Why do Ricordea bleach (in my tank)?

[Orm Embar]

I love Ricordea Yumas, and as such like to add more to my tank (I have several that appear to be doing fine). Unfortunately, new Yuma additions tend to bleach after a few days, even when placed in shade under rocks so they get no direct lighting at all (some indirect light) from a Hydra 26 HD at 64 watts/19 500 K - UV/violet/royal/blue at 100%, green/red/white at 20%). I should add that acclimation is on; UV is really at around 88%, and royal/blue are at 95% each - in a month, all will be back to 100%. I'd cut UV back 50% initially, and still had the issue.

Other corals/zoanthids/LPS all seem to be fine; it's just Ricordea Yumas that do this. I always thought that it was excessive light (I tried cutting my UV to 50% and my overall light output to 80% of max, but bleaching still happened even in shade under shelf rock). Nitrates and phosphates are generally 0.4-0.5 and 0.25 respectively, alkalinity usually 7.5-8.5 (running high in last week or so, around 10 - letting it drift down).

Am I still using too much light for Ricordea that haven't adapted? How long do they need to adapt for? Or am I barking up the wrong tree thinking that it's all about light (esp. UV) intensity since they bleach even under shelf rock?

Lowering white light on the advice of a fellow reefer who grows numerous frags didn't seem to fix the problem.

Tank details:
Red Sea Reefer 170, AI Hydra HD 26
Chaeto refugium, skimmerless
Other corals fine (chalices and trumpets and zoanthids and duncans generally fine)

 

[James M]

Can u post pics

 

[Orm Embar]

Can u post pics

Unfortunately, I don't have pics; the Ricordea turn white or almost completely white after 2-4 days, and then shrivel up and die. I believe that they've expelled their zooxanthellae (bleached).

 

[mtraylor]

I would think the issue could be something in your water quality. Meaning that you may have something that is fluctuating too much. I would check the Alk and Temp in 4 hour increments throughout the day and see how much fluctuation you have.
Also what are your other parms? I used to have the same issue years ago, and it wasn't till I got the system stable that I could keep them. That and nuking them real good after I got them because of all the pests they had on them.

PARMS?
Calcium
Magnesium

 

[mcarroll]

I tried cutting my UV to 50% and my overall light output to 80% of max, but bleaching still happened even in shade under shelf rock). Nitrates and phosphates are generally 0.4-0.5 and 0.25 respectively, alkalinity usually 7.5-8.5 (running high in last week or so, around 10 - letting it drift down).

Check this post out:
https://reefsuccess.com/2018/08/27/...-ultrastructure-of-symbiotic-dinoflagellates/

Stop whatever you're doing to keep nutrient levels so low (especially phosphate) and you should be fine going forward.

 

[Orm Embar]

Check this post out:
https://reefsuccess.com/2018/08/27/...-ultrastructure-of-symbiotic-dinoflagellates/

Stop whatever you're doing to keep nutrient levels so low (especially phosphate) and you should be fine going forward.

I'll have to prune some chaeto then; I just run chaeto and live rock/sand. Thanks for the link

 

[Orm Embar]

Well, I tried something yesterday (after buying 2 very nice Ricordea yumas that I really didn't want to pass up on) - since I wasn't sure if it was a light issue or a low nitrate/phosphate issue, I placed 1 of the yumas in a top corner of the tank where corals typically receive very little light. I placed the other in my sump in a low light corner, which just has a 36w grow bulb. Lastly, I reduced my UV by 100%. I went this route as I found that the guy I bought the yumas from runs his lights at a much lower intensity than I do (like 80-90% lower! AI Primes at 5 watts where I'm running my AI Hydra HD at 55 watts).

So far, no bleaching at all. Yumas are expanding when the lights come on, no zooxanthellae expulsion.

If this works, then I think that it definitely was the UV. If so, it will gradually increase over the next 4 months to 100% but I may go less.

