When is it safe to add a madarin?

[Breakthecycle2]

So, I had one in my biocube a long time ago. It was my first tank and I would by pods every week. He lasted awhile but then eventually died. My current tank is a 200 with 120 pounds of live rock. It was dry rock initially. I added about 6 pounds of established live rock to the DT and about 2 pounds of established rubble to my fuge section of my sump, to kick off a cycle. The tank has been up and running for almost a month. I know it's not a long time at all, however, the fuge is loaded with pods to the point when I put the light on it at night, the walls are covered in them. I have also noticed the walls of my DT are also covered. The current livestock is a Golden Pygmy Angel, a Hooded Fairy Wrasse, a redhead jawfish, mimic tank, snowbass and a Scotts Fairy Wrasse.

 

[Humblefish]

I personally would give it at least a few more months to allow the pods time to get more established. I also would take this opportunity to culture as many different types of copepods as you can, especially tisbe. Might as well throw some tiggers in there as well. Just avoid amphipods, as some species of those actually eat copepods.

 

[veselym]

I would wait another 5-6 months...you already have two wrasse which will eat pods so all 3 fish will compete

just wait to be safe and be patient

 

[SeahorseKeeper]

I would also wait at least a few months or until the tank is a year old. I would also restock the tank with pods periodically (2-3 months) after adding the mandarin.

 

[mfinn]

I would wait atleast 4-5 months, maybe even longer.
In the mean time, I would buy some pods to make sure there is a healthy breeding population of them.


AlgaeBarn | Live Copepods & Phytoplankton

 

[eatbreakfast]

I also recommend waiting a few ore months.

The wrasses you have are are fairy wrasses so they will not provide significant competition for pods.

Since you have a refugium it is unnecessary to add pods.

While certain amphipods do eat copepods, in a tank the size of yours they will not significantly impact the copepod population.

 

[reefwiser]

I would also look at Paul B 's feeder for brine shrimp. Paul keeps all the fish that eat Copepod's and does great with them. I never add mandarins in a tank till I am fully prepared to feed them. It can take me a year to get the pods at the proper level.

 

[soggytees Verified Sponsor]

+1 on waiting a few months (if your pod population stays stable, I'd probably go for it at about 3-4 months). You may need to add new pods periodically, or you may be fine just feeding the ones you have...just keep checking the fuge every so often to be sure your pod population stays solid.

 

[Breakthecycle2]

Thanks for all the input. Im kind of amazed that my entire display tank is covered in pods already. Some spots are almost pure white. That's how many are there. How could this be the case in a tank only one month old?

 

[EscMan]

ime, mandarins are not as difficult to feed as some people say. mandarins WILL eat frozen food, but only certain kinds. i have had success with frozen rotifers and cyclopse and the guy i purchased my mandarin from says that rotifers have always worked for him whenever he receives mandarins. The problem is that it is difficult to spot feed and broadcast feeding is obviously not very efficient. mandarins will also not eat it out of the water column but have to find it on a surface. At the store the display tanks are usually low flow and when he feeds rotifers the cube falls apart and falls to the bottom in one area and the mandarin goes to town. It isn't a big deal for me since i have a lot of corals, anemones, tube anemones, feather dusters and other fish that love the rotifers and cyclops so i just broadcast feed it to supplement the mandarins diet. Also in most tanks the flow and filtration will not allow the mandarin to get to this food. I turn off all filters and skimmers but leave my wavemaker on. My tank with the mandarin is only a 36 gallon.

 

[EscMan]

Also in regards to why your pod population is so large already. These populations are all about food supply and predation. if low predation and high food supply the pod population will explode until all the food is gone then the pods will go down with low predation the pods will grow exponentially thats why there are so many in so short a time. Remember that these kinds of animals lay thousands of eggs each. Population will keep going crazy till all of a sudden there isn't enough food then population will crash hard. Imo i dont see any point in waiting to add your mandarin. adding a mandarin now will increase predation and keep the pod population lower so that it isn't to high that the pods reach the point where they consume all the food and start to crash.

 

[Reikigirl]

Make sure they eat

I have one and put him in when the tank was 4 months old. One thing I did was all the LFS at the time of purchase what he was eating. The said brine shrimp so I had them to show me be would eat. He did and he is now fat and happy eating brine shrimp and copapods. He's in a 125 with a lawnmower blenny, goby, 2 clowns, a Longnose Hawkfish, an orchid dottyback, a lantern bass, and a six line wrasse.

