Wrasse & Tang Assistants Please

Reefer5640 · Nov 20, 2018

So I just got a new order of fish from LA which are in QT. Two of them are having some issues.

The first is the Carpenters Flasher Wrasse, he is eating fine and when he swims he seems fine but when hovers he has a hard time hovering or staying steady in one place. It’s like he bounces up and down slightly. I haven’t noticed any physical damage and when he swims around he seems fine. It’s just when he hovers. He does have white stringy poo but shows no other signs of any other issues like a parasite of some sort that I can tell. I’m feeding with kannaplex and metro in his food and I have dosed the tank with epson salt assuming it’s a swim bladder issue. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I’ll work on getting a video posted but I’ve never done it before so we might have to go off my description for now...

The Naso Tang showed up with a pimple on his side (or pest?) but it seems to be going down. His problem is he is being very picky with eating and I’m not 100% sure he’s eaten anything since he’s been here. He just spits whatever food he attempts right back out. He is starting to get pretty thin and I have tried feeding him nori, frozen brine/mysis/bloodworms/cyclops, pellets veggie & meaty. All soaked in garlic and not. I don’t know if he’s just intimidated or if he’s sick. Thanks for any advise.

Both fish are housed in a ten gallon QT with two other tank mates (fairy wrasse & niger trigger) all are getting along just fine.

Sizes
Flasher wrasse- 3”
Naso tang- 2”
Fairy wrasse- 3”
Niger trigger- 2”

I have a lot of QT tanks so I can try bigger or separate housing if it’s thought to be truly necessary. I’m doing the tank transfer method so I’d like to keep it to as few tanks as possible but whatever is best for the fish...

Here is when I got him

Here’s 3-4 days later, can’t see the white bulb anymore...

EmdeReef · Nov 20, 2018

Can you post a video of the wrasse?

Re. the tang could've been an injury, I would keep observing for any other signs. He does look a bit skinny in the 3rd pic, might want to up the feeding. Is that discoloration above the eye or just the way the pic looks?

Reefer5640 · Nov 20, 2018

I think it’s just the way the pic looks. I don’t know that upping the feeding will help the tang. He just won’t anything no mater how much I put in there. He’s in a QT so I don’t want to overload the tank and up my ammonia. I’ve been feeding small amounts throughout the day so there’s constant fresh food and he’ll just spit it right out. Any thoughts as to how to get him to swallow the food?

I’ll do what I can to post a video, but I’ve never done it before so it may take me a bit... thanks for the reply.

Billldg · Nov 20, 2018

@HotRocks
@4FordFamily

Fudsey · Nov 20, 2018

Have you tried any nori for the Naso?

#reefsquad

Reefer5640 · Nov 20, 2018

Thanks billldg

Reefer5640 · Nov 20, 2018

Fudsey said:
Have you tried any nori for the Naso?

#reefsquad

Yes I have. As mentioned above here is a list of what I’ve fed/feed nori, frozen brine/mysis/bloodworms/cyclops, pellets veggie & meaty. I also feed an herbivores frozen blend that has nori and sprulina mixed with brine, mysis, plankton, and stuff like that. He seems to be the most interested in that but just doesn’t swallow the food... I had a white cheek that was acting this way and as soon as I separated him from the rest of the QT mates he started doing better. With that being said I’ve isolated the naso so hopefully he feels more comfortable to eat.

HotRocks · Nov 20, 2018

Reefer5640 said:
Yes I have. As mentioned above here is a list of what I’ve fed/feed nori, frozen brine/mysis/bloodworms/cyclops, pellets veggie & meaty. I also feed an herbivores frozen blend that has nori and sprulina mixed with brine, mysis, plankton, and stuff like that. He seems to be the most interested in that but just doesn’t swallow the food... I had a white cheek that was acting this way and as soon as I separated him from the rest of the QT mates he started doing better. With that being said I’ve isolated the naso so hopefully he feels more comfortable to eat.

For the wrasse you will have better luck in eradicating intestinal parasites/worms feeding Metroplex or GC + Focus instead of Kanaplex.
I would recommend a larger QT for sure as you mentioned you had additional tanks (I personally wouldn't QT any tang in less than a 40B, 55 is preferable).
I would also recommend a FW dip on the naso to see if anything comes off of the fish. This could have just been an injury as suggested as it seems to be healing with time.
I know this sounds crazy have you offered the Naso any Flake? Sometimes tangs will eat green flake in QT before they will eat frozen.
Lastly, I would use copper or CP instead of TTM. Velvet is just to common today for taking a chance with TTM, IMO.

EmdeReef · Nov 20, 2018

Reefer5640 said:
Yes I have. As mentioned above here is a list of what I’ve fed/feed nori, frozen brine/mysis/bloodworms/cyclops, pellets veggie & meaty. I also feed an herbivores frozen blend that has nori and sprulina mixed with brine, mysis, plankton, and stuff like that. He seems to be the most interested in that but just doesn’t swallow the food... I had a white cheek that was acting this way and as soon as I separated him from the rest of the QT mates he started doing better. With that being said I’ve isolated the naso so hopefully he feels more comfortable to eat.

Are you treating the tank with anything?

