Would this pipe work for pairing clown & RBTA?

[burden216]

i played videos on my phone for them to watch i just put a clown anemone video on and let them watch it and i also would feed the tank over top of anemone and it took little time but now thats the only place they stay

 

[NemoAddict]

Love it!

 

[Logan27]

That "peace agreement" decides who's the boy and who's the girl [emoji4] just like any other prison.

LOL Exactly. Then they laid eggs!

 

[davocean]

In the wild, mother clownfish usually lay their eggs on rocks right at the base of their anemone. From day one the babies recognize the anemone as home.

Our mass-produced, captive bred babies don't have this luxury. The first things the see are flowerpots, powerheads and overflows. This is why it's so difficult to get them into an anemone, it's no longer natural for them. Many captive bred clownfish will never host an anemone but will just hang out in a corner of the tank.
]

This is probably the most common but incorrect statement I see all too often, and it's simply not true.
The instinct is still very much there, just like how many dogs will walk a circle to "lay down the grass" that is not there before they lay down, whether they have ever even seen grass or not, and same rides true for the clowns.

We have been seeing large numbers of clowns that refused to accept a host, actually accept a host pretty much immediately when they are given the RIGHT host, meaning the same species they would be found in the wild.

Tank bred or wild caught, makes no difference, given the proper species of anemone they will accept it as host pretty much right away.

Most reef sites now have a sticky posted as to which anemones host which clowns naturally as they would be found in the wild for this very reason, or there is a book out by Fautin and Allen, "Anemone fishes and their host sea anemone's" which pretty much has the most up to date and accurate list.

 

[wkscott]

This is probably the most common but incorrect statement I see all too often, and it's simply not true.
The instinct is still very much there, just like how many dogs will walk a circle to "lay down the grass" that is not there before they lay down, whether they have ever even seen grass or not, and same rides true for the clowns.

We have been seeing large numbers of clowns that refused to accept a host, actually accept a host pretty much immediately when they are given the RIGHT host, meaning the same species they would be found in the wild.

Tank bred or wild caught, makes no difference, given the proper species of anemone they will accept it as host pretty much right away.

Most reef sites now have a sticky posted as to which anemones host which clowns naturally as they would be found in the wild for this very reason, or there is a book out by Fautin and Allen, "Anemone fishes and their host sea anemone's" which pretty much has the most up to date and accurate list.

Cite your references.

 

[Slot]

This is probably the most common but incorrect statement I see all too often, and it's simply not true.
The instinct is still very much there, just like how many dogs will walk a circle to "lay down the grass" that is not there before they lay down, whether they have ever even seen grass or not, and same rides true for the clowns.

We have been seeing large numbers of clowns that refused to accept a host, actually accept a host pretty much immediately when they are given the RIGHT host, meaning the same species they would be found in the wild.

Tank bred or wild caught, makes no difference, given the proper species of anemone they will accept it as host pretty much right away.

Most reef sites now have a sticky posted as to which anemones host which clowns naturally as they would be found in the wild for this very reason, or there is a book out by Fautin and Allen, "Anemone fishes and their host sea anemone's" which pretty much has the most up to date and accurate list.

+1

 

[Liquid360]

http://www.fishlore.com/clownfishanemonechart.htm

Or

 

[Liquid360]

Obviously different sources and conflicting info [emoji4]

 

[davocean]

Cite your references.

Isn't that what I did on posting Fautin and Allens book?

Add to that 31 years of keeping sea anemone's personally and years of observation on the clown nem forums, or the sticky's they now post on this subject.

 

[Liquid360]

I have a solid 30yrs as well and haven't ever had a pair of clowns that didn't eventually end up being hosted by any type of hosting Anemone. Never. Regardless of clown or nem. VERY little about our microecosystem is "natural".

 

[davocean]

I have a solid 30yrs as well and haven't ever had a pair of clowns that didn't eventually end up being hosted by any type of hosting Anemone. Never. Regardless of clown or nem. VERY little about our microecosystem is "natural".

Well I see this as continued validation that the instinct is still very much there, and yes many will accept a non natural host eventually, but sometimes that takes a very long time.

On "that other site" where I've spent way too much time on, especially in the clown nem forum, so far every time someone has asked for tips because their clown is not accepting a host, and we suggest a natural match, hosting has been pretty much immediate.
It's pretty obvious their instinct is drawing them to their natural host match more than anything else.

 

[TheLadyCrash]

Took my clowns about 6 months before they wanted anything to do with my rbta but then they would only leave it to eat. Unfortunately there was an unfortunate aquascaping incident involving the anemone having his foot on 2 rocks which I didn't notice.

 

[JaimeAdams]

I am in the camp that clownfish are many generations removed from nature. I agree that any clownfish may eventually host, but I do not believe that they always do even given their "natural" anemone choice.

I agree that captive produced livestock obviously still has some natural instincts such as the dog example above. I do not think the same holds true for lets say fear of humans or hosting an anemone. How much of this is instinctual verse conditioning? My pair of black and white clowns for example have been in a tank with anemones for 5+ years and still don't move far from their "hosted" rock ledge. I can also stick my hand in the tank and pick them up. The 100s of clowns that we sell at the store that I work see the human hand as a feeding device and show zero fear of humans while I stick my hand in any tank and any other fish is ducking for cover. Granted there are also display tanks and my home tank that I feed by hand and have all of the fish "conditioned" to eat from my hand.

When we talk about 20 or 30 or 40 years of experience with anemones and clownfish I applaud that type of experience and commitment, but how long and how many generations removed where percs or ocellaris 10 or 20 years ago compared to today? I believe that it is the same with the domestication of any animal. National Geographic had a good article awhile back regarding the genes of domestication and the changes of the experimental animals over generations. It's an easy google. 30 years ago 99% of the "normal" clowns were wild caught and either had the instincts or the conditioning to jump into an anemone. It is obvious given the empirical data gathered from peoples experiences that these "modern" clowns do not have the same "conditioning" or "instincts" that our clowns even a decade ago had.

 

[davocean]

I do agree w/ some of what you say here, absolutely tank bred clowns seem more passive, and I agree that is largely because they grew up knowing the hand, and not in the wild fighting or defending their territory.

As for your comment on the number of people's experiences w/ hosting, or rather not hosting it's pretty easy for me to look back on most of those comments and see that the most common of these experiences involves the most popular clowns sold or kept, "Nemos", occs or percs, and the most commonly kept anemone, a BTA as they are so easy to obtain and are more forgiving in care needs so often are the go to, and they are not a natural match to occs or percs, and almost every post I've seen of "why do my clowns not take my anemone as a host" seems to be that pairing.

After many years spent in the anemone forum on that other site that's been around longer, seeing these types of posts all too often, I can't recall anyone given the advice to switch to a natural host anemone where clowns that ignored that BTA for months, suddenly dives in to their natural match, almost always immediately.

Going by the number of these experiences I've seen over the years it seems a no brainer to me what the real issue is, some clowns will accept a non natural host, some not, but given a natural host seems to come w/ successful hosting pretty much every time from what I've witnessed, and experienced.

 

[Zack K]

http://www.fishlore.com/clownfishanemonechart.htm

Or

At this moment you realize..... Clarkii's are anemone ******