 

[saltyphish]

Seems like part of a phase in tank maturing. My tank exploded with them during the 1-2 mth point. Now I rarely see any. My fish seem to keep them low population

Thanks for all the input. Im kind of amazed that my entire display tank is covered in pods already. Some spots are almost pure white. That's how many are there. How could this be the case in a tank only one month old?

 

[eatbreakfast]

Also in regards to why your pod population is so large already. These populations are all about food supply and predation. if low predation and high food supply the pod population will explode until all the food is gone then the pods will go down with low predation the pods will grow exponentially thats why there are so many in so short a time. Remember that these kinds of animals lay thousands of eggs each. Population will keep going crazy till all of a sudden there isn't enough food then population will crash hard. Imo i dont see any point in waiting to add your mandarin. adding a mandarin now will increase predation and keep the pod population lower so that it isn't to high that the pods reach the point where they consume all the food and start to crash.

The instability of the population at this stage is exactly why I would give it more time. In the period during and shortly after a cycle there is an abundance of detritus, microdie-off, and fluctuations of bacteria that provide a smorgasbord for copepods, but more than just copepods will consume this, leading to huge population explosions, as you have now, to times of famine, as can soon occur. Wait until your tank has reached equilibrium so that the pod population remains stable for the mandarin.

Even with a mandarin that takes prepared foods a stable pod population is necessary, as the digestive tract of mandarins is so short they require near constant feedings.

 

[JoeIII]

The answer to questions like this is almost universally "If you have to ask, it's too soon"

The same typically goes for "can I house a (or one more) tang?"

 

[AlgaeBarn]

Sounds like you (OP) have a lot of pods, definitely enough to sustain a mandarin. The key to successful mandarin keeping is to keep up pod populations using LIVE phytoplankton- aka copepod filet mignon. Using the LIVE phyto will ensure your pod populations are always healthy and continuously reproducing, thus providing constantly available food to your mandarin and other tank inhabitants. Phyto is also far less expensive than pods and this approach is far more cost effective than constantly buying pods. I suggest once you seed your tank with pods, as you already have, that you maintain with Live Phyto so that you should only need to boost or diversify your pod population with new pods every 3-5 months. I suggest this because we typically see hybrid degradation begin to have a serious effect on the F3 generation and since copepods reproduce every 1-1.5 months this time frame introduces new genetics into your ecosystem just in time to avoid a loss of fitness (overall population health) and keep things running smoothly. Let me know if you have any more questions!

Lan

 

[TimRB]

We added tigger pods about 3 times and order some pods off the net I have a 55 gallon tank. Green Mandarin, Yellow Tang and a Red Flame Angel they all are doing great and it has been over a year. We have lots of live rock and lots clumped algae and spiral looking green stringy algae. The pods must have lots of places to hide. We also have snails that lay eggs everywhere. He may be eating the pods and juvenile snails?

 

[AlgaeBarn]

We added tigger pods about 3 times and order some pods off the net I have a 55 gallon tank. Green Mandarin, Yellow Tang and a Red Flame Angel they all are doing great and it has been over a year. We have lots of live rock and lots clumped algae and spiral looking green stringy algae. The pods must have lots of places to hide. We also have snails that lay eggs everywhere. He may be eating the pods and juvenile snails?

Hi TimRB,

You are correct! Copepods love to hide in macro algae and live rock. Think of them like a tiny army of detritus scavenging inverts- a "micro clean-up crew" if you will. Their small size allows them to fit into places nothing else, even snails, can in your aquarium. Copepods love to feed on any leftover food they can find in these small crevices leaving you with a cleaner, more stable ecosystem. Your mandarin likes Tigriopus pods but he loves Tisbe pods as well and most of the time you are observing his constant hunt for these critters on your rocks! The best way to tell if your mandarin is well fed is to look at his belly. A healthy specimen will have an outwardly projecting belly while an underfed fish will have a sunken in belly. When it comes to mandarins, a beer belly is a good thing!

 

[SantaMonicaHelp]

I would wait atleast 4-5 months, maybe even longer.
In the mean time, I would buy some pods to make sure there is a healthy breeding population of them.


AlgaeBarn | Live Copepods & Phytoplankton

I agree with mfinn, maybe wait even longer than that. A year is a good time to grow thick Periphyton. You need to prepare its environment, otherwise it won't make it.

~CI

 

[4FordFamily]

When one is on divers den! Those often eat things other than solely pods.

It's a target mandarin but it will be on divers den tonight for sale. Not sure price