It's a trial and error with food until you find something. Unfortunately, sometimes nothing works. Internal parasites are a possibility though if he won't eat then your only choice is to treat the tank which is less effective.
I'd try spirulina, soak food in garlic, also if you happen to have any live gracilaria can attach it to a piece of rock and try. I've also had good luck with masstick paste although have tried it more on picky angels.

Reefer5640 · Nov 20, 2018

HotRocks said:
For the wrasse you will have better luck in eradicating intestinal parasites/worms feeding Metroplex or GC + Focus instead of Kanaplex.
I would recommend a larger QT for sure as you mentioned you had additional tanks (I personally wouldn't QT any tang in less than a 40B, 55 is preferable).
I would also recommend a FW dip on the naso to see if anything comes off of the fish. This could have just been an injury as suggested as it seems to be healing with time.
I know this sounds crazy have you offered the Naso any Flake? Sometimes tangs will eat green flake in QT before they will eat frozen.
Lastly, I would use copper or CP instead of TTM. Velvet is just to common today for taking a chance with TTM, IMO.

So I ended up moving him to his own tank last light after writing the post. I am actually adding metro and kanaplex to the food with focus together. I’ll FW dip tonight when I get home. Are you saying to ditch the kannaplex and only treat with metro+focus? I Have tried all three methods of QT (TT, copper, & hypo) I used to do copersafe exclusively but have moved more towards the TT +prazi and then 1-2 weeks observation. Would velvet not show any signs during this time? I don’t have a lot of experience with marine velvet? I’d sure hate to have to pull everything out of my DT and go through the fallow period and all that again...

EmdeReef said:
Are you treating the tank with anything?

It's a trial and error with food until you find something. Unfortunately, sometimes nothing works. Internal parasites are a possibility though if he won't eat then your only choice is to treat the tank which is less effective.
I'd try spirulina, soak food in garlic, also if you happen to have any live gracilaria can attach it to a piece of rock and try. I've also had good luck with masstick paste although have tried it more on picky angels.

Right now I’m only treating the water column with epson salt (feeding kannaplex+metro+focus). I usually treat with prazi during TT but I’m holding off due to the wrasse and his potential swim bladder issue (wasn’t too sure about adding epson salt and Prazi at the same time...?) Haven’t tried flake, none of my fish eat it but I have some so I’ll try it. I don’t have any live gracilaria or masstick but I do have some caulerpa I can through in there. That masstick is awesome and Ive been meaning to get some for my wrasses and anthias.

Thank you both for your input.

HotRocks · Nov 20, 2018

Reefer5640 said:
So I ended up moving him to his own tank last light after writing the post. I am actually adding metro and kanaplex to the food with focus together. I’ll FW dip tonight when I get home. Are you saying to ditch the kannaplex and only treat with metro+focus? I Have tried all three methods of QT (TT, copper, & hypo) I used to do copersafe exclusively but have moved more towards the TT +prazi and then 1-2 weeks observation. Would velvet not show any signs during this time? I don’t have a lot of experience with marine velvet? I’d sure hate to have to pull everything out of my DT and go through the fallow period and all that again...

Right now I’m only treating the water column with epson salt (feeding kannaplex+metro+focus). I usually treat with prazi during TT but I’m holding off due to the wrasse and his potential swim bladder issue (wasn’t too sure about adding epson salt and Prazi at the same time...?) Haven’t tried flake, none of my fish eat it but I have some so I’ll try it. I don’t have any live gracilaria or masstick but I do have some caulerpa I can through in there. That masstick is awesome and Ive been meaning to get some for my wrasses and anthias.

Thank you both for your input.

I would ditch the Kanaplex yes. I don't ever feed it. I only dose it in the water column (for external bacterial infections).

Velvet would typically show up yes. Some fish are more succeptable than others. Also During TTM you may not see it show up, as the TTM would likely keep you from seeing it as you would still Dodge most free swimmers, just not all. All it takes is one trophont to slip through on a single fish.

4FordFamily · Nov 20, 2018

Small naso tangs are often very fragile and can be tough to get to eat. I don’t see any obvious symptoms of disease but the photos make it tough to tell. That fish is quite emaciated, I’d rubber band nori to a rock and see if that helps. Often tangs pick at red nori before regular nori, as well.

If you’re doing TTM my concern is ammonia. Flasher wrasse and juvenile naso tangs are quite sensitive to it. This could be the root of your issues. In addition, TTM is very stressful for he fish.

The wrasse sounds like it has a spinal injury, but a video could confirm.

rkpetersen · Nov 20, 2018

You might try wetting the nori with some Selcon rather than garlic before putting it in the tank on a clip or rock. I'd also try whatever live macroalgae I could get my hands on.

Another thought would be to try live brine if you have an LFS in the area that stocks it. Not particularly nutritious but just to get him eating.

HotRocks · Nov 20, 2018

rkpetersen said:
You might try wetting the nori with some Selcon rather than garlic before putting it in the tank on a clip or rock. I'd also try whatever live macroalgae I could get my hands on.

Another thought would be to try live brine if you have an LFS in the area that stocks it. Not particularly nutritious but just to get him eating.

This is great for Kickstarting^^^^^ + live blackworms.