 

[mcarroll]

Nice!

Light / Phosphate isn't an either or....it's both. Increased light creates increased demand for P. Reducing UV reduces one of the main needs for P (cellular repair).

There's also the factor of light shock – if any of the pieces that have bleached went through a similar 80-90% increase in light intensity, bleaching would be expected.

If you roll light shock in with phosphate limitation it's a nasty combo.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Mine does not like bright light or high current. I also feed them every 2-3 days

 

[hart24601]

Surprised about the UV in particular since there are quite a few other threads saying how LEDs stink and one big reason is not enough UV, haha.

It might be that the added intensity of that channel pushed them over the top and caused bleaching. Just personally I will not buy LED fixtures without some near UV in them. I wouldn't blame the UV channel, but just general overillumination in this case. I bet if you dropped the blue, DB or violet channels to 0 you would experience the same results since UV in LED lights are not really powerhouses but I am happy the coral is doing well!!

 

[vetteguy53081]

Surprised about the UV in particular since there are quite a few other threads saying how LEDs stink and one big reason is not enough UV, haha.

It might be that the added intensity of that channel pushed them over the top and caused bleaching. Just personally I will not buy LED fixtures without some near UV in them. I wouldn't blame the UV channel, but just general overillumination in this case. I bet if you dropped the blue, DB or violet channels to 0 you would experience the same results since UV in LED lights are not really powerhouses but I am happy the coral is doing well!!

You are pretty much on the right track. UV will affect some specimens while having No effect on others. I think bringing the purple and whites down a little will have positive impact

 

[hart24601]

You are pretty much on the right track. UV will affect some specimens while having No effect on others. I think bringing the purple and whites down a little will have positive impact

It's interesting if UV is problematic to some species those must be almost impossible to keep under MH as even with glass to reduce UV they put out a great deal of it.

 

[vetteguy53081]

It's interesting if UV is problematic to some species those must be almost impossible to keep under MH as even with glass to reduce UV they put out a great deal of it.

That only with certain specimens. Factors that affect coral is UV, PAR, wattage, hours of light provided and distance from light to the tank itself.

 

[Orm Embar]

Ricordea still looking normal with no bleaching, including ones in main tank and sump. Yay!

 

[Steve1500]

I love Ricordea Yumas, and as such like to add more to my tank (I have several that appear to be doing fine). Unfortunately, new Yuma additions tend to bleach after a few days, even when placed in shade under rocks so they get no direct lighting at all (some indirect light) from a Hydra 26 HD at 64 watts/19 500 K - UV/violet/royal/blue at 100%, green/red/white at 20%). I should add that acclimation is on; UV is really at around 88%, and royal/blue are at 95% each - in a month, all will be back to 100%. I'd cut UV back 50% initially, and still had the issue.

Other corals/zoanthids/LPS all seem to be fine; it's just Ricordea Yumas that do this. I always thought that it was excessive light (I tried cutting my UV to 50% and my overall light output to 80% of max, but bleaching still happened even in shade under shelf rock). Nitrates and phosphates are generally 0.4-0.5 and 0.25 respectively, alkalinity usually 7.5-8.5 (running high in last week or so, around 10 - letting it drift down).

Am I still using too much light for Ricordea that haven't adapted? How long do they need to adapt for? Or am I barking up the wrong tree thinking that it's all about light (esp. UV) intensity since they bleach even under shelf rock?

Lowering white light on the advice of a fellow reefer who grows numerous frags didn't seem to fix the problem.

Tank details:
Red Sea Reefer 170, AI Hydra HD 26
Chaeto refugium, skimmerless
Other corals fine (chalices and trumpets and zoanthids and duncans generally fine)

Nitrates are low at .4-.5. Most softies do better with 5-20 ppm. Phosphate at .25 is a bit high. Try .03. My Yuma’s also bleached and when I brought up my nutrients (N and P) they came back. Thought they were dead but they survived and thrived.