Which Return and Which Skimmer?

[Schgred]

am setting up a 90 gallon reef ready tank with the ADHI 30 gallon sump/refugium (picture attached). From what I have heard, the overflow gph rate on the reef ready tank is right at 700 or so.

With that, I have two options for return pumps (as I have both already), either an internal mag drive 9.5, or an external blueline aqua 30x pump. For gph they are pretty similar. What would you recommend I use? This is my first sump so any information is helpful.

Also, I have two possible skimmers to use. One is an Aquac remora, and the second is a Reef Octopus NWB-110. My inclination is to sell both and get one that is bigger. What do you recommend?

 

[Boboli]

Sicce pumps are great. I have one running 1.5 years now no problems.

Sicce Syncra Silent Multifunction Aquarium Pump. I would say use a sicce 3.0. This pump is 714 silent GPH.

As for skimmer your choices are unlimited. I have a RLSS it works really good but will not recommend it. Reef octopus is definitely a good choice.
Good luck

 

[kpiotrowski]

The mag 9.5 will really heat up the water if you submerse it, so I would use the 9.5 and run it external , and maybe run a reactor off it too. also would sell both skimmers and buy a decent cone etc.

 

[Sobo's Reef]

I had a mag 9.5 and a mag 18 submersed and never had heat come off of them. Never had a problem with em

 

[AZDesertRat]

Mag pumps run hotter than comparable pumps whether they are submerged or open air , it makes no difference. This is well documented. They have internal passages where the aquarium water circulates through to cool the motor so it doesn't matter if its submerged or not. There are much more efficient pumps today such as Sicce, Tunze, Water Blaster, Eheim and many others. You might also look at some of the very new DC powered pumps.

 

[Pete polyp]

+1 on the sicce syncra silent. I went with a 5.0 on my 40 and it can move plenty if water. Its also adjustable. You have plenty of skimmer options, I don't think either of the ones you have listed would be good enough for a 90. I was looking at the nwb 110 for my 40 gallon and went with bubble magus curve 5. This thing is a beast, but I would get the curve 7 for a 90.

 

[Pete polyp]

Mag pumps run hotter than comparable pumps whether they are submerged or open air , it makes no difference. This is well documented. They have internal passages where the aquarium water circulates through to cool the motor so it doesn't matter if its submerged or not. There are much more efficient pumps today such as Sicce, Tunze, Water Blaster, Eheim and many others. You might also look at some of the very new DC powered pumps.

From my understanding the tunze pumps are a rebranded sicce with a higher pricetag

 

[Boboli]

My favorite part about this hobby is the research before I buy a product!

 

[kpiotrowski]

Mag pumps run hotter than comparable pumps whether they are submerged or open air , it makes no difference. This is well documented. They have internal passages where the aquarium water circulates through to cool the motor so it doesn't matter if its submerged or not. There are much more efficient pumps today such as Sicce, Tunze, Water Blaster, Eheim and many others. You might also look at some of the very new DC powered pumps.

I ran a 9.5 external and you could feel the the body was warm. Externally that heat is allowed to dissipate into the air, submerged the heat dissipates to the water.

 

[Schgred]

Does anybody know much about the blueline pump?

 

[timtim13]

im in the process of a 90 build and i bought a eheim 1262 900/gph, read the reviews. They are good!

 

[kpiotrowski]

Yes the blueline is fairly popular. the ones I've heard are quiet enough for that style of pump. I picked your mag 9.5 out of the 2 because more gph and still good head pressure.

 

[Bad Company]

I run an Eheim 1262, and I love it. My return line is 1.5" PVC and this thing moves water! I use a gate valve to throttle it back a bit.

Be aware that an internal pump's power draw = heat input to the water. Simple physics. An external pump's power draw is split between the water and ambient air.

Good luck!

 

[castires]

I have a SRO 1000 INT skimmer and love it. I use a mag 3 for my return and have no heat issues, but I'm also running LEDS.

 

[Schgred]

I'm not too concerned about heat issues because the tank will be in a basement and because I'm running LED's as well.

I'd prefer the head pressure on the mag 9.5, but one question I am thinking about is the amount of water that will be running through my sump on a continual basis. I know the sump can handle it, but I will just need to get a skimmer that can match that 700 gph correct? How many skimmers can handle 700 gph? Maybe I'm not understanding that part of skimmer efficiency. Enlighten me if you can.

