube and other social media...and the careful crafting of ones online persona is actually strategized.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

I think another trend is hobby influencers and trend setters have now become “Celebrities” thanks mostly in part to YouTube and other social media...and the careful crafting of ones online persona is actually strategized.

I remember last years reef a palooza in California there was a gues speaker that tackled the subject, I was extremely naive as what the topic entailed. I thought it was how to protect yourself falling victim to influencers. Yet it was short of a workshop on how to be a successful influencer. Man, did I walk away from there a lilt mad!.

Unfortunately many reefers don't think for themselves and want someone to tell them what their opinion on a subject or product should be. We have to be more vigilant to the content that is being produced.

The best way to combat this, is to hold them accountable and make sure they're not just posing as a paid advertiser for said product or idea that they're peddling

 

[burningmime]

He didn't mean to start with colonies- but to let the frags you get grow into colonies, rather than fragging off 50% as soon as it grows to get your money back

Do people do that with their display tanks? I haven't met a reefer (in person or on here) who wants to have a display tank full of tiny frags. The tanks permanently full of tiny frags have egg crate and are called "grow out systems" or "frag tanks".

The idea that people have have display/forever tanks full of tiny frags and don't want them to grow in seems like a strawman. That's just not a thing I see at all. I see lots of new tanks with tiny frags which haven't grown in. I see people fragging large mother colonies to make some money on the side. The first of these is just a reality of a new tank, and the second is either for financial reasons or because the colony is too large and shading/overgrowing other, more desirable corals (looking right at you orange monti caps).

There is no "trend" of having display tanks full of tiny frags (on purpose).