Why a fallow period will sometimes fail

[Shooter6]

CI - is cryptcaryon irritans (CI) - Ich. There is no such thing (per se) as 'ich' in a saltwater tank - which is the abbreviation for a freshwater organism (Ichthyophthirius multifiliis).

I believe everyone uses the abbreviations ich no ic. In my 34 years of reef keeping ive not seen anyone use ic that I can recall.

Yes they are 2 different parasites. But again moving rocks is not very likely to release the dormant egg case into aerobic water causing an outbreak. An outbreak after moving rocks is caused by 3 issues. 1st a system that is already infected, 2nd the stress caused by moving the rocks around stresses the fish, who are already fighting the parasites attacking them
That stress weakens the immune system enough for the parasites to gain an advantage. The rest of the system was not ich free, and only areas under the rocks were infected.

 

[MnFish1]

I believe everyone uses the abbreviations ich no ic. In my 34 years of reef keeping ive not seen anyone use ic that I can recall.

Yes they are 2 different parasites. But again moving rocks is not very likely to release the dormant egg case into aerobic water causing an outbreak. An outbreak after moving rocks is caused by 3 issues. 1st a system that is already infected, 2nd the stress caused by moving the rocks around stresses the fish, who are already fighting the parasites attacking them
That stress weakens the immune system enough for the parasites to gain an advantage. The rest of the system was not ich free, and only areas under the rocks were infected.

I think you mean 'CI' not ic. And - there is no way to know - whether what you're saying is true or false (or whether the OP is true or false). The bottom line - if someone is concened about anaerobic areas being a (IMHO - VERY rare) source of infection - the last place to look is a canister filter

 

[Shooter6]

I think you mean 'CI' not ic. And - there is no way to know - whether what you're saying is true or false (or whether the OP is true or false). The bottom line - if someone is concened about anaerobic areas being a (IMHO - VERY rare) source of infection - the last place to look is a canister filter

Yes ci is what I ment. That's how unusual that abbreviation is lol.

I also agree that the anaerobic risk is minimal.

I was clarifying the theory behind the canister filter being a risk and why it's recommended to be avoided.

That is what was asked right?

 

[moncheng]

Well I was asking more of hang on back filter not the canister. But I get your guys points. Sometime you learn more from a polite argument, I definitely pick up a thing or two from your discussion. Thanks a lot guys

 

[MnFish1]

Well I was asking more of hang on back filter not the canister. But I get your guys points. Sometime you learn more from a polite argument, I definitely pick up a thing or two from your discussion. Thanks a lot guys

I think that if you read the very first post in the thread it answers your original question. But - the quote below should help you. If you have another option - as it said in the first post in the thread - you could probably clean it with bleach, etc. Here is a quote from the first post in thread (PS - I'm not sure that your filter is considered an 'enclosed filter':

"
So what can you do to eliminate low oxygen areas of your DT during a fallow period?

1. Take any canister or enclosed filters offline, and sterilize them with bleach. Without fish to foul the water, your DT will be fine with just rock/sand for filtration and good water circulation.
2. Speaking of circulation, crank up those pumps for maximum flow & gas exchange throughout the aquarium. (Don't forget to add a pump down in the sump.)
3. Blow out your rocks (using a powerhead) and vacuum the sand during water changes whilst going fallow. This will "stir things up" and provide free oxygen to those areas.

How can I setup my Display Tank to be "hypoxic proof" just in case I ever have to go fallow?

1. Only use filtration with an open top (like a sump), and avoid canister filters and other filters which may contain anaerobic regions. If needed, take these offline if ever having to go fallow.
2. Use just a light layer of sand; the deeper it is the more likely tomonts can get "trapped" down under there.
3. Never have sand out of reach (i.e. under a rock) in case you need to vacuum it during a fallow period.
4. Only use very porous rock which will allow plenty of flow (and oxygen) to pass through."

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Just weighing in with my opinion here:

Cryptocaryon tomonts are not motile (the prototomont has limited mobility for a few hours). They are not going to move into anaerobic areas on their own. Indeed, in the study that described this, it was done experimentally. Hypoxic conditions in aquariums exist only where water flow is restricted - like tiny channels in live rock. Ich tomonts are too large to become encysted in those locations.