In addition, from what I have heard, the reef ready 90 gallon tanks are 700 gph overflow max. That isn't confirmed, but what I have read. So I would want to match the 700 gph that the tank is overflowing with a pump that is close to that 700. I know I can put a valve right after the return to dial it back a bit but if I don't need to great.

From my research on the blueline pump, I see that it is the same pump as the Pan World external pumps.

 

[AZDesertRat]

It is wise to install a valve on the discharge side of any pump so you can fine tune the flow to match the overflow.

How much headloss are you talking about?

The other issues with Mags besides heat is their power consumption 24/7/365 compared to more modern pumps which can be as little as 1/2 to 2/3 as much which really adds up in power savings over the life of the pump and their noise which can be hit and miss. I still own 3 Mags but only use them to mix new saltwater in winter months so I don't have to add a heater. I think you can find a much better pump.

If Mag pumps and others were truly an external fan cooled pump and motor run externally then heat generation would be a different story but Mags have cooling passages inside the motor so they are not air cooled in any way and the bulk of the heat is still transferred to the water passing around inside the motor cavity. Same with Eheim and Ocean Runner among many others but they are a more efficient design so draw less power and create less heat, internal or external.

 

[Pete polyp]

The sicce pump has built in adjustment to control the flow, and as far as noise it will be FAR quieter than the mag pump. Another good quality of the sicce is the reliability. I have found it better to spend a little more in the beginning than having to worry with replacements or a tank crash. As far as skimming goes, no I don't think its necessary to match the flow rate in the sump. The sump will turn over the tank several times per hour and with skimming its not necessary to catch every bit. There's debates on sump turnover rates to be most efficient. I believe in a slower sump turnover around 5x per hour to give the equipment time to do its thing.

 

[kpiotrowski]

so now I'm thinking I'm crazy, right. I used 2 mag 9.5 on this tank ( left and right), one for skimmer and one for return and I could feel the heat on the ceramic filled plastic casing. I originally ran them submerged and specifically had a sump re-worked to run them external because of the heat issue. The only mag drive I run external on my 300g is a mag 7 for the chiller pump. I just went and took at temp of the ambient air and it was 61.9, I used a stick to touch the thermometer to the mag 7 case and got 87.8. Just my observation. I know that the impeller on this design is internally cooled and lubricated by water but I have not heard of network of channels such as in an liquid cooled engine block, and even so engine blocks get hot despite being liquid cooled.

another way to think about it is where and why the heat is being produced,and I would tend to believe its not all from friction caused by the rotation of the impeller. It is an electric motor and the byproduct of using electrical energy is heat. my theory on that anyhow. all I know for sure is ran external I can fell the heat.

 

[Schgred]

So the question. If you had to choose either the blueline 40 or the mag drive 9.5 as the return pump, what would you choose?

 

[kpiotrowski]

I'm not too concerned about heat issues because the tank will be in a basement and because I'm running LED's as well.

I'd prefer the head pressure on the mag 9.5, but one question I am thinking about is the amount of water that will be running through my sump on a continual basis. I know the sump can handle it, but I will just need to get a skimmer that can match that 700 gph correct? How many skimmers can handle 700 gph? Maybe I'm not understanding that part of skimmer efficiency. Enlighten me if you can.

In addition, from what I have heard, the reef ready 90 gallon tanks are 700 gph overflow max. That isn't confirmed, but what I have read. So I would want to match the 700 gph that the tank is overflowing with a pump that is close to that 700. I know I can put a valve right after the return to dial it back a bit but if I don't need to great.

From my research on the blueline pump, I see that it is the same pump as the Pan World external pumps.

I don't know where this misconception of needing to match your skimmer output to the return flow started but this isn't the first time I've heard it. it is simply not true. I have a 2000gph return and my sro5000ext only flows 600 gph good luck finding a non commercial skimmer that flows 2000gph! so am I too dial back my return flow to 600gph? NO! look at it like this, your sump is the tanks processing center. the Tank is where everything is going on and breaking down. You want to get as much of that dirty display tank water down to your sump where it can be processed. The most efficient place for a skimmer is sitting in as dirty as water as possible, so get that skimmer all the dirty tank water you can!