Regarding abbreviations - that is a big issue here. People use "CP" for Copper Power or Chloroquine Phosphate. Also common is using the word salinity when they are measuring specific gravity.

"Ich" is almost universally used here for Cryptocaryon irritans. However, as pointed out, it really is not "ich". On Reef Central, years ago, they would call it "Crypto" - that always bugged me. I would call it "Crypt" which aligned well with using "Brook" for Brooklynella.

Jay

 

[MnFish1]

Just weighing in with my opinion here:

Cryptocaryon tomonts are not motile (the prototomont has limited mobility for a few hours). They are not going to move into anaerobic areas on their own. Indeed, in the study that described this, it was done experimentally. Hypoxic conditions in aquariums exist only where water flow is restricted - like tiny channels in live rock. Ich tomonts are too large to become encysted in those locations.

Regarding abbreviations - that is a big issue here. People use "CP" for Copper Power or Chloroquine Phosphate. Also common is using the word salinity when they are measuring specific gravity.

"Ich" is almost universally used here for Cryptocaryon irritans. However, as pointed out, it really is not "ich". On Reef Central, years ago, they would call it "Crypto" - that always bugged me. I would call it "Crypt" which aligned well with using "Brook" for Brooklynella.

Jay

I use CI - or ich - If I type ich on my computer it sometimes changes it to another word (for unclear reasons lol). A lot of times I just type out cryptocaryon (but now that is also changed to a different word). And - I checked out the 'R2R abbreviation list - and CI was not listed

 

[Shooter6]

Well I was asking more of hang on back filter not the canister. But I get your guys points. Sometime you learn more from a polite argument, I definitely pick up a thing or two from your discussion. Thanks a lot guys

What kind of filtration does it currently have

Just weighing in with my opinion here:

Cryptocaryon tomonts are not motile (the prototomont has limited mobility for a few hours). They are not going to move into anaerobic areas on their own. Indeed, in the study that described this, it was done experimentally. Hypoxic conditions in aquariums exist only where water flow is restricted - like tiny channels in live rock. Ich tomonts are too large to become encysted in those locations.

Regarding abbreviations - that is a big issue here. People use "CP" for Copper Power or Chloroquine Phosphate. Also common is using the word salinity when they are measuring specific gravity.

"Ich" is almost universally used here for Cryptocaryon irritans. However, as pointed out, it really is not "ich". On Reef Central, years ago, they would call it "Crypto" - that always bugged me. I would call it "Crypt" which aligned well with using "Brook" for Brooklynella.

Jay

Speaking of the theory.
The theory was there is a slight chance of the egg case (cyst) to get sucked up into a canister filter, or other type for that matter, or sink into a deep sandbed, falling through the gaps in sand particles in this case.

Ending up in an anaerobic area, causing them to go dormant. Then later be disturbed and moving back to an aerobic area causing a hatching and reinvention after a fallow period.

That was the 1 in a million what fallow could fail.

Same with the previous 76 days now being extended to 90+ since there's been some signs of at least 1 strain living past the 76 days.

Please understand I'm not trying to diminish anything you said, only adding to it.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

What kind of filtration does it currently have

Speaking of the theory.
The theory was there is a slight chance of the egg case (cyst) to get sucked up into a canister filter, or other type for that matter, or sink into a deep sandbed, falling through the gaps in sand particles in this case.

Ending up in an anaerobic area, causing them to go dormant. Then later be disturbed and moving back to an aerobic area causing a hatching and reinvention after a fallow period.

That was the 1 in a million what fallow could fail.

Same with the previous 76 days now being extended to 90+ since there's been some signs of at least 1 strain living past the 76 days.

Please understand I'm not trying to diminish anything you said, only adding to it.

I guess the point I was making is that for a hollow to form that goes anaerobic, it needs to have a very tiny channel out to the main tank, else it will remain oxygenated through simple diffusion. The size of the tomonts is relatively large, therefore, they would not be able to fall into a space that would become anaerobic. In the study, they dropped the dissolved oxygen level of the whole tank to 24% saturation.